Stuck, Spectra G or Predator Gasser???? (Edit-Or Bergen)

[SGUNN911]

Moved this down from the MA Gas Section for more input:

I have been comparing these two helis for a little while now, and have a large group encouraging me to go with the Predator, and another says the Spectra is the only way to go.

I have money in hand ready to go, but some of the topics ive read on BOTH about major problems have me an edge.

I know Aggrav8 (other site) from work I did for him, and he is pushing the Predator, of course. The Spectra is just sooooo pretty, and I love my Fury...

If I spend that kind of money on a new product, I would kind of appreciate it if it did not break apart in mid air through the first few flights....

I AM LOOKING FOR A USED ONE AS WELL, so if you or a friend is selling a built, tested and working properly one of the two helis let me know.

Thanks guys!!

[WillJames]

You may also want to consider the Bergen Gas machine. It is proven far longer than the Spectra or Predator. The Spectra, (I have owned 2 of them, as well as a couple Bergen Gas machines and 2 MA Gas SE's) is gonna fly absolutely the most like your Fury hands down. The other Gas machines fly good but not like the G/fury IMHO. As for maintenance.... Not sure, all gas machines seem to need a lot more P maintenance than glow machines. The Gas motors also vary a lot in vibration levels and performance, so if you get a good one from the get-go youa re golden, if you get a vibrator, you are in for all sorts of trouble potentially. Gas motors can put out some high frewuency vibs that will literally cause your heli to explode if you don't catch the warning signs. You CANNOT see the high frequency vibs. The way you can tell you have them is by chekcign the screws and bolts that hold your machine together. Also pay close attention to where metal meets plastic. If you ahve high freq vibs, you can usually see the plastic look like it is melting sometimes at these unions.

All that said, and it is REAL, the gas machines will either just click with you, or you will not enjoy them, so buying a "good" used one if you can find it is a safe way to get your first gas machine for sure. As you have figured out with your research, it is a little more complicated than buying a glow machine. :DOH Only downside of buying used is that it is vry important to see how the gas machines go together when you build them so you can more easily spot trouble before it results in a crash.

I have no experience withthe Century Gas machine, other than wanting to fly Rodney's. I have known Bill Meador for years and I really respect him. Looks like the Century gas machine is definitely coming into its own from seeing Rodney's fly at the events lately.... I don't really know what to say here other than PM Rodney and he will tell you the real deal with his gasser.

[Rudy]

I have a Predator SE Gasser my self It flys real nice and other then some tail control rod problems it has held up very well. I attend a lot of events and have seen lot's of Predator gassers flying around. I have flown several my self. I have seen several Bergen gassers fly as well. Just a guess I would say Predator out number the Bergens aleast 5 to 1.

The down side to Century is customer support, they are hard to understand on the phone and don't alway get their act together real well. The fact that Ricks carrys Century parts was a real plus for me.

Bergen, the only down side is cost. Every thing else is first rate.

I haven't said anything about the Spectra, and the reason is simple. I can't remember seeing one fly. I attend fun flys all over the country, and while from time to time I will see one at the event I have never seen one fly. I'm not sure of the reason, but I see Predaters and Bergens gasser flying all the time. Not sure why the Spectra's are not flying.

[Rodney]

Im new to gassers my self. As for what Will and others have said the motors are hit and miss on the good and bad. I seem to have gotten one made on Wed. :mrgreen: It rocks. I have learned to keep up with bolts, all gassers vibrate. Century has had some customer service problems, But they are getting better and will improve more with a little more time.

[PaulH]

Bergen, hands down. Troll eBay and RumpRyder. There are a few up for sale right now if you want to save a few dollars.

They may cost a little more, but the support is top-notch. They treat you like family even if they have never met you face-to-face.

[ClayK]

Raja on RR runs his Spectra quite a bit. I know of three other pilots that fly their Spectra's regularly. Only reason I know this is because I have one on my bench right now and I was picking Spectra Pilots Brains. Shannon Davis has one, but he benched it because of a RF glitch that he's chasing down. I've watched 6 Vario gassers fly, capable fliers. 3 of those 6 were scale, 2 of those three were Wolfdad's. I've also watched a couple Century gassers. That being said, the only one I haven't seen is a Bergen, but I know Greg Alderman has had success with his.

Parts will be similar to your Fury and spares should be concurrent between the two, to some degree. Flight styles will be close, but from what I understand, gassers are a little different in flight than a nitro. I haven't completed mine, so I can't say.

[WillJames]

For what it is worht, I have seen John Garst fly his spectra G MANY MANY times, and it has not blown apart yet, his is the #1 G produced and it is still going strong testing the TRM 26 and 231 and pipes and now new gear ratios. Just because a few have exploded, don't judge them by that. Every heli made has exploded before, my last TREX SE tail made it 30 seconds before a grip bolt failed....

Bergen parts are a tiny bit more expensive than MA. THe Predator parts will be FAR CHEAPER, but I know Century has been having some parts availability problems over the past while... As far as I know, since MA is not shipping kits due to waiting on Torque Drives right now that Bergen has never that I needed a part not been able to supply it. I think that would set Bergen apart from Century or MA either one.

To keep it real, I fly only the MA Ion-X and TREX variants. I am interested in the new Roxter 55 and the new MA 50, I basically fly all Electric, but I may pick up a R50 night rig....

[rbort]

Just came back from the field today, another 4 flights logged and the Spectra is singing in the wind. I've got 72 flights on it so far and I'm confident to say now that it flies really well and seems to hold up good too in the air. I'm running a G231 in it right now but Al is reworking my Hanson G26 and he says it will be as smooth as the G231. I'll be putting that in soon to see how it goes.

-=>Raja.

[ClayK]

Wassup Raja! Looking forward to getting mine up in the air. Might work on it some tonight and see how it goes. Can't wait to put that generator on!

[rbort]

Hey Clay:

I just noticed your signature tonight when I came to this site (haven't been in in a couple of months)..."waiting on generator"...how cool is that and I'm sending it!! :-) Well, its on its way, probably Tuesday will be the day it arrives for you.

Yeah Spectra is flying good. Put another 4 flights today. Watched the nitro boys have incidents one of which got away with the skin of his teeth today. Been having issues with the aileron servo, crashed a couple of machines doing this. Finally figured out he was overdriving it at the end of the travel and burning them out. Well he replaced it with another, came to the field today. First flight, 5 minutes into it the aileron servo goes haywire, thing rolls over he hits throttle hold and manages right it and save it for an auto landing. Yay, we'll all psyched for him.

Told him take that canopy off and lets take a look. First finding is he didn't secure the aileron servo wire and it was rubbing on the clutch and the insulation is gone, shorted out on the clutch and that is what caused the incident. Further examination showed a missing collective servo screw in the horn, yikes, accident waiting to happen, he forgot to put it in. A minute later the RX lipo battery dies, completely. What the heck? He charged it last night but didn't check it this morning before flying. He got REAL lucky as if the wire didn't get cut on the clutch bell and cause him to land he was going to crash from the collective horn popping out or the battery dying, guaranteed. Glad to see him go home in one piece!!

I flew 3 flights and was going to do one more, decided to wait for one of the nitro guys to take a flight first. He gassed up but couldn't get it running reliably. 15 minutes of fidding around finally I said I was going to take a flight. Turns out he had "bad fuel" and it took him quite some time of starting and cranking and fiddling to finally figure that out. Meanwhile I put on my 4th flight while he was debugging. I did read in your post somewhere you were asking about the benefits of a gasser. Well, in a few short words, you show up to the field with a heli, a TX case, and the gas can. I didn't even bring any tools with me today. Gas up, pull start (starts in a couple of pulls) and you are on your way. Put in 4 flights, cost me a dollar for an hour of fun, and I go home clean with no nitro mess to wipe down, no field box, glow plugs, expensive fuel going bad, you name it.

Gassers are king, at least in my opinion, and you are going to absolutely love yours!

-=>Raja.

[ClayK]

Almost done....

[rbort]

Hey Clay:

What is that flybar end cap thing? I didn't get that one with my kit. After market or they changed something?

That rear can muffler, I have one on my 1005 by the spacing of the arms is too far apart to mount to fit. Is yours a Vario muffler with different spacing? I know theirs has a different spacing.

That fuel tank is too small. Get a Dubro 16oz tank and fit it there. Check my website for pictures to see how I did mine. I fly 15 minute hard 3d and land with some reserve (not much but some so I never run out and I never have to see it). In your case its too small, you can't see it in flight under the canopy, and you won't be able to get a 15 minute flight out of it.

Here is the link for the pictures:

http://www.massheli.com/gallery/raja

-=>Raja.

[ClayK]

Yeah, been using your pics for a lot of stuff. I had a problem doing the 16oz tank, couldn't get the nipples through. You mentioned a grappler claw, looking for one small enough to get in the hole that I have to drill to put the nipples in... Any ideas?

Had bought the Spectra used, but had to partial assemble and PM/fix some areas. Head was that way, I noticed the difference in the flybar assembly as well. Was going to pick your brain about it. Was also going to ask John Garst if I saw him at Chattanooga. Rear can muffler came with it, but I think I'm going to put on the Century V2 (it's on order).

I'm having a devil of a time though with this 16oz tank thing. I ordered two more tanks since I couldn't get the last two to work.... Big pain in the rear.... Been thinking about doing the Stratus flybar, any comments?

[rbort]

Yeah, been using your pics for a lot of stuff. I had a problem doing the 16oz tank, couldn't get the nipples through. You mentioned a grappler claw, looking for one small enough to get in the hole that I have to drill to put the nipples in... Any ideas?

Did you buy the Dubro 16oz tank? I think its the only one that fits, well maybe not so but I tried another one I got from Minair (stratus tank) and it was too big fit OK but I couldn't put the canopy on with it. The dubro needs to go on inverted as the hump will not clear the canopy chin otherwise.

You assemble the tank nipples with the cap off. Use the claw thing to hold the vent nipple and feed it in from the cap opening and push it out from the inside out and then put the nut and washer on it. Do the same for both vent and carb return nipples. Then drill a hole in the front of the tank and put the L shaped pickup in. Make sure you position the hole so that you can still twist the L around to tighten it without it bumping into the hump of the tank. I bent an OS spanner (open ended wrench) like close to 90 degrees so I can insert it through the cap hole and hold the nut on the back side while I spun the nipple around from the outside to tighten. Once all is good last step is to put the cap on.

My wife just showed up and started to read. The first words out of her mouth with a little giggle is: "ok, tanks have nipples?" Funny stuff at close to the midnight hour!! Anyway I gotta get going to bed, tomorrow is a work day and its late! Hope this helps,

-=>Raja.

[CustomPC]

A handy tip is to screw the nipple in from the outside first so that taps a thread into the plastic.
Then put the nipple on a long L shaped allen key to help you get the nipple through the hole from the inside.
If the thread has been tapped you can usually turn the tip of the nipple poking through the sidewall of the tank with your fingers enough to get the nipple fully seated.
Put the nut on and tighten.

[aarinsingh]

my two cents worth.

Pgasser, its the only one I've owned but it dispelled all the gasser myths I had ever held

[SGUNN911]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback. Great group of guys over here.

[paulw1283]

I'm about the build my Spectra. I'm so nervous because people told me that gasser shakes and can literally shake the machine apart. I hope that's an exaggeration.

Anything I should be cautious when I build in order to decrease the vibration as much as possible? Thanks

BTW, how long did it take you guys to build the Spectra? Was it an easy (just screw and bolt) or hard (a lot of adjustment, measurement, etc...)

thanks

[CustomPC]

I just finished building my Spectra-G and started it last weekend. I have the standard 231 motor and it's fine with no obvious vibrations.
Gassers, by their very nature of having a large single cylinder motor will vibrate some.
I've heard the 260PUH motor is much worse than the 231 vibration wise.

The build is fairly simple and is a bolt together process. You don't need to do any modeling or fabricating of parts to make them fit.
It took me about 48hrs spread out over a month to finish mine, but i was taking it slow and had a lot of interuptions.

Bigrcr (John Garst) made an excellent spectra-g build video that's worth downloading. It has a lot of valuable tips. Also, read the spectra-g operators guide on the CD that came with it. Lots of valuable information there too.

[Heli-Freak]

Bigrcr (John Garst) made an excellent spectra-g build video that's worth downloading.


Where is this video download?

[carlos]

ClayK
That is a Tempest FAI Head. That is why it is different from the others as they are Tempest 3D heads.
My G has the FAI head also and I am tryng to find instrictions for the FAI Head.