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X400 and MX400 Ark X400 and HeliMax MX400 Helicopters Information |
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06-06-2006, 08:31 AM | #1 (permalink) |
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Getting very close to nose in
I've been lazy in my flying. After having gone to the Maryland show, I understood I have to do some serious work on my flying. Yesterday I got pretty close to steady hover at any radial. However, it is not coming without some pain.
I am working on this in my back yard. In the first crash I was heading for a large bush. I pulled down the left stick and hit the ground with a boom strike. Man I hate those. After repairs, I went at it again. This time I was heading for the bush on the other end of my deck. Instead of pulling off, I let it go into the bush. Much better. This time I only bent the feathering spindle. Anyway, if the nose is at 0' on the compass, I can now hover reliably with the nose anywhere between 0' and 140' and, 0' and 210'. The elusive 180' (nose pointing at me) is not here yet. But, I don't think it will be much longer. I was doing slow figure 8s without trouble last evening. Please don't tell me I need to learn it on a simulator. I would rather have my teeth pulled then fly on a sim. jrohland |
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06-06-2006, 12:18 PM | #2 (permalink) |
Join Date: May 2006
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well, jro-baby, i was just about to say that. But sincerely, i owe my flying largely to my air-time clocked on the G2 greatplanes sim; lovely real-like heli's; by the time i first spooled up, i couldn't tell the difference, really, and why?, i had perfected my nose-ins on the sim; mark my words brother, u'll eventually need to go back to the drawing-sim (board)
but good luck to you. |
06-07-2006, 07:12 AM | #3 (permalink) |
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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Something you may want to try is + & - 90 degree hovers in front of you with slight fwd movement each direction.
When comfortable with this, move to + & - 110 degrees. Focus on one direction at a time, i.e always left to right, always + 110 degrees. When you have left to right go for right to left shifting to - 110 degrees. Once you are comfortable here, go for 120 degrees, then 130, etc... Dave Hillner, IRCHA President indroduced me to this method at the Chattanooga fun fly. I went from tail in hover to comfortable left right + & - 90 degree flight in a reasonable amount of fuel.. It allows you to "SNEAK" up on those challenging orientations. I'm also dedicating more SIM time. Sorry to bring up the 3 letter word, it is a very handy tool worthy of cost and time. Happy flyin'
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06-07-2006, 07:20 AM | #4 (permalink) |
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Join Date: May 2005
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Another learning option to first practice piroetting from any orientation to tail-in. Start by doing slow 360 piros, managing collective and adding a cyclic correction when you can.
Then practice your nose in. When you get "stuck", give one shot at a correction. If it's the right one, kudos. If it's the wrongish one then piro back to tail in.
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06-08-2006, 09:23 AM | #5 (permalink) |
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Join Date: May 2006
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I get the impression that if you can do most orientations, including 140 and 210 (5 and8 o'clock to me) - but not complete nose in, then I assume you are "picturing yourself" flying the heli as if you were in it, or behind it, using the same mental cues and stick inputs.
Therefore, when you come a full 180 degrees (nose in, 6 o'clock) you are in trouble as using this method is very hard work. When I say " this method" I mean trying to fly it "normally" and not "reversed". The way I did it was to concentrate on direct nose in, and forget about being "in" or "behind" the heli but imagining that my cyclic stick was "holding up" the rotor disk. So if teh disk dips down to the left, you move the cyclic left to "prop up" or "hold up" the disk. If it tilts back, you move the stick back to "hold it up" again! - kinda simple when you think about it. Also, as for the tail/rudder - just pretend the tail is the nose, and the rudder works as normal! Don't take my work for it - I could be doing it a strange way. I'm just starting to get comfortable with Nose in and hope to do my 1st take off and landing nose in later this week. I do however find nose in ver easy compared to proper (skids lined up) side in. Using the "prop up" method also makes 5 o'clock and 8 o'clock very easy as it's basically nose in with a little angle thrown in. No harder than hovering tail in at 11/10 o'clock or 1/2 o'clock once you have nose in nailed. I do however tremble at full side in . I can do it, but it's not perfect. I'm told it's the hardest bit to get right. Like Playfair said, without a sim, the best way to break the barrier (I found too) is to spin around briskly, give it a go, and then if you panic or feel uncomfortable , spin it back round. With a decent bit of height you will have plenty of time to have a go at dealing with it before bailing out. My instructor told me "you know how you can give gentle inputs and have loads of time to correct tail-in - Well, it's exatly the same nose-in - you have lots of time, so don't panic"
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T-Rex 150X, T-Rex 450 SEV2, Protos 500, Compass 7HV |
06-08-2006, 10:51 AM | #6 (permalink) |
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Thanks for the tips
I want to thank you all for the encouragement and the great tips. The funny part is, I have discovered many of these techniques on my own. I guess it is natural or, perhaps things I've read in books and magazines are being recalled subconsciously.
I worked hard to learn side-on hovering in both directions. I feel pretty comfortable with those. I never imagined myself as the pilot. But, I have starting paying attention to the main rotor disk and simply trying to point it where I want to go. The first thing I worked on once I was confident with hovering was pirouettes. At the time I was not thinking about recovery to tail-in when in trouble but, being decent with swinging the tail has helped in panic recoveries. I have recently started forcing myself to take off and land in different orientations. Those are indeed a challenge. jrohland |
06-29-2006, 01:00 AM | #7 (permalink) |
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Join Date: Jan 2006
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A comment made to me by a pilot helped a lot with nose in "move the stick in the direction the heli is going to correct".
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06-30-2006, 08:01 AM | #8 (permalink) |
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Thread Starter
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So that is what the front looks like
To follow-up my original post; At my local field, I have been doing nose in up high for a few days now. I can hold it for 10+ seconds. Yesterday I held nose in in my backyard for 4-5 seconds. Please understand, the space I have for this in my yard is about 3 square meters (9 square feet). It is more thrilling--for lack of a better word--doing new maneuvers when you have a deck, fence, tree and me no more than a few meters in each direction.
Confidence is high that I will have this technique under my thumb in a few more flight hours. That puts me what, 5 or so minutes from being a 3D master. :cool: Thanks for all the great advice, jrohland |
07-20-2006, 04:53 PM | #9 (permalink) |
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jrohland
Have to agree with you on the sim front, I even prefer to fly a plank on afpd than a trex !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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07-20-2006, 04:57 PM | #10 (permalink) |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
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I worked on my nose in after learning forward flight. I just kept flying toward me slower and slower untill i got the nose in thing sorta down. Also I found that flying something that was not as expensive to crash helped alot.
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07-21-2006, 01:48 AM | #11 (permalink) |
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Join Date: Jul 2006
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I learned nose in with training gear still on , I figured Id learn it best the same way I learned tail in and that was to park the heli on the ground in front of me nose in and attempt to lift off the ground maintain a stable nose in hover then I would move it around and land that way keeping the heli nose in the whole time , it was difficult as everthing is backwards obviously. doing it from the ground up I found to be easier and safer for the heli . I learned all this before forward flight .
Also try nose in piros back to nose in while hovering is good training too. |
07-21-2006, 08:19 AM | #12 (permalink) |
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I learned my controlls on a blade cx. It was great for breaking my fixed wing habbits. you know the "wow Ican use the tail for somthing other than snap rolls" lol Now on my x400 I'm fairly good at hover but still not that good stick it where I want it good yet. The sim has helped too. I figured if I can hover in a 4 foot square all directions with a walkera then I had done good enought for ff. And on the x400 it was soo much easyer. I had the chance to traid a motor for a walkera to take my frustrations out on (first walkera was that much of a pain) and give an airiel pounding to. keep up the good work and some day it will be us they say "wow I never knew they helicopters could do that" to.
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