View Full Version : Has anybody got any leads??
06-14-2004, 03:01 AM
Hi guys, I'm brand new to HF.........Looks real interesting.
Got a question though, I was looking through the Classifieds and did not find much for sale in the GASSER catagory.
Anybody got any leads as to where I could find a Preditor Gas or a Bergen Intrepid or Observer?? I don't get too excited about Vario.
Another question: Could someone fill me in on the particulars of the Excel Gasser? Like, what engine are they using in this little beastie. I can't seem to find the right info on the Excel site. And does Excel offer two different lines of copters? The Excel stuff and the Fury line? I'm so confussed!
Any and all help greatly appreciated...............Dave
06-14-2004, 05:49 AM
Welcome to HeliFreak.com!!
I am moving this to the gasser forum but leaving a shadow here so it gets more exposure. I would bet there are people who can help.
Thanks for joining!! :)
06-14-2004, 06:28 AM
Not sure where you can get a Predator, Bergen Intrepid or X-Cell gas machine used right now. Most guys hang on to their gas machines once they get one.
The X-Cell gas has been around since about 1988-89. It was originally built as a Pro Graphite and later released as a Gas Graphite using the base stack frame configuration that the ST, CT and SE uses. All of the gas machines on the market for now are using some version or other of the Komatsu Zenoah G-23. This is an industrial "pack blower" and weed eater motor. The original G-23 had many problems revolving around overheating. Most of these issues were taken care of (by all of the manufacturers) by better cooling fans and shrouds. The motors used today are the G-231 and G-26 (as of yet Miniature Aircraft does not use the G-26 motor, but it will fit the machine). These motors cool much better and make much more power than the original G-23.
The Fury itself is an X-Cell. Miniature called it's helicopter line X-Cell from the beginning and all of the machines they make are X-Cells. The Fury is the new generation machine utilizing CCPM controls but retaining all of the concepts and many parts are interchangable from the standard mix machines to the Fury line.
Miniature is about to release a new model of a gas machine based on the CCPM Fury platform. This machine will use the same Zenoah motor technology, but will have many new and desireable features and will fly, of course, like an X-Cell!
Hope this helps!!
06-14-2004, 06:50 AM
I am really excited to see the new Fury Gasser!! Should be quite a ship. Odds are I will own a new Fury Gasser, I just gotta have one, you know how that goes... :)
In the mean time, you may want to contact cbergen here on HF and ask him if he knows where any used Bergen Gassers are. He might. The Bergen Gasser is an incredibly fine and great looking machine. Can you say BLING BLING!! Absolutely gorgeous!!
06-14-2004, 12:13 PM
is the G-26 actually a larger displacement motor? And is there any difference between the G-23 and the 231 other than just porting?
Spark Timing maybe??...................Thanks.........Dave
06-14-2004, 01:07 PM
The G-26 has a larger piston, ring and cylinder. That's it.
The G-231 has a full finned head where the G-23 has the fins lopped off near the cylinder. The G-231 has a single ring and closer tolerances which helps to reduce moving friction to make it run cooler and minimize piston slap during unload condition, the G-23 has two rings and much looser tolerances. The intake porting is better on the G-231 than the G-23 also. The exhaust porting and duration are about the same between the two. The G-231 runs very much cooler than the G-23 which operates near it's maximum temperature all of the time, even with good cooling. The source coil for the G-231 (and G-26) has higher timing than the older G-23. The G-231 comes with a WT-653,4 or 5 (differences in options of choke and primer bulb) which is the best so far. Some of the late G-23's came with a WT-603 carb which is also very good and is still a good choice for a G-231 or G-26. The G-231 and G-26 use a 10 mm spark plug while the G-23 uses the standard sized plug.
Hope this helps!!
06-14-2004, 01:33 PM
Thanks John, very knowledgeable.
Did you learn all of this by messing with copter motors, or by being a small engine mechanic,as I am ??
06-14-2004, 05:07 PM
A little of both. I took some classes out of high school for small engine repair and got Briggs and Stratton certified (with cool tools) and then got me a Mechanical Engineering degree. I then started working at a golf course as grounds keeper and went to Yamaha school as well as E-Z Go and Club Car. But this was a long time ago. Now I do specialty plastics and carbon fiber composites.
I just really love the hobby and really like small motors!
06-14-2004, 05:25 PM
Most Impressive, All of us here and now, massaging on these choppers, I'm sure will benefit greatly from your exposure in the past. Wow, especially the GASSER guys.
Oh yes, Does the G26 have the "Tighter" clearences and the single ring that you mentioned that the 231 has? I probably didn't read into your line what I should have.
............Again Thanks.........Dave :)
06-15-2004, 06:49 AM
Yes, the G-26 uses the same technology, just a bigger piston, ring and cylinder bore/stroke. I think it's 1 mm each way, I may be wrong about that though.