Need better solution for the pins.

[Dave]

I have had the pin that holds the tail drive pinion work loose twice now. Of course if you loose the pin you loose tail control which may destroy the helicopter. So far I have been lucky but I am now worried about "the next time".

The manual has you secure the pin with a set screw with loctite (on the set screw) and then has you try pushing on the pin with a small allen wrench to make sure the set screw has locked the pin in place. I had done this but the pin has worked loose regardless. I have also heard that if you tighten it too much you bend the pin and then it makes it work loose even faster!

There must be a better way to secure this pin. I have heard of using CA and shrink wrap tubbing but both of these seem less then ideal.

Has anyone found a better way? I seems just seems so wrong that a $2,500 plus helicopter is this dependant on a 1 cent part!

[playfair]

Crank down on the setscrew more. If the pin bends, it will be harder to remove, not easier. I like this system better then Hirobo's roll pin with no set screw.

[DebianDog]

I have never had one back out. :dontknow

[Rockhouse]

Are you talking about the bevel gears on the Raptor 60? If so I had the same problem twice! Minimal damage both times. There is a solution. Go to petesrc.com get their phone number & tell them you want the collars for the bevel gear pins. You get three plastic collars that slide over the offending pins (2 in the front & 1 at the rear). I no longer worry that the bird is going to spin out of control.
Joe

ps they cost about 9 dollars. Found out about them from the ama mag 2-4 months back.

[Wyvern]

I have had the pin that holds the tail drive pinion work loose twice now. Of course if you loose the pin you loose tail control which may destroy the helicopter. So far I have been lucky but I am now worried about "the next time".

Hi Dave,

I suffered the same issue which which cost me about $700USD to fix :(.

Since then, I use Locktite (609) bearing retainer on the grub screw, and I also put some bearing retainer on the pin itself to hold it in the shaft itself. Once this has cured, I put some CA on the ends of the pins securing them to the the plastic. This seems to hold them in a lot better.

[rstacy]

There is no better solution than heat shrink tubing around base of the gear to cover the pin holes or the collars from Pete's RC.

[Altimat]

I grind a very shallow flat on the pin and add a second set screw.

[Mike Fortin]

In the my 3 years of flying Raptors I have yet to have this happen but I do know of a few that have.

Your best bet is to simply get some shrink wrap around the pin which is what most off us our currently doing.

This is the cheapest, fastest and probably most effective ways of securing your pins on both the Tail Drive Gears and the Tail Bevel Gears.

[rstacy]

In the my 3 years of flying Raptors I have yet to have this happen but I do know of a few that have.

Your best bet is to simply get some shrink wrap around the pin which is what most off us our currently doing.

I'm betting that has a lot to do with why you haven't had it happen. One $700 crash was enough for me to do it.

This is the cheapest, fastest and probably most effective ways of securing your pins on both the Tail Drive Gears and the Tail Bevel Gears.

I think I agree with you but I am assuming that you mean around the gear and not the pin!

[flyinfool]

There have been some shafts that the hole for the set screw was not tapped deep enough. Before assy run the setscrew in and look through the pin hole to be sure tat the set screw is going deep enough.
Clean the threaded hole of cutting oil. I use spray brake cleaner blasted through the holes followed by compressed air.
I install the set screw with blue loctite including some loctite on the tip of the set screw.
I then use a second set screw and blue loctite to act as a jamb screw.

It takes a hammer and punch to get it back apart if you ever have to.

[Janek]

I think some of the above answers apply to the R30/50, and some to the R60/90. . . . . :wink:

[OzStriker]

Happened to me today for the second time, no damage fortunately.

I will be grinding a flat on the pin and installing some heat shrink tubing around the base of the gear, I imagine that will do the trick.

[rstacy]

Happened to me today for the second time, no damage fortunately.

I will be grinding a flat on the pin and installing some heat shrink tubing around the base of the gear, I imagine that will do the trick.

I realize that grinding a flat spot on the pin sounds like a good idea and maybe it is but some have had the pin break at the flat spot after doing the grinding.

I also know that there will be those that have done the pin grinding and never had another problem.

So if grinding the pin increases the chances of the pin breaking by even 1%, then why do it?

The heat shrink tubing or Pete's collars will completely eliminate the potential problem with out weakening anything.

[Jared Granzow]

I think heat shrink tubing or Petes collars are both great choices if you can find them. I was out of luck and have been using half inch brass tubing from the local hobby shop.

[Jerry]

Guys, first lets clear up why this happens.

The pin is hardened. Setscrews don't traditionally bite into a hardened pin. To prove this - you'll never find a pin in a raptor that - when removed - has a 'bite' mark on its length.

For those of you that had an early X-spec with the hardened mainshaft - remember how the mainshaft collar with setscrews would always loosen? Same issue.

You can tighten this setscrew until your allen driver breaks, and it is still eligible to loosen.

I lost the pin one day too, very early on.

Use a little green loctite in the pin's hole before installing the pin. Then install the setscrew with blue.

Then take a piece of heatshrink around the base of gear - so that it covers the pin. I typically add a drop of CA to the heatshrink to secure it further.

This works. Much simpler than grinding.

Jerry

[Altimat]

Good points but my theory is that if the set screw engages a shallow flat equal in width to the diameter of the set screw then the pin cannot possibly slide out. A second "jam" set screw is some extra insurance that the first remains engaged into the flat on the pin.

I don't think weakening the pin is an issue at all. The gears will let go long before that pin does even with a flat ground into the center of it.

[alexander]

Info over there also.

http://team-raptor.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=5168&sid=4587d9103530a71d5c5dfa585e0b95ec&no=1#5168

http://www.scotiabladerunners.ca/pictures/keeper.jpg

Stephen

[BeaverJamie]

Would something like loc-tight green used to lock bearings to shafts work in this case?

[Dave]

Loctite green is what Jerry suggested on the end of the grub screw.

I have heard of blue and red and even purple for high temp but I had not heard of green before. Can someone explain green?

Great photo Stephen. WOW, I am sure your pin is not going anywhere!!!

[WillJames]

Green is the super think wicking version. Use a toothpick and put a tiny bit of the green on the toothpick then apply it to the part with the toothpick so it does not go anywhere you don't want locktited, like bearings. It works GREAT but a lot of times needs heat to get apart.

It is like how thin CA wicks into stuff. Same thin consistency similar to thin CA.

[alexander]

What I find with the R90 is because it is so reliable we tend to forget to inspect this area on a regular basis. I've never had the rear TRGBX pin come loose but only the forward one on the white spur gear, even with green loctite. This happened, but only after gobs of flights. While it may be good for 100 flights easily, it may come loose after 200-300. In my mind either keep your eyes pealed or make it failure proof. This applies to the R50 rear pulley also. Many guys do not put the same number of flights annually or pound the machine the same, so you basically get a variety of results and suitable fixes.

Stephen

[rstacy]

What I find with the R90 is because it is so reliable we tend to forget to inspect this area on a regular basis. I've never had the rear TRGBX pin come loose but only the forward one on the white spur gear, even with green loctite.
Stephen

Hey Stephen,
Colin did some killer flying at the XFC. Nice job guys!!

That is the only pin that we had come out. Since using the heat shrink tubing, we have had no problems.

Ray

[alexander]

Ray,

The way I look at it is through the manner in which Colin beats the snot out of the helicopter, we're not risking anything. :lol: Kyle flys extremely well in a similar manner but you can bet money the torture level to the machine is rising at a steady rate. You may not see it being with him every day but these kids will throw full abuse left right and center. They get in a frenzy often skipping meals for more stick time! My wife says its all my fault as I introduced him with little sympathy and a satisfying I told you so grin. His main 90 machine has to up over 1000 flights by now.

I had a pin on a 50 partially come through the shrink tubing a couple years ago and hence the caution/overkill. I'm looking at the new Avant Aurora machine and see similar pins everywhere.

Stephen

[rstacy]

Stephen,
I am in complete agreement with you. What I wanted to say is that like you we have only had the front pin come out on our 90.
You aren't kidding about the torture level.
We just got back from a practice session where at times he was flying it so hard that I was certain that an explosion was only moments away but fortunately no such thing happened. I swear he was flying it like he was mad at the world!
I may go to the plastic rings that Pete's RC sells or if that doesn't work out I will do the brass tubing.

Lately Kyle has been beating up on his Vibe along with his Raptor. So far the Vibe appears to be taking it pretty well.
Ray

[Daniel Jetschin]

How about using Pins out of softer non hardened steel and setscrews with cutting bottom ?