Upgrade CP to CP Pro?

[JesusFreak]

Hi Guys:

Can the Blade CP be easily upgraded to the CP Pro?

I already have the Aerobatic upgrade kit from my CP along with Lipos.
Also, the Bell/Hiller head upgrade.

I _think_ I would just need to replace my 4 in 1 with a 3 in 1, and then I can use the seperate Headlock Gyro. Is that correct? Is it worth the cost? Do I lose much by not having the Gyro adjustment on my older transmitter? I have a Futaba 9Z WCII, so if I can figure out how to program the Blade in there, I think I would be set.

The brushed motors work OK for me, but the stock Gyro really stinks, so that's my reason for wanting to "upgrade".

Are there any other bits I'm missing?

Thanks!

Lee

[capebob]

You will also need a six channel receiver, but you can dissect your 4 in 1 and use the receiver out of that. In addition the Pro transmitter has a channel 5 adjustment knob for control of the gyro and a channel 6 knob for fine tuning your ccpm mix. Since you're going to use your 9Z this shouldn't be a problem. Add the silver canopy and decals and you have a Pro.


Bob

[JesusFreak]

You will also need a six channel receiver, but you can dissect your 4 in 1 and use the receiver out of that. In addition the Pro transmitter has a channel 5 adjustment knob for control of the gyro and a channel 6 knob for fine tuning your ccpm mix. Since you're going to use your 9Z this shouldn't be a problem. Add the silver canopy and decals and you have a Pro.


Bob

Bob:

Thanks, so, the 3 in one has no reciever? I thought it didn't have the Gyro. Guess I'm confused a bit.

So the Pro comes with a seperate receiver standard? Is that the deal?

Just smacked my blade nose first into the ground a few minutes ago, so a new canopy is now in order. :oops: Oh well, it's cheaper then my Rex, and I was having a hoot of a time. At least I didn't ruin the lipo.

Thanks,
Lee

[capebob]

That's right. The Pro's 3 in 1 contains the gyro, mixer, and speed controls. The receiver is separate. To use an external gyro you turn the 3 in 1s gyro gain all the way down. If you don't want to dissect the 4 in 1 the receiver that comes with the pro is ~$25 and you can use your 4 in 1s crystal.

Bob

[JesusFreak]

That's right. The Pro's 3 in 1 contains the gyro, mixer, and speed controls. The receiver is separate. To use an external gyro you turn the 3 in 1s gyro gain all the way down. If you don't want to dissect the 4 in 1 the receiver that comes with the pro is ~$25 and you can use your 4 in 1s crystal.

Bob

Bob:

Thanks again. Are there some notes on doing that floating around, or is it pretty straigt forward, crack the case and pull it out kind of thing?

I don't understand why you need the 3 in 1 vs. the 4 in 1 to make this all work then.


Lee

[capebob]

Lee,

To remove the receiver remove the four screws on the receiver side. The receiver will pull out, but because it's plugged into the mixer/gyro/speed control board it takes a little effort. You will notice that the channels 3 and 4 pins are on the opposite side of the board. These are the pins that send the throttle and tail rotor information to the other board. When you install the gyro the input to the gyro will plug into channel 4. If your gyro has a control circuit that will plug into channel 5.

I don't understand why you need the 3 in 1 vs. the 4 in 1 to make this all work then.

In theory you don't. You can, after you separate the two parts of the 4 in 1, plug the gyro between the receiver and the other board. There is one reported problem with this. To use a separate gyro with either the 4 in 1 or the 3 in 1 you must disable the 4 in 1 gyro. To do this you turn the gyro gain all the way down. I'm not sure that this is correct, but I've heard that on the 4 in 1 you can't turn the gain all the way down and that there is a little interaction between the two gyros. Like I said, I don't know if this is true or not.

It's really a lot easier to get the Pro receiver and 3 in 1 if money isn't an issue.

The Pro comes with a separate receiver in case you upgrade to a brushless motor system and/or a separate gyro. There is no way to insert a gyro or brushless speed control between the receiver and speed control in the 4 in 1 without separating the two boards.

Bob

[cbdane]

To use a separate gyro with either the 4 in 1 or the 3 in 1 you must disable the 4 in 1 gyro. To do this you turn the gyro gain all the way down. I'm not sure that this is correct, but I've heard that on the 4 in 1 you can't turn the gain all the way down and that there is a little interaction between the two gyros. Like I said, I don't know if this is true or not.

Yes, based on my personal experience, this is correct. It's not the built-in gyro that causes problems, it's the revo-mixing. Even with the pot turned fully counter-clockwise, the receiver still attempts to mix a small amount of tail output with throttle and this completely upsets a heading-hold gyro. I believe that in the 3-1 the full counter-clockwise setting on the revo-mix adjustment completely disables it.

If you just want to go brushless, the boards separate incredibly easily (they are just plugged together). However, I had to go to a new receiver (Spektrum DX6) to incorporate the heading-hold gyro.

A final word of advice. Listen carefully because I wish someone had sat me down and given me this lecture a few months ago. I suggest that you STOP upgrading your CP and purchase a low-end TREX. There is NO COMPARISON. In the end, I put more cash into my CP than the price of an XL. Now that I have a TREX, I kick myself :arggg: everytime that I go outside (did I say outside? Yes!) and fly. Incredibly stable, a joy to fly. :mrgreen:

I'll keep working on my Blade CP just out of some sort of perverse attraction to an impossible challenge but my TREX is my daily flyer. I haven't even replaced a main blade yet!

[JesusFreak]

A final word of advice. Listen carefully because I wish someone had sat me down and given me this lecture a few months ago. I suggest that you STOP upgrading your CP and purchase a low-end TREX. There is NO COMPARISON. In the end, I put more cash into my CP than the price of an XL. Now that I have a TREX, I kick myself :arggg: everytime that I go outside (did I say outside? Yes!) and fly. Incredibly stable, a joy to fly. :mrgreen:

I'll keep working on my Blade CP just out of some sort of perverse attraction to an impossible challenge but my TREX is my daily flyer. I haven't even replaced a main blade yet!

CB:

I understand your warning BUT, I actually have two REXES (XL and SE), but I still fly my Blade for a few reasons. 1) It's harder to fly, so it makes for a more aggressive training platform. 2) You HAVE to fly the tail on the stock CP, as the Gyro sucks, again good training. 3.) The CP Parts are at my LHS and the entire heli is VERY simple and CHEAP to buy and maintain compared to the REX. 4.) The CP is generally much more durable.

I love my REXs, but as I'm still learning, I still love my Blade. I try new things with the Blade without worrying about ditching it, as I know it's only going to be a few bucks and a short trip to repair. The Rex is a much better more stable heli and capable of much more. But a bad ditch can cost me $100 in parts and a few days waiting for parts, so I tend to take less risks.

I really just want to get a good Gyro on my CP at a reasonable cost. I don't think that will effect any of the other "good" things about the blade, but will make it a much more flyable heli.

Thanks for your help.

Hey, could you share your setup on the DX6? I use one for my Rexes, but I haven't tried setting up a Blade. When I do the Rexes, I have to sit down and go through Bob's videos just about everytime to make sure I get it right. :wink:

Thanks for your help.

One other question though again. If you use a DX6 and a seperate Gyro, do you really need the 3 in 1 at all? Or can I just use a couple of brushed or brushless controllers to run the appropriate motors? I.e. does the 3 in 1 do anything special with the signal beyone what the speed controllers would normally do?

Cheers!
Lee

[cbdane]

One other question though again. If you use a DX6 and a seperate Gyro, do you really need the 3 in 1 at all? Or can I just use a couple of brushed or brushless controllers to run the appropriate motors? I.e. does the 3 in 1 do anything special with the signal beyone what the speed controllers would normally do?
Lee

Nope, you don't need it. I use an Align 20A brushless ESC on the main motor (Park 370) and the little ICS-50 ESC on the tail. Works pretty well. If I nail full collective from a hover, the tail swings around about 5-10 degrees and then quickly returns. Not perfect but workable.

[JesusFreak]

CB Thanks:

I have a little 5 amp contoller from FMA, but I don't know if it has a soft start or brake option. Is the ISC-50 programmable at all?

I may skipt he 3 in 1 and just go all seperates if this is the case. Waiting to hear some from Horizon.

Thanks,
Lee