How to - 12s T-Rex 600 Setup On A Budget.

[schwarztrader]

So looking to take the plunge with 12S on an HK600 and I am wondering if I need a seperate BEC if I purchase the following CC Ice 80A esc found at readyheli.

CSEM7500 Castle Creations Phoenix Ice HV 80A 12s (50V) Brushless ESC

http://www.readyheli.com/CSEM7500_Castle_Creations_Phoenix_Ice_HV_80A_12s_p/csem7500.htm

It says that it has a "switching BEC", so does that mean it already has one and I don't need a seperate BEC if I get this particular unit?

[bradford1040]

I would! The separate bec is always a good idea on the larger birds! plus most built in bec's only put out 4.8volts and if you have noticed the stock kit even comes with a extra battery 2s lipo (that is the align kit)

[rceccleston]

So looking to take the plunge with 12S on an HK600 and I am wondering if I need a seperate BEC if I purchase the following CC Ice 80A esc found at readyheli.

CSEM7500 Castle Creations Phoenix Ice HV 80A 12s (50V) Brushless ESC

http://www.readyheli.com/CSEM7500_Castle_Creations_Phoenix_Ice_HV_80A_12s_p/csem7500.htm

It says that it has a "switching BEC", so does that mean it already has one and I don't need a seperate BEC if I get this particular unit?
The CC BEC Pro will be required as the throttle is opto isolated.

An internal BEC is not installed within this esc.

http://www.castlecreations.com/products/phoenix_ice_hv.html

[dfrazier]

So looking to take the plunge with 12S on an HK600 and I am wondering if I need a seperate BEC if I purchase the following CC Ice 80A esc found at readyheli.

CSEM7500 Castle Creations Phoenix Ice HV 80A 12s (50V) Brushless ESC

http://www.readyheli.com/CSEM7500_Castle_Creations_Phoenix_Ice_HV_80A_12s_p/csem7500.htm

It says that it has a "switching BEC", so does that mean it already has one and I don't need a seperate BEC if I get this particular unit?

Its a misprint. The HV series do not have BEC's in them.

[Shef]

I tried the 700 Main gear on my setup yesterday and it stripped within seconds of taking off. When get some new ones, I'll try it again w/o any mesh space.

[rceccleston]

I tried the 700 Main gear on my setup yesterday and it stripped within seconds of taking off. When get some new ones, I'll try it again w/o any mesh space.

You could try the new HN7019A (http://www.align.com.tw/shop/product_info.php?products_id=2314) Align Mod 1 gear for the T-Rex 700.

http://www.align.com.tw/shop/images/function/hn7103_1.jpg
●Use for T-REX 700 Nitro Pro.
●Main drive gear(115T) x 2 modulus:1

[Shef]

True, but then I need to get a mod 1 pinion and the only one I could find is for a 6mm shaft so I'd need to swap out my 5mm Scorpion shaft...but I don't have a press to get it out.

Or is it something I can just tap out? From what I heard, you really need a press.

[rceccleston]

True, but then I need to get a mod 1 pinion and the only one I could find is for a 6mm shaft so I'd need to swap out my 5mm Scorpion shaft...but I don't have a press to get it out.

Or is it something I can just tap out? From what I heard, you really need a press.
Press???

With both grub screws removed, it should drop out, with a little tap.

Due to the grub rounding off, I had to replace the shaft, with a 14T pinion previously used in gov mode.

Personally, I've not yet stripped a stock gear but I am going mod 1 with my 700e 'chrome edition'. :YeaBaby:

[Shef]

from their website:
Note: The shafts in the Scorpion motors are a slight press fit into the aluminum front housing. The shafts will not just slide out when the setscrews are removed. They need to be pressed out in a bearing press, or in a drill press, with the front houshing of the motor supported in a block of wood to prevent warping the front housing.

I just don't feel like removing the motor, taking it all apart, then not being able to get the old shaft out and/or new one in without the press.

Has anyone done this without a press?

[Lajon]

Has anyone done this without a press?
I have but would really liked to have a press available. I tapped it out and the force needed was nothing like "a little tap". Same for getting the replacement shaft in.
/Lars

[rceccleston]

from their website:
Note: The shafts in the Scorpion motors are a slight press fit into the aluminum front housing. The shafts will not just slide out when the setscrews are removed. They need to be pressed out in a bearing press, or in a drill press, with the front houshing of the motor supported in a block of wood to prevent warping the front housing.

I just don't feel like removing the motor, taking it all apart, then not being able to get the old shaft out and/or new one in without the press.

Has anyone done this without a press?
Yes.

I knocked it out on my workbench with an old shaft.

http://www.helifreak.com/picture.php?albumid=2567&pictureid=32568

[Force3]

I have just changed the 5mm shaft for a 6mm shaft in a brand new Scorpion 4025-890 and it was very tight. I have a 1 ton arbour press and I had to use a lot of force to remove the old shaft and install the new one. It did appear to have red threadseal on the shaft as a rusty coloured residue came out of the motor end cap.

[rceccleston]

I have just changed the 5mm shaft for a 6mm shaft in a brand new Scorpion 4025-890 and it was very tight. I have a 1 ton arbour press and I had to use a lot of force to remove the old shaft and install the new one. It did appear to have red threadseal on the shaft as a rusty coloured residue came out of the motor end cap.
Extreme. :smokin:

[dfrazier]

When my 5mm shaft snapped I replaced it with a 6mm. I called Lucian Miller of innov8tivedesigns.com and he told me that a 1 ton arbor press is necessary because the shaft is an interference fit.

[caralmar]

Quick charging question guys. I've ordered my new Scorpion 4025-630 and Mikado 12T pinion... should be here soon... can't wait!

Next are the batteries. I was thinking of getting the 3000mAH 30C packs, but will the 40C be overkill or give me any better results for the extra dough?

Finally, for charging, I don't have a networked charger, but can do parallel charging up to 12A (with an iCharger 208B). Would it be ok to run these in serial for flying, but charge in parallel?

Thanks!

[Shef]

I don't know the answer, but you can get a brand new Hyperio Duo III on ebay for $235 (or $216 with the bing.com trick). Then you know for sure that every cell is balance charged!

[caralmar]

Nah, I already have two chargers! The iCharger 208B is nice and my backup one is the Accucell-8. Both are hooked up to a P350 power supply.

When I fly my 500, I normally just put one pack on each charger and set them to 5A charge rate. This gives me around 1.5C charge rate and they're done in about 35min. I plan on doing the same with the 600 packs... guess charging them individually should be ok.

[rceccleston]

Quick charging question guys. I've ordered my new Scorpion 4025-630 and Mikado 12T pinion... should be here soon... can't wait!

Nice, I'm sure you'll enjoy the power. :YeaBaby:

Next are the batteries. I was thinking of getting the 3000mAH 30C packs, but will the 40C be overkill or give me any better results for the extra dough?

If your planning to run in fixed end point, 30/40c packs (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9489&aff=97114) are working very well for me, with a loss of approximately 150 rpm during discharge.

High 'c' rating packs would sustain a higher voltage under load, which would be reflected as high more consistent headspeeds.

However, due to the 12s configuration, the additional cost and weight may have little benefit.

Finally, for charging, I don't have a networked charger, but can do parallel charging up to 12A (with an iCharger 208B). Would it be ok to run these in serial for flying, but charge in parallel?

I wouldn't recommend charging in parallel as the charger couldn't identify a weak/damage cell, which may damage the paired cell too.

For the price of a pair of packs, I would recommend investing in two networked Hyperion chargers, for higher wattage than a Hyperion Duo.

[caralmar]

Thanks, I misspoke when I said charge in parallel... I'm indeed charging two packs at the same time, but I'm using two separate chargers. I guess the question really is if its ok to charge them individually rather than as a 12s pack.

EDIT: Oh, and THANK YOU very much for all the help on this topic. It has been invaluable!

[rceccleston]

Thanks, I misspoke when I said charge in parallel... I'm indeed charging two packs at the same time, but I'm using two separate chargers. I guess the question really is if its ok to charge them individually rather than as a 12s pack.

EDIT: Oh, and THANK YOU very much for all the help on this topic. It has been invaluable!
Should be ok if they remain paired when flying.

[adroc3905]

For the price of a pair of packs, I would recommend investing in two networked Hyperion chargers, for higher wattage than a Hyperion Duo.

How would higher wattage than a Hyperion Duo III be useful?

[rceccleston]

How would higher wattage than a Hyperion Duo III be useful?
It all depend upon how quick you want to charge your current packs and any you'll buy in the future.

180 watts / 15 amps = 12 volts or 3s pack at 5c per port

Or

180 watts / 25.2 volts = 7.14 amps or 6s 3000Mah at 2.3c per port

Or

360 watts / 50.4 volts = 7.14 amps or 12s 3000Mah at 2.3c per Hyperion Duo 3.

Or two network Hyperion chargers

2x 250 watts = 500 watts / 50.4 volts = 9.92amps or 12s 3000Mah at 3.3c

While I personally charge my 3000Mah packs (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=9489&aff=97114) at 1c, on two network Hyperion chargers, I could charge at 3.3c in the future.

[Rogman88]

Ok got the -630 with 13T pinion on yesterday and too much power through the pinion caused the grub screw to slip and had to abruptly auto. The tail touched down for a brief second causing a gear to strip on the torque tube. That thing was awesome the 10 seconds it was in the air prior to the slip!!!
A side note: Prior to the -630 coming in I tried the two zippy and two turnigy 3000's in parallel (22.4v) on the scorpion 1100 and that thing still ran like a scalded orangatang!!! The packs came down cool too! So somone who is thinking about going the 12S direction would definitly see the benefits of cool running batteries and longer cycle life by running 12S parallel. Had the -630 not already been ordered I may have just run the parallel setup for a while.

I have come to the conclusion that 6S just pulls too much out of each cell too fast. I think spreading it out over 12 cells is just easier on the packs whether it's in series or parallel. For example. Say you pull 60 amps out of a pack during a flight. That would be 10 amps drawn out of each 5000mah cell verses 5 amps drawn out of each 3000mah cell (roughly 60% the amperage drawn per cell) if all packs run at 22.4v.

I wonder:..Whats the difference in amp/watt draw from running a paralleled 12S system on a scorpion 1100 vrs: A 12S series setup on a scorpion -630?

I know 12 series will be half the amps so should theoretically be easier on the packs right? Twice the volts though.

I'm interested to hear what you battery guru's know about internal resistance of parallel vrs series with identical motors but different kv.

[caralmar]

Just got my 4025-630... nice motor, but FAT! LOL

Hey, until I get my 3000mAH packs, is it ok to run this using my 6s 5000mAh packs? Basically just swap this motor in for the Neu? I plan on using the Mikado 12T pinion.

Thanks!

[rceccleston]

Just got my 4025-630... nice motor, but FAT! LOL

Hey, until I get my 3000mAH packs, is it ok to run this using my 6s 5000mAh packs? Basically just swap this motor in for the Neu? I plan on using the Mikado 12T pinion.

Thanks!
Sorry, 630kv x 6s won't produce enough head speed to get off the ground, looks like you'll be waiting for your packs.

How many pairs did you buy??