Enough POWER for Hurry ???

[DerClown]

Hey guys !
After some upgrades, that was not so good as expected, I disapointed about my hurricane completely and almost decided to sell it and go for something new (maybe trex500 or completely different league trex600 Nitro). :arggg:
So this thread is the last way, to keep me the hurry, if I find the correct answer what I was doing wrong.
Damn, please advise what power system should I put, to make it fly like it should be ? :thinking
The power system, that I have is Align ESC 75A, scorpion HK3026-1210KV (that is crap for this helly) and ZIPPY-H 6s 3300 mAh Lipos. And I get just 4:30 mins flight, basicly the same performance as with the stock GAUI 810KV motor (or whats was it in the early models ?). :arggg:
So, should I just go for the Z30, Scorpion HK3026-KV1400 motor, CF frame, to avoid the gears striping, or something else, I just don''t know....
Or the main question would be, is it possible to make this thing to fly like the Trex500ESP ? :roll:

[Bodyshop]

I'm running the HK 3026-1400 on mine with 430mm blades and it's fantastic. Lots of power. I'm getting about 4:30 minute flights with a 100% flat throttle curve.

[Mikej]

Mr Clown,

The motors of choice are Z20A 980kV if you want efficiency above power, or the Z30 1100kV if absolute power is your preference.

The are very good reports for the Head Hunter frames - no more gear stripping, ever !!

Good luck,
Mike

[Flyextreme]

I just "upgraded" from the Scorpion 3026 1400 to the Z30. The 3026 was ok....but.....I'm really looking foreward to testing out the Z30. Oh! and this is with 550mm blades.

Just get the Z30 and be done with it....:thumbup:

[bobbybe]

i think if you're not happy with your hurri than you shoud just sell it and be done... sounds like you're pretty frustrated, and if you want it to fly like a trex 500, then just buy a trex 500.

that being said, you also have to look at your gearing, and therefore headspeed. if you want it to fly hard, you need around 2200 rpm. you can use the headspeed calc in mystic's or mike's signature box and find out what you're getting with your current gearing (which is what?)

one more thing- if you're still flying woodies... you're not going to see nearly the same performance and crispness of flight that you would if you were running a decent set of carbon fiber blades. you don't really see anybody flying woodies on trex 500's

engine/frame- get the HH frame and z30 if you have the $$- i have both and my hurricane 550 flies much better than my trex500 as it is right now. i'd say it's much more powerful, it flies "lighter," easier to perform 3d, and much more stable. the only thing that i'd say the trex500 wins out in would be reverse flight. but, like i said- the best way to get a heli that flies like the trex500 is to buy a trex 500 (i like my hurri much better tho)

[mjdee14]

I agree with Bobby....if your looking for a trex 500 style...then get the trex....the 550 may never satisfy you.

Don't know what your flying style is....but the Gaui 850kva is a pig on amps..The scorpion motors have not had very good reviews on the 550..but 4:30 is about normal for flight times.....depending on how you fly.

When I started with a Z20 and 550 blades, I could get 7 -8 mins of just cruising around. As I started pushing it more with loops, rolls, stall turns.....my time went down......I set my timer for 4 mins and try to land within a few seconds....3300 lipos

One of the guys flys a t500 and it's like a "scalded bumble bee"....but look at some of the vids and you'll see the 550 can perform most any manuver out there.

Post your gearing, blades, etc and maybe we'll see something there that's wrong, but it may simply be the wrong motor/gearing....

[DerClown]

Well I know that I need CF blades, but I dont think, that they will improve it's power so much. I haven't bought them, after disapointment with my new scorpion. :DOH
My setup is:
Scorpion HK3026-kv1210
6s 3300 Zippies
Align 75A ESC
500 Woodies;
Plastic frame;
Gearing: 14:50:19:61 So at 100% thro curv my head speed should be around 2300 rpm.

I'm thinking, in the first place what I could do is to put short boom (now it has long boom), and put 425mm blades. But then I will have CG problems, due to large Lipos, so I have to mount rudder servo on the boom, to correct the CG a little bit. ;)

Or maybe I should go for something different :confused:

[dunkonu23]

I'm far from an authority, but I agree with the others. It would seem you're not happy with the Gaui. Plus if you're turning 2300 rpm with woodies, I would stop now because I think you're going to hurt someone when a blade gets thrown.

IF on the other hand if you want to continue, ditch the woodies, NOW. If you have not seen the damage a thrown blade can do your helicopter, at least think of the damage and possible injury/death a thrown blade can do. Once you get CF blades, you WILL see a performance increase. The increase may not be as much as you want, so you need to ditch the motor and get something else, too.

I have a TonicX Z30 and use 3300 mAh batteries at 35C and I could easily get 2500-2600 rpm with a simple gear change if I wanted it and the helicopter would be a beast! Right now, I'm at 2200-2300 and get 6:15 out of those batteries. I'm happy with it. I don't fly 3D, yet, but I expect the flight times to go down to around 5 minutes when I do.

Other than that, if you want a T-Rex 500, get a T-Rex 500. Your Gaui is going to always be a Gaui, if you're hung up on names.

Scott

[DerClown]

Im not spining them at 100 percent, at the moment they spining at 2100 rpm, so they are at max speed.

[mysticmead]

even at 2100 for extended periods the blades will fail.. also do you have CNC grips? if not.. ask Wazzer what happens when a grip fails in flight after prolonged 2100 RPM speeds.... he got to see first hand how quick a Hurricane can disassemble itself.

get CNC grips if you dont have them.. get CF blades.. they really do make a difference in how the heli flies..crank the head speed up to 2300 RPM and hold on because it'll jump around quick...

also if you want it to perform like a T500... then make it the same size as a T500.. that means shorter boom...and 425mm blades..... then gear it to get 2500-2700 RPM... that's where you get the scalded bumble bee action...

[nexgen]

What kinda power problem is it, just not enough pop, or does it bog or what? got vid?

this is me on 500m woodies, Stock Gaui 850Kv motor, 16/42/19/61 and used 20c 3s 3300 Zippies in series. some have commented in the 550 vids thread that it looks like alot of power, but I have never flown one this size so cant comment if it really is. It seems to have a fair amount of pop tho.

arXzeOqWsTI

[DerClown]

Damn, mine doesn't perform like that at all.... It bogs seriously during tic-tocs :dontknow
What's your collective pitch degrees ?

As for the wood blades, I have 3 sets of them , so first I think I have to crash them, at least couple sets, to change to CF blades :) Coz I have still to learn some tricks...

[skydude]

Nice work N.G. Seems you have gotten the hang of the 550.

I hope you have been flying a good amount of time more than 3 years or I may have to get embarassed.

Spankin nice.


--

[nexgen]

Well that flight was only the 3rd flight ever on the 550. I had never flown a heli this big until now. Only been flying the Gaui 200 about a year or so now, and only a 4#3 before that. I kinda started backwards on the size/learning curve thing and it seems to be paying off.

For my setup, here goes:
Gaui 850Kv. 16/42/19/61 (roughly 2000rpm, probrbly a little less than that in flight, kinda hard to tach in the air alone)
(2) Zippy 3s 20c 3300's I bought used on RCG.
500mm stock woodies.
+-12* collective, but rarely use the last few degrees either way.
Not sure on cyclic, just set the collective, then maxed the swash mix for cyclic to be just shy of binding at full deflective.

For most of the stuff you saw, except the stops, pumps, and quick direction changes, I had the collective pretty close to center, rarely going 1/3 to 1/2 up or down. Otherwise if it was needed, they were very short stabs with collective, just enough to stop or start a move, and then backing off right away. I've been focusing on collective management for some time now and it really pays off. I'd be willing to bet your heli has a lot more ability than it seems.

Afterall we can't just be throwing power and pitch at things to overcome what may very well be a needed adjustment in our flying style. I used to subscribe to the former, but now I subscribe to the latter and am so much more satisfied for making that shift in thinking.

Just my 2/100ths of a dollar

-Rob

[dunkonu23]

+1000 on collective management!!!! VERY, very well said!

Scott

[DerClown]

Okay, that was helpfull, but my DX6i has just 5 points on pitch curve:( But I still try to adjust that.

P.S.
Guys what you think about this deal at flying-hobby ?
Kinda good if upgrading 550 hurry to 425 ang geting spare and upgrade parts. But I dont think that fiber frame would fit 6s 3300 zippies.

flying-hobby.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=3_330_331&products_id=5708

[Mikej]

Okay, that was helpfull, but my DX6i has just 5 points on pitch curve:( But I still try to adjust that.

P.S.
Guys what you think about this deal at flying-hobby ?
Kinda good if upgrading 550 hurry to 425 ang geting spare and upgrade parts. But I dont think that fiber frame would fit 6s 3300 zippies.

flying-hobby.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=3_330_331&products_id=5708

To change to a 425 all you need is this http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/product_info.php?cPath=32_122&products_id=3408 , some 425 blades, shorter tail blades, optionally (ididn't fit them) smaller flybar paddles, and to change the gearing to raise it up to about 2400 - 2500.

I really like the look of that frame but it will only take mid-size (not standard size servos) so you will need new servos as well - or just use your existing frame + servos + head and just change boom, belt, rudder rod, tail blades and gearing and there you are - a 425 same as the IRCHA one

[DerClown]

Why to put smaller tail blades ? Maybe for me would make sense, because I have trex600 tail rotor grips.
Which rudder servo mount is better on boom - gaui or trex600 ?

[Mikej]

Why to put smaller tail blades ? Maybe for me would make sense, because I have trex600 tail rotor grips.
Which rudder servo mount is better on boom - gaui or trex600 ?

The Gaui 425 uses smaller tail blades - presumably as there is less torque to counter from the smaller main blades

[skydude]

Good show N.G.

I appreciate good practice. Of course it is the only thing besides ability that allows anyone to accomplish anything. but....

Way back when I was first exposed to Justin Chi I could only marvel at what I was apparently seeing (vids). Flying better probably than I can even dream of flying no matter how many hours I put in for the rest of my life.

I am curious what your hours are air/sim. I know there are large variances in everyone's ability. Did you just 'see' how it worked, or.....you have 8760 flight hours in that one year and are ready for a nap?

I will use the sim kicking and screaming but love airtime. Prolly,....average 3/4 to 1 hour a day for the last 3 years, and I suck. Having a great time and am in no hurry (no pun), but I am amazed at the things that seem to come naturally to some.

--

[nexgen]

I fly A LOT!

I posted the following in October in another thread about how much time actually in the air, not just setup, and charging etc, but time the heli is airborne.. pretty much the same frequency still, so the numbers are a little higher as of now.

How long have you been ACTUALLY flying? (http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=166038&page=3)

"I started flying in March of 08, and fly every day, even in the winter, save for the odd 2-3 days here and there waiting for parts, which is rare because I usually have things stocked up pretty well. so lets call it 300 days a year I fly.

each day I fly, I fly anywhere from 3-10 packs, so lets average that to 7 packs/day

my flights are timed at roughly 3 minutes, some longer, lets just go with 3.

so from march of 08 to march of 09, we'll call that 1 yr 300 days (from above), and from march to now is roughly 200 days (say 29 days average x 7 months), lets call it 180 days for down time like described above

now lets do some math
300 +180 = 480 days
7 packs x 3 min/pack = 21 min/day

21 x 480 = 10080 minutes, or 168 hours. or 7 days of straight flying."

another way to look at it is 7 packs/day average X 480 days = 3360 flights since I started the hobby a year and a half ago.

[skydude]

Now I know one of us is the evil twin.

I do about the same - per year - but have been doing it for 3 !!*9a&^*

And I fly my packs to 6 to 7 min. So that is roughly 5 to 6 times the airtime

(I think I know which one of us it is too)


--

[DerClown]

How you able to have so much free time in your day :confused::dontknow
Maybe you have flying field in your yard ?

[nexgen]

Well I have plenty of space to fly the 200 at home, the 550 too, but the airspace gets small pretty quick. I also bring my heli gear to work and fly in an empty lot there. I figure if I have time to smoke I have time to burn a pack through one of my birds too.

[Jerrymac]

Practice,practice practice, makes for a better pilot, that is why I stink at it.

My flying goes more like this. Go out on Sunday, crash King 2, then crash Blackhawk 450, then get in a couple flights with the Hurri 550.
Rest of week, wait for parts and rebuild crashed helis. Repeat next weekend.:DOH