aerials and legal disputes

[enigma]

Well, I've found a new use for my photos. Unfortunately I am the one in the legal dispute. After our house was built the developer built a few more around us and instead of trucking out the excavated soil, he spread it out causing extreme elevation changes surrounding our property. I had taken this photo one day while practicing and realized the value of it after having the elevations measured by a surveyor. The pano isn't great, but it shows the effects of the elevation changes. Any advise would be greatly appreciated!

[Nate Dogg]

I think as long as the height requirements are met, the developer is okay. You can do whatever you want with your lot before you build. Did you have an agreement with the developer about the surrounding properties when you bought your house? Your best bet might be to go after the drainage issue. Make a big deal out of it now, so that if your house ever floods in the future, you have a basis for a lawsuit. best of luck..

[gordohigh]

The house at +25 in. is draining on the property next door, (the gutters), and when it rains it goes there too.

In my area, we have an engineering inspection that covers drainage and where the water is supposed to go.

Most of these codes are based on weather or not you are in a flood zone, and if you are on a sewer system or septic tank. I think you could persue this thru you county/city engineering dept, and I think you can have something done about it at the developers expense. The neighbor with the low lot will surely complain after a rain storm floods his property... :)

[WayneBrown]

this is right up my alley.
Assuming the low house is yours, and that the reference elevation is 0" (your floor) the builders of the surrounding houses owe you some remedial work.
If your surveyor has done a topo of the area, it's a pretty cut and dried case to explain to a judge, provided you have the engineer list your home at the MSL elevation, and define it to represent an adjusted elevation of 0'0", or zero for reference.
Any reference points plotted out that refer to a positive elevation should have swales to carry rainwater to a low point drain not on your property.
You can ask your engineer to save his file as a .DWG AutoCad 2002 compatable, and email it to me along with contact information and I will clarify what needs to be represented to aid your case.
BTW: I deal with grades and drainage as part of my job as a Construction manager all the time. :D
brown.wayneb@gmail.com

[WayneBrown]

either get a higher aerial shot showing some curb inlets or drainage grates, or see if you can get the civil drawings for the development. indicate what lot is your also, BTW.
I can only see what appears to be one drain grate in front of the dumpster to the right of you, upper right quadrant of the photo. Are there others?

[enigma]

Freaks helping Freaks, I love it! Thanks Wayne, to start with, the low house is mine :oops: , The only drain is in front of my mail box, there are none in the entire cul de sac that they added! We have many pics showing the land was flat, I will see what I can get together. My neighbor is a surveyor, he brought home a transit and we shot the numbers I listed. Here's a few:

[WayneBrown]

I'd guess that neither of the neighboring houses to the right or top have closed?
If so, file a greivance with the building department and consider filing a lien against the developer/builder for both properties for damages.
it helps if it's in place prior to their closing, most banks will puke on the financing if a lien is found, and prevent the sale.
how long has it been since your closing? If you raise enough hell, perhaps the builder/developer will offer to buy yours back and offer you another. *hint, hint*

[enigma]

Funny, the house to the right closed last week, I warned the buyers of the potential problem, the one behind has not. How do I file a lien? We closed 12 months ago, but raised the issue immediately when they began construction on the adjacent properties. Seems like there should be a few more drains, huh? It looks like I need to go after the county, the developer and the construction company.

[WayneBrown]

liens are filed at the county clerck at the courthouse.
Many states require a legal representative to file, paralegal or laywer.
Filing a grievance with the county building department will muddy things up awhile, but they cannot force the builder to remedy it. Harrassment is a beautiful thing to have though, a few calls from the officials will buy you some time to approach the builder/developer and ask them to fix the nightmare they created, and build a case against them.
Document EVERYTHING! Keep a journal, preferably a composition book without perforated pages, or bound securely. Record even the trivial conversations related to this, and use FILM cameras with a datestamp to record anything you want to point out in court.
You need a lawyer to fight this and win. You will need a topographical survey from before the development started, and a current one.
Somewhere there is a record of the original lay of the land, including slopes, high points and runoffs. To permit the development, there is another to demonstrate there is positive drainage, and to layout all streets, easements, and utilities.
If they have deviated from the original plan without a variance, you are golden.
Call a few surveyors, portray yourself as a builder interested in a lot for speculative purporses, and ask if they did the topo for the development. When you find the right one, ask them to plot out the before and after topos, and point out cuts and fills.. Get them in your hands and document the reciept.

[enigma]

I've had the county surveyors and code enforcers out and every one seems nervous and points at each other. So far , the only near solution is the developer has stated he plans to install a sub surface drain in two locations, on each side of my property line. which were later described as "catch basins". While this may aleviate some of the water issues, I feel the value of my home has depreciated, some one needs to jack my house up and plant a basement under it, then regrade the yard! :arggg:

[WayneBrown]

finger pointing is SOP unfortunately.
There are recourses, and your developer has stated one. Catch basins / area drains, pretty much the same thing, they are also commonly known as yard drains or drop inlets.
Instruct them to place them on the proprty line AND pay YOU for the easements required to install and maintain them, it is their fault.
The only way to build a case I've described above, by calling around until you find the company that did the original topo.

[enigma]

I know the name of the surveyors, it was on the corner pipes! Do I just call them and ask for a copy of the topo?

[enigma]

Fit just hit the Shan! Thanks to the excellent guidance of fellow freak Wayne Brown I was able to show the county how bad this situation varied from the permitted plans. The county is using our aerials as evidence and basically the developer will have to tear down 4 houses and move a road, or do whatever makes us happy on our property, either tear down and rebuild or raise and install a basement, because we are not moving again!
Thanks Wayne! Note: Keep all of your aerials, even if they are of nothing, as one day they can be very useful!

[WayneBrown]

hey, hey!!
glad it's going your way.

[enigma]

The way I see it, to tear down 3 near finished homes, one finished and moved into, and relocate the road is going to be way over a million dollars. Did I actually take a million dollar picture?! It will be cheaper for them to buy us out at $750,000.00 than deal with the lawsuits from the other 4 homeowners who hired them to build the 4 in question. 6 months ago we simply asked for a truckload of dirt and the builder told us "absolutely not" was he spending any $ on "our problem". We paid $170k for this place, we'll see if it turns into a $750k retention pond :lol:
I'm sure it's still going to be a legal fight, but it's looking much better today, the builder has a reputation and the Building Commissioner actually thanked me, he stated: "Thanks to you we've finally got him!"
Maybe I'll be getting a new heli too :wink:

[Tonystott]

What a great result! Carvec here we come :D:D:D

[GJestico]

Hopefully the contractor doesnt just declare bankruptcy then start up under a new name a short time later. Thats what they do round here when the crap hits the fan.

[enigma]

Luckily there are two: The developer and the construction company!

[enigma]

Update: First, the builder is very big, they have two full sub divisions in the works presently, they are not going anywhere! So today there was no work done at all on any of the houses around us, apparently county told them they had to cease all work until they could prove my numbers to be wrong. They sent out a couple people with a laser transit and measured all 5 homes around us. I sweet talked the girl who holds the stick and got the numbers they came up with. The numbers in white are their measrements with my property as the 0 level. Looks worse now! Keep in mind that the 3 front houses are all supposed to be the same height with the one to the rear at +24. It also turns out our house was set 7 inches lower than code. I wonder what my property is worth to him? County says make it right by making us happy or they will bull doze everything and move the road, which would include revoking a co. It's getting messy now.

[askman]

well, good on ya. I hope you get everything.

[Tonystott]

I reckon you are going to come out of this just beautifully! Seems to me the cheapest solution for the builder is to bulldoze just your house and build up your land and then build a brand new house on the same site, plus of course provide you with generous compensation for the inconvenience!

A friend of mine lives in a huge urban development here in Sydney,
http://www.breakfastpoint.com/map.html
and the builder screwed up the water sealing on his balcony. They tried various band-aid "remedies", but due to complaints by owners, AND the need to keep their reputation intact, they have now ripped up the floor tiles, and done a proper sealing job, and will then fit new tiles. No big deal, except that I estimate they are doing this to HUNDREDS of properties. And this is four years after they built the properties.

So I reckon you are going to get what you want for the same reasons.

Good onya! :D:D

[WayneBrown]

Wow! That's a lot of deviation!
keep us posted.

[enigma]

Due to the fact that our house is 7 inches low, could they condemn our house? I could see it being much cheaper to pay off a county official than pay us!

[Tonystott]

Not if you make it very clear you have everything recorded and copies kept in a safe place!

[WayneBrown]

I wouldn't think so.
The builder and developer created this issue after your house was closed on.