Going Brushless (maybe) on the Blade CP

[F1Atom]

I have been flying on the Blade CP for a couple of months now. I can hover very well, fly side to side with the nose facing in the same directions and I am currently learning how to fly nose in. I just went through my first main motor after about 100+ flights and planning to change my tail motor too (suxs). There were no more brushes on the motor at all when I checked it.
I've been thinking about going brushless as a new upgrade so I don't have to deal with changing out worn out brushed motors. But to do that I would need a LiPo battery and new charger. This whole upgarde could get a little pricey. My question is: Is it possible to have a brushless setup and still use the Blade CP stock battery also? I am a college student on very tight budget with an addiction to RC helis. I would like to keep this upgrade as low cost as possible. I was planning to get the brushless combo from helidirect: http://www.helidirect.com/product_info.php?cPath=30_65&products_id=1616

Anybody, let me know if this would work
Thank You!!! :arggg: [/i]

[jediwannabe]

I know what you mean. The stock Blade could use more power too! Looks like a nice package. Sorry I can't answer the Lipo question(I bought the Pro so I have Lipo's and charger), but I hear withthe BL motor you may have trouble with the tail "holding" because the BL motor has more power and torque. You may need a seperate HH gyro and the CWS direct drive tail setup to hold it( you don't need the best gyro and the CSW kit is only 20-30$).
http://www.bladecprepair.com/man_tr_dd_conversion.html
The brushless conversion of a BCP is discussed here as well http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t220710p1/

[Rodan]

I noticed a decrease in flight times with the brushless upgrade on my BCP Pro, so I would guess you would have some pretty short flights on the stock CP non-lipo batteries.

Some sort of tail upgrade is a must for a BL setup, and I would definitely recommend a gyro as well...

An alternative is to use a stock Eflite brushed motor w/ 10t pinion (use w/ CF or wood blades - the plastic will draw too much power), and the GWS DD tail mod. Your BCP will fly very well like this, and total investment will be about $30. Yes you may have to replace the motor down the road, but you can buy a lot of $10 motors for what you would spend on the BL upgrade. After those mods, I would work on getting the thing on lipos to support future mods and give better flight times and more power. Don't waste time with the EFlite charger, get a DN14 or Cellpro, this will work with other helis, and bigger packs down the road, and will do a better job keeping your packs in good shape...

[BigMike]

I have to agree with Rodan. The Blade flies pretty darn good with just the Flight Enhancement Upgrade, Lipo, and duel-motor tail. The expensive part is a decent charger for the Lipo. Let's face it, 100+ hours on a $9.95 motor isn't bad at all.
Have as much fun as you can for as cheap as you can.

[F1Atom]

Thank You for the info

[F1Atom]

I might try the GWS tail mod. But first I must master the art of flying nose in. When I get that down I'll go with the mod and maybe some lipos as an award.

Oh ya, another thing with the CF blades, how durable are they, do they break or chip as easy as woodies? Im looking for something that doesn't chip as easily as the woodies. So far, I have never broken a set of wood blades in half (yet) even in a hard crash. I have just chip or scraped the plastic tape corvering the blades. I have had only 4 major crashes (inlcuding my first blade walk in the parking lot) in the 4-5 months I have been learning how to fly with damage only to the blades. As of now, my blades look like they have went through a battle in Iraq with small pieces of (bandage) tape covering different parts of the blades. Since I'm still learning and have the stock motor and batt do they have CF flat bottom blades?

Let me know
Thank YOu!

[Rodan]

F1 - I'd get that tail mod done, it will make mastering nose-in much easier, and will make your flying much more enjoyable.

The CF blades are really nice. Stiff and light, the BCPP flies very well with them. Mine have survived many a minor oops on grass, and unlike the plastics, they don't transfer a lot of energy to the rotor head. My last mainshaft survived about 4-5 crashes until I really did it in. Just stay off hard surfaces if possible... I destroyed a set of CFs with one crash in a parking lot.

AFAIK, there aren't any flat bottom CFs out there for the BCP. If you find any, let me know, as I would really like a set... ;)

[Slick]

I might try the GWS tail mod. But first I must master the art of flying nose in. When I get that down I'll go with the mod and maybe some lipos as an award.

Oh ya, another thing with the CF blades, how durable are they, do they break or chip as easy as woodies? Im looking for something that doesn't chip as easily as the woodies. So far, I have never broken a set of wood blades in half (yet) even in a hard crash. I have just chip or scraped the plastic tape corvering the blades. I have had only 4 major crashes (inlcuding my first blade walk in the parking lot) in the 4-5 months I have been learning how to fly with damage only to the blades. As of now, my blades look like they have went through a battle in Iraq with small pieces of (bandage) tape covering different parts of the blades. Since I'm still learning and have the stock motor and batt do they have CF flat bottom blades?

Let me know
Thank YOu!

Hmm, I am not sure what direction to give you. I will tell you what I have learned. I have the BCPP. I flew it for a short time before I upgraded to the brushless set up and then a gyro. It took a lot of reasearch and found the GWS direct drive tail is the best, at least for the burshless set up. It will take more current though. My heli will actually loose altitude when the tail has to kick in strong. I have the dual tail drive and it works fine after you adjust the balance but it cost more then the GWS DD tail.

I absolutely love my heli now (well except for a major glitching problem I have). The one thing I learned is, with each upgrade, I needed more upgrades to get it to fly right. For instance, when I got the brushless I then needed the gyro, then the tail could not hold it and I then needed to upgraded that (the GWS is only about $12, the best bang for your buck).

The other issue is, with the brushless you seem to break things faster. I am constantly breaking the tail boom all the time because I use plastic blades. I went to plastic blades because with the extra head speed I was damaging the stock blades faster. From what I have been told about the carbon fiber blades is that they tend to chip and break real easily, so I never tried them and just went to plastic.

I don't want to say how much I have into my heli but it is a lot. Easily the cost of a TRex.

Currently my bird is grounded until the new Spektrum 6100 receivers are out. I am hoping that will fix my glitching issue. I recently bought a TRex SE and a DX7 and I am in the process of building it.

So, what have I learned? I absolutely loved upgrading my BCPP, I loved working on the bird, and I don't mind the cost I put into it. With the brushless set up it flys very nice!

If I had to do it all over? I wish I would have kept her all stock and saved up for the TRex right off the bat.

That is my 2 cents, I think I was on topic. I hope it was helpfull.

-Craig

[F1Atom]

Thank You all for the help.

If the GWS draws more current I might not do the DD tail yet. I'm am still on the stock batteries struggling to get 8-10mins of flight time out of them. I do like fact they last longer. I dunno I'll think about it. Too many decisions!

Question for "Rodan" are you using sym CF blades with the stock motor? If you are, I heard the heli has a hard time lifting off due to lack of power from the stock battery. Just wondering. Oh ya, I too have crashed in the parking lot by putting the heli on its side (almost did the chicken dance of death) but somehow I didn't break any blades just chipped them. Keep in mind these are woodies. I was still able to fly after the heli spent a day in the ICU receiving wound treatment. :arggg:

[F1Atom]

Oh ya, Craig. Congrats on your TRex SE. I too plan to save up for a belt driven heli when I get into 3D. But not sure if I should stay micro or go to a .30 size.

If I was going to stay mirco I was planning on getting the Esky Belt CP and my own electronic (cheap heli but good quality according to what I hear)

If I was going for a .30 size I was thinking about the Century Swift 16. Batteries get pricey when getting this kind of Heli.

I prefer electric right now because of the convenience of being able to fly anywhere. When I start college in Jan 2007 I plan to fly my blade around the school parking lots (maybe a classrom if I'm sneaky enough, hehe)

I would like to go nitro but I don't have any cool neighbors. There is a field near by but I don't want to pay for membership. Plus when I learn I like to be alone and not worry about anything else. Too many decisions!

[Slick]

Oh ya, Craig. Congrats on your TRex SE. I too plan to save up for a belt driven heli when I get into 3D. But not sure if I should stay micro or go to a .30 size.

If I was going to stay mirco I was planning on getting the Esky Belt CP and my own electronic (cheap heli but good quality according to what I hear)

If I was going for a .30 size I was thinking about the Century Swift 16. Batteries get pricey when getting this kind of Heli.

I prefer electric right now because of the convenience of being able to fly anywhere. When I start college in Jan 2007 I plan to fly my blade around the school parking lots (maybe a classrom if I'm sneaky enough, hehe)

I would like to go nitro but I don't have any cool neighbors. There is a field near by but I don't want to pay for membership. Plus when I learn I like to be alone and not worry about anything else. Too many decisions!

Hehe, you sound just like me. I personally will only do electric for 2 main reasons. I like how quiet it is compared to a nitro one, the other is rather silly but I am a bit strange, I can’t stand to get my hands dirty and oily. Those nitro produce a lot of smoke and get this oily film on everything. I also don’t find it appealing transporting fuel and have it potentially get all over my trunk. I know many people love them so this is just my preference.

I was telling my friend how I have been getting into the heli’s and he told me when he was watching a guy fly in the field behind his house. He said he thought it was cool but it was loud and kind of annoying. Since I fly in places like that I would prefer not to annoy other people.

I will admit, I was close to getting the same belt driven model you are talking about. It looked pretty nice. At the end of the day I kind of decided to go with the 450 SE. I am kind of hooked at the moment though, so now that I have the Transmitter I may end up giving it a try later down the road. Who knows, I think it looks cool!

I do have one thing that I have to warn you about. One of the reasons I went brushless is because after the 2nd flight I put on some plastic blades. This took me a while to figure out but it ruined my motor. The stock motor just did not have enough umph to fly with plastic blades and my training gear. I found this is a common problem for those brushed motors. The stock set up works very well and when you start changing some things it forces you to go down an expensive road.

Just my experiences, they are not right or wrong, just what I have learned what works for me.

Oh yeah, one other thing, depending on what college you are going to you will have a very good opportunity to find a place to fly. I went to Michigan State, which is pretty big with lots of big classrooms. I think if you do not tear them up but during odd hours I am willing to bet you will be able to find a quiet place somewhere. If you ask permission you may be told no or you may get a lot of help. All depends on the person.

Thanks,

-Craig

[Pinecone]

I am looking at a belt driven 300 sized heli also. BTW, with a HH gyro you don't need a mixer. You do need an ESC for the tail motor, but a cheap GWS will work. Your main motor ESC should have a BEC capable of running everything, so pull the red wire out of the connector on the tail ESC.

The Hornet X3D is on serious sale right now at www.mscompositusa.com Pro version (CNC parts included) down to $185. But replacement parts are crazy priced.

HDX300 - the version 2 sounds like they may have fixed things.

Compy 300 from www.aero-fever.com A bunch of people over on RC Groups are starting to play with this one, and it does look nice.

[Rodan]

Question for "Rodan" are you using sym CF blades with the stock motor? If you are, I heard the heli has a hard time lifting off due to lack of power from the stock battery.

I have the BCP Pro, which came with Lipos, so it's a little different, but yes, it flew fine with the CF blades and the stock motor. As I said, a really nice setup for the Blade (with lipos) is the stock motor w/ 10t pinion, CF or wood blades, and a GWS tail. Flies really nicely, and good power.

You really should make lipos your first upgrade. You can probably pick up an Eflite charger used for ~$10, then save for a good charger. Even with it's limitations, it'll work for you for the short term.

Also, having just finished a TRex SA, I would definitely step up to that level rather than getting a micro with a driven tail. The bigger helis just fly so much better...

[F1Atom]

Thanks for the tips.

I think I need to start saving money$

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

I have a couple Trex's and still fly the CPP more. Its really easy to pack it up and head out. Crashes aren't going to cost $50+ so theres a tendency to relax a little when flying it, which helps your confidence. Yes the Trex flies much much better and is well worth the investment but I don't like to fly mine in bad weather (Cold up here) so I will have to wait for the spring. The CPP is cheap to fix and I fly it whenever the wind isn't blowing too hard. Its good practice for the Trex because if you can do it on the CPP you can easily do it with a Trex. Maybe in a few years when I am a better pilot I will be able to impress the ladies with my CPP skillz :D

[F1Atom]

Speaking of the cold. I'm planning to go up to the mountains and play/fly in snow. Question: is it ok to use the NiMH batteries in such cold weather? or will it destroy them. Just wondering. I know LiPos can't be used in really cold weather I dunno about NiMH. Hey, if I am lucky I may be able to do some FFF in the air and on ice haha.

Another thing, would it be wise to clean out and then lubricate the stock brushed motor every once in awhile to improve performance and durability?

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Everybody!

[Pinecone]

Hmm, my crashes with my Trex have cost less than my Blade CP.

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

Mine cost more probably due to high headspeed and waist high maneuvering, that and the insane power of the medusa 28-40-3400. Last 2 crashes on the rex have been inverted into the ground, last one at about 25 MPH. Last crash cost me a whole head, tail, boom, belt, gears, main shaft, feathering shaft, canopy, blades, TR blades, fins, landing gear, frame. Yes I hit throttle hold right away, but it was too late to save anything. Electronics were ok though, 65 MG servos still working good. I upgraded some parts after that crash so next time it should break less.

The CP usually just pops a link loose, messes up the tail boom sometimes or breaks the bell/hiller links, the CF blades can take some abuse and the supergear works well. No where near the power of the rex so most crashes are fairly sedate and I don't break a thing, or I have just been lucky so far.


NiMH batteries should be fine in the cold as long as they aren't out too long first.

Very good idea to clean and relube the motor once in a while.