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Stallion
09-18-2010, 01:29 AM
Ok sometimes this hobby really sucks!! Yesterday i flew my beloved Kasama 90E.
3min into the third flight of the day i was about 150m high and i dived down but when i tried to pull her up i had no control. At least it felt that way.

after 150m full speed nose dive into terrain. nearly the whole bird was lost. I don't have to mention i was really down and pissed that a 2200 bird smashed into the ground without any doing from my end.
The biggest los in my opinion was the Jive ESC the two batteries.
First i thought: get a knew kit but the aluminum parts are quite stirdy and i noticed the only the plastic and carbon fiber parts need replacing.

There is a question in there somehwere.
Where is the best place to buy Parts for that thing.
No one has the battery tray's as i noticed.
The frame halfs are extremely expensive. Puh!
The rest not as expensive as i thought it would be.

Mercuriell
09-18-2010, 01:41 AM
So sorry to hear of your bad luck :) I had that happen to mine twice - are you fbl and using the Jive Bec ? A power brownout will cause this - see my sticky thread on this. You probably will be better off buying new kit and keeping the remains as spares - Concept Copters in Uk seem to have good range of spares.

hope ur back in the air again soon !

Stallion
09-18-2010, 03:05 AM
Yes i was using the double BEC supply from the Jive. But during that maneuver i wasn't moving the sticks at all and i don't think the BeastX was doing much either. I was planning on putting a small battery (4 cell NiCad 800mah) on the bird as backup.

i think counting all the parts is worth it in order to save some money. All the metal parts are intact. I have to check the bearings to see how many i have to replace. The torque tube i think i can replace by a metal arrow or tube of some kind. the tail braces are also easy replaced by some carbon fiber tube from the hobby shop. money isn't a surplus those days. i don't really know what happened and i think i never will know what happened. I will follow your advise on the rebuild!

The first estimate for costs would be 700$ including the Jive the blades the servo gears and one set of Zippy's. a new kit would be 999$ i see what i will do.

Later that day i will dismantle the whole pile of smashed parts and see what i can salvage.
Not the first and not the last heli that i have and i will crash but that thing wasn't cheap! (2200)
Sometimes i think that this hobby has gotten way to expensive for my budget. But i will sell my 600N and my Hurricane to liquidate some assets. It is like a drug! :-)

I will post a pick from the wreckage on the bench.

Stallion
09-18-2010, 03:55 AM
small Vid what we did with the Lipo after the crash!! :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6X36pR1Os0

burn baby burn!!!

jamin_00
09-18-2010, 07:31 AM
Ah man, really not good to read this :(

Like said we do have spares in stock and kits with the painted canopy ;)

We have sent a few orders this week alone over to the states so you will shortly see some stock canopies flying around :)


If you are stuck for anything give me a shout. I don't come on here much but am on heliaddict all the time :)

Hope to hear you get it back in the air soon.

Stallion
09-24-2010, 07:11 PM
Ok finally i did a headcount of all the parts i need to get the Fai Fa up and running again!!
Puh!!! The biggest los are the two main frame parts, the canopy and the JIVE ESC.
it will be about 1000 incl. batteries, blades and servo gears and cases.

KSM70-F18H Plastik Landing Gear 9.09$
KSM10-F25 Landing Skids Pipe set 10.00$
KSM40-90F04 Main Frame LH 99.95$
KSM40-90F03 Main Frame RH 99.95$
KSM30-118 Flank Bearing 2.42$
KSM10-F11 Balance Damper Mount Rod Alu 16.85$
KSM30-110 Ball Bearing 9.09$
KSM70-TSO4 Crown Gear 70T 19.50$
KSM20-C01 Joint Coupling plate 8.75$
KSM40-F11 Battery Tray ?
KSM40-F12 Battery Tray ?
KSM20-90H01 Spindel Shaft set 12.00$
KSM20-T02 Tail Rotor Shaft 7.80$
KSM40-T02 Tail Boom 38.75$
KSM20-H07 Mixing Arm Rod 75mm 9.50$
KSM20-TS02 Main Mast 12.85$
KSM10-T27 Torque Tube Set 24.28$
KSM70-F17 Painted Canopy 120.00$
KSM70-H01 Radius Arms Plastic 5.72$
KSM70-F08 Clip lock 3.43$
KSM30-102 Thrust Bearing 6.06$
KSM10-F15 Body Mount 90E set 14.00$
KSM70-H03 Ball link plastic black 6.50$
Total amount of 536,49$

IMO that was the worst crash you can have and i am glad that most of the bird is made from high quality Aluminium. Nothing was bend. some scratches on the Battery tray mounts but still in condition to use them. No screws and bolts where missing or damaged. And i won't start to blam the heli design for the los of the ESC or Battery. If you place it at the Back like on the 700E then you go in tail first and damage it.
i think in a small or light crash that thing hold up very well.
Not even the main gear has a scratch only the crown gear got stript in one place.
what i do like also is that the torque tube is made simply out of an arrow that you can buy in a pack of 10 and replace them if needed.
the only shocker was the price for the side frames and the canopy as mentioned.

So much for the first really hard crash after 8 flights! Man that still hurts a bit!!

hookmaker
09-25-2010, 02:13 AM
Yeah, that's a pretty bad crash - but soon you will have the parts to rebuild..:)

/Henrik

Mercuriell
09-25-2010, 05:39 AM
Yes the frames are expensive - I hope Kasama brings out some G10 ones like the ECO - I'd be a bit cautious of rebuilding TT - it's not really worth it - it's quite a lot of work to remove the end caps (roll pin & glue) take out the ali plug from the old TT to put in the new arrow shaft - then remove the bearings which may be damaged - better off not to break them but only rebuild if you're desperate or curious (I'm both)

Stallion
09-26-2010, 05:33 AM
@Mercuriell: unaware of your advise i already took it and ordered "at my dealer of choice" :-) a new torque tube set. But i will keep the parts from the oldone and order some arrow shafts and try to rebuild one just for the fun of it. And if i crash it the next time i should have plenty at hand!! :) the bearings are still Ok but it is a pain to get them of the boom as i secured them with CA on the shaft. will post some pic's of wrack!
stay tuned

hookmaker
09-26-2010, 06:09 AM
I have those arrow shafts but haven't crashed yet - so not tried to dis-assemble torque tube yet. But I guess it will come some day:)

/Henrik

Mercuriell
09-26-2010, 07:40 AM
It's not a difficult job - I have done several - heat is the key to loosen the end caps and bearings - there are also aluminium plugs in the shaft you have to remove with screw extractors - mm might do a video :) - Have done a few of these today as I am experimenting with different TT bearings and mounts

hookmaker
09-26-2010, 08:00 AM
Please do - or give a detailed description - I have a feeling I'll need it soon:)
John, where are you posting with regards to FAIFA vibes (you and Mr. Mel)?

/Henrik

WillJames
09-26-2010, 08:11 AM
Sorry to hear about the carnage of your crash. I have planted a MA Ion-X HARD nose first and not including blades or packs it was almost 700 US to fix.



Yes the frames are expensive - I hope Kasama brings out some G10 ones like the ECO - I'd be a bit cautious of rebuilding TT - it's not really worth it - it's quite a lot of work to remove the end caps (roll pin & glue) take out the ali plug from the old TT to put in the new arrow shaft - then remove the bearings which may be damaged - better off not to break them but only rebuild if you're desperate or curious (I'm both)

+1

Depending on what the TT ends look like, if it is Bergen/MA style, get the Bergen ones as replacements. They are super easy to install and remove, no glue or roll pins needed. All you do is cut the arrow shaft to length then install the ends with some grub screws. If they are not like the Bergen/MA style and you are not good a gluing or dont have a torch to get them off or a drill press to drill precisely, just buy another Kasama TT from your parts supplier of choice.

Stallion
09-26-2010, 12:49 PM
I know every post is worthles without pic's. So here are some. not from the crash site itself i am afraid but you get an idea of the demage.

fletch1
09-27-2010, 10:04 AM
hi stallion,
i am so sorry for what happened to you heli and i hope you rebuild soon. however,i am concerned about what caused your unfortunate crash. do you know if the jive has a problem cutting out with low voltage ,or would a seperate power supply for the receiver etc be the answer?

i am about to start assembling my faifa 90e and i am very cautious about what speed controller to use, castle or jive . please advise

best regards
fletch 1

Stallion
09-28-2010, 03:46 PM
Hello Fletch! I have heared some theories what could have happened. One made the most sense for me. Because after that crash it is nearly impossible to tell what caused it. The Jive BEC is able to handle the Amp's of my setup but when, like in my situation , the servos aren't drawing any serrious current because i was at a nos down free fall with 0 pitch the the Jive BEC is throttling back on power but is keeping it's 5,6V. the i started to pull out and obviously the Voltage drops due to the sudden servo load on the BEC. But low enough causing the Rx to reinitialize and of course the Beastx to do that to and that was taking too long.

Kontronik advises to put a small 4 call receiver battery in the system along with the BEC unlike other ESC the Kontronik ESC allowing multiple power sources. Or much mor depending on them to buffer spikes.

that is my most likely explanation. But if anyone can disproof that with hard facts then please do. I am always eager to learn.

My advise is that you use the JIVE even if it is expensive but the power it can create with the Pyro is insane and the governor is holding very good. the ESC and the motor are after all made from the same company and matched to each other. But use a i.e. 800mah 4 cell NiCad or NiMh battery to buffer any voltage drops during operation. use both BEC connections from the Jive to spread the Amp load and i think you should be fine. i will do exactly as i described. these are my 5 cents

Greets from Germany

billiano
10-11-2010, 03:45 AM
Stallion sorry to hear man about your heli.
I had the same thing from lower height but the sama damage in $$$
I was looking in RunRyder and there was a guy selling many things from a Faifa at a low cost

Stallion
10-11-2010, 04:45 PM
Thanks Billiano,

I started my rebuild and i am nearly finished. Have all the parts thanks to Henrik aka hookmaker! The airframe is completed and i have setup my electronics (BeastX and Servos). I replaced the bearings in my Pyro motor.
Installed it and adjusted backlash. Now i try to do a clean wiring job on that bird. The only thing i am waiting for is my new Jive and the back up battery pack(4cell eneloop).
But when fate strikes. One week later my Logo 500 fell out of the sky the same way the Kasama did. Man that made me very sad and my bank account was crying too.

What was the cause of your grounding? Are you already back up in the air?

Greets from Germany

billiano
10-11-2010, 06:43 PM
I had placed by my mistake the piston mark ,in my YS91SR ,at 2 o'clock
influenced by OS MAX instead of 7 o'clock.:arggg:
So severe vibes at 0 pitch and full throttle ....:badair:
The rest is history and a spectacular eject of my battery at 15metres away.:noteworthy

Now I did mods in the tank frame ,not that close gear mess, Kasama Gyro Option base ,New YS bearings .
And the bird flies 10min 3D with +/-12 ,also 1080/sec or more pyro and a lot of power at 100 Celcius.

marcosp
10-12-2010, 05:07 PM
But use a i.e. 800mah 4 cell NiCad or NiMh battery to buffer any voltage drops during operation. use both BEC connections from the Jive to spread the Amp load and i think you should be fine. i will do exactly as i described. these are my 5 cents
Greets from Germany

Would you expand on how that would be setup? The NiCad plugged to another channel on the Rx? How does the Jive accept more than one power source and why is it different to other ESCs in this regard?
Thanks.

aussiemick
10-12-2010, 08:10 PM
By placing a fully charged 4 cell NiMh (or NiCd) in between the ESC and the Rx the 5.5V (or thereabouts) coming from the ESC keeps the NiMh battery fully charged, if the ESC drops out the NiMh pack will still supply the RX (and servos) with power to land the heli hopefully safely.

MIck

Vetequk
10-13-2010, 05:25 AM
So are you saying that if I attach a Y lead from the master connection on the esc & connect it to my throttle channel on the receiver & a small 800mah battery. That will take care of any fluctuation in the power?

KnifeEdgeUk
10-13-2010, 11:14 AM
I have a 800mah Eneloop nimh plugged into a spare port on the rx. Just connect it when I fly.

I'll take a photo when I'm home.

Mercuriell
10-13-2010, 03:35 PM
So are you saying that if I attach a Y lead from the master connection on the esc & connect it to my throttle channel on the receiver & a small 800mah battery. That will take care of any fluctuation in the power?

It will prevent brownouts due to ESC reset - the FBL setup can draw peaks of well over 10A - if you have a fast reset ESC and radio you might not even notice it - if not :(

You can plug the 4 cell into any spare socket or if not have a Y connector on a lead as James suggests

aussiemick
10-13-2010, 09:30 PM
It would be easiest to have a switch between the NiNh pack and the device it is plugged into.

Just don't forget to turn it off between flights :)

MIck