View Full Version : nitro for weekends
Eric C.
12-25-2006, 07:58 PM
xircom, if you don't mind me asking, where did you get a kit like that and how much did you pay for it??
I fly a Shuttle ZXX and are looking for my next bird to buy with a little bit more power.
xircom
12-25-2006, 08:14 PM
got it from Champ in Tokyo, one of the biggest and best, cheapest RC shop here IMHO
they ship also international, visit http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/Champ_International/International_index.htm
pricing lists are here http://www.rc-champ.co.jp/Champ_koukoku/car_index2.html (click on right side PDF under "how to order"
page 2 pdf are the glow helis and sets, so mine is incl. 50SX upper right 53'200Y (447.2$ around)
Is this is difficult to understand, send mail to international e-mail
Of course I don't know about shipping conditions and price ...
Hope that helps,
xircom
12-28-2006, 08:35 AM
Now I got it almost together, very solid and nice machine !
As glow newbie, I got those two green things (see picture) one for the fuel tube (when flying) and one for the motor (when re-fill), they have one side to restrict the fuel flowing, the other side is for what ? The end of the tube ?
Second thing I realized, is - that according to the manual, the radius of the arm of the tail servo is 17mm. Doing this bends the pushrod downwards, because the holes of the pushrod holder (lowest position as in the manual) are lower, see picture. Should I turn the pushrod holders hole more upwards ?
Thanks a lot again !
xircom
12-28-2006, 08:37 AM
Now I got it almost together, very solid and nice machine !
As glow newbie, I got those two green things (see picture) one for the fuel tube (when flying) and one for the motor (when re-fill), they have one side to restrict the fuel flowing, the other side is for what ? The end of the tube ?
Second thing I realized, is - that according to the manual, the radius of the arm of the tail servo is 17mm. Doing this bends the pushrod downwards, because the holes of the pushrod holder (lowest position as in the manual) are lower, see picture. Should I turn the pushrod holders hole more upwards ?
Thanks a lot again !
You only need one of those green fuel clip thingos
Shorten the refueling segment and put the cutoff valve on the main line.
So you use the stopper to block the refueling line
and the cutoff valve on the main line to shut down the engine
You have the push rod guide too close to the servo, move it down the boom
I think I used 19mm to get full tail pitch slider throw
xircom
12-28-2006, 05:15 PM
thank you !!! :noteworthy
xircom
12-28-2006, 08:47 PM
confused to the throttle settings (could call the shop, but their japanese is too fast for me ...), looks in the picture, looks that the carburetor has "needs special settings" (additional paper in manual now). It has several positions
0% opened (?) -> Engine Stop
from 1-3 marks, 1st mark (neutral) -> Idle mode (?)
100% opened -> Full High (power)
The travel adjust for the 9x they say L(100%) H(135%), so I set this, then this "neutral" position, is that the 0% of the trottle stick, so that the motor does not die when full low or is 0% above corresponding with 0% of throttle, means motor goes off when stick is down ? In this case, what is then this neutral for ... and what position shall it have on the throttle stick ?!
Thanks !!!!
Argg - this old chestnut - it confuses everybody 1st time
1) You sould aim to keep the throttle ATV (Hi/Lo) the same - so start with 100/100
2) Drop your throttle trim to the bottom
3) Measure from the center of the throttle axle to the center of the servo spline
this becomes your starting length for the throttle push rod,
rod end link center to center
4) Get the balls onto the throttle servo and the carb at the same diameter
13mm is common
this is often dictated by available holes on the carb lever
5) Loosen the the carb throttle lever, then put the throttle rod on
6) Turn the TX and model on, drop the throttle to the bottom
(make sure throttle curve is 0 50 100)
7) Turn the carb axle with your hand to close the carb
rotate clockwise (rearward)
8) Gently nip the carb lever up to firm
7) Raise the throttle stick to the top
8) If the carb does not fully open, increase the ATV's to say 105/105
If the servo binds (too much travel), reduce the ATV's to say 95/95
Now go back to step 7
Keep doing this until full swing of servo matchs full close to open of carb
One trick to check you get full open
Raise the throttle to max
Turn the model off
Now turn the servo with your hand try to open throttle further
9) After doing this you will find that 50% throttle will have the levers
at very close to 90 degrees to the throttle rod
10) Raise throttle trim to half way for initial idle setting
We want to hover in normal mode at 40 to 50 % throttle
I assume you will hover at 75% stick (3D mode)
Normal mode throttle curve 0 15 35 45 75 100 for the JR 5 point
Hope that makes sense
xircom
12-29-2006, 01:05 AM
this makes perfectly sense, I think you should send this to Hirobo or post a sticky :wink:
I see no point in hirobo's "from 1-3 marks, 1st mark (neutral) -> Idle mode (?) ", anyway it seems, that neutral (50%) stick is now very close to this mark anyway. Cool.
Yes I want to hover 75% stick - no matter what mode. Hirobo suggests 50% throttle at midstick, at 75% they have around 70% throttle, shall be same in normal and idle when switching in hover I guess, otherwise the heli will jump or fall ... Your Hovering has 6 points ? Anway I have 7 points, in this case I would put for example 0, 30, 45, 50, 55, 70, 100 and hovering would be 62%, is this too much for evo50 ?
Good stuff :wink:
Hirobo are biased towards F3C flight and setup - hence they say hover at 50%
I have 5 point curves in a Futaba 9C
Whoops, I stuffed up with the curve, missed a point :arggg:
Try this 0 15 35 40 45 75 100
You need to hover around 50% throttle and 5 to 5.5 degrees of pitch
(62.5% is too much for sure)
Pitch range -9 0 +9
Head speed of 1700 in normal mode is good (for the 30 class)
1900 or 1950 in idle up
xircom
12-29-2006, 03:42 AM
cool. had to correct the throttle a bit, above curve gives more than 50% on 3/4 stick, so I have 0, 15, 35, 40, 45, 55, 100
Can send you the excel if you like... does it look ok ?
Hopefully get the money soon for a governor !
THANKS SO MUCH AGAIN.
Wow - good thinking - you're doing great
You've nailed the throttle curve
The pitch curve needs to be 0 at mid stick in all modes
You don't need to use all 7 points
Set the low, mid=0 and high
and then disable the other 4 points
You're nearly there...
xircom
12-29-2006, 06:20 AM
oh this means it's the same linear curve (-9 to 9 deg) no matter which mode ? I somehow remember someone saying for Normal and idle up-1 it's linear -4 to 8 or so, because if you don't fly inverted, but just loop or so, then so much minus is not really needed, and better sensitivity in lower ranges ..
Also one hopefully last one ... the low stick - or throttle hold in auto training, is that 10% probably ok ? This should not have power to turn, and does not let the engine die either.
Normal mode -5 0 +9
idle up 1 and 2 should be -9 0 +9
Disable the 4 intermediate points - the TX will calculate them to linear
Having different idle ups gets confusing - can make a mistake and crash
I only use different idle ups for more headspeed
Low throttle in normal mode should be 0 on the pitch curve
Hold mode has a throttle % - with the heli sitting there at idle
I switch between idle and hold and set the hold throttle % to match idle trim
You need this so that the clutch disengages
xircom
12-29-2006, 09:07 PM
thank you again, I don't exactly know "Low throttle in normal mode should be 0 on the pitch curve" with "Normal mode -5 0 +9", means it's going very quickly to 0 after -5 ?
One hopefully last one, what I cannot find on any pages : What is the Ampere draw of an elecric starter for the 50 machine ? I can use my 2 x 3S/4000 (11.1V) in parallel, or does it have to be 4S ?
Whoops - Low throttle in normal mode should be 0 on the throttle curve
The normal mode pitch curve, -5 0 +9
the curve from -5 to 0 is more shallow than 0 to +9
It's fine - works well
You never use the low point in normal mode except when idle or spool down
My starter has 12 NiMH 2400 cells - draws up to 33 amps to start the OS50
Depends on your starter as to how high you can go on volts
xircom
12-30-2006, 01:54 AM
Understood ! Yes, better not have so much different idles ...
12 NiMH corresponds to 4S LiPo, 33 amps no problem - my Lepton draws double sometimes :wink: Hope everything will go well, and thanks so much - hopefully the treats bring not only myself forward.
Best wishes on your flying!
xircom
12-31-2006, 02:30 AM
Guys, sitting here in the field have some problems with needle setting, too rich, too lean ... How many turns is normal with os50sx ? Thanks a lot
It depends on your nitro %, oil type and oil percentage and your altitude
I run 20% nitro, 20% Klotz KL198 LV Oil
I'm near sea level
1.25 turns on the main needle is always safe,
how lean you can go is variable,
1 turn is common, some can go lower
45 to 50 degrees on the back plate is a good place to be
The idle mix should be at about 2pm
xircom
12-31-2006, 07:20 AM
oh I have 23% nitro and almost sea level, haha I had 2 - 2.5 turns first just to be safe, it made hell of smoke, but maybe it's not too bad, the motor was barely warm in idle for the first tank, and quite ok for the 2nd and 3rd hovering, and gentle forward flight ... Nevertheless I never went under 1.5 turns today, which is I hope good for break in, I was just afraid of overheating it already first couple of min ... So let's get more out tomorrow !!! Yeah, it hovers very nicely ! Thank you so much :mrgreen:
No problem - happy to help
Don't run it too rich - that will actually prevent the parts from mating
and you also need to get heat into the engine
1.5 turns for a few flights should be ok
but get it in to 1.25 asap - which I still expect to be rich but very usable
I find that the ringed OS heli engines are very well made
and need only minimal running in
I get into idle up and full 3D at flight 6
xircom
12-31-2006, 09:49 AM
yes, will do this tomorrow, few with 1.5 and then 1.25 towards 1...
Happy new year to you and all !
xircom
01-01-2007, 02:00 AM
Wow today first real flight, no loops etc yet, but it flies so good, very easy compared to lepton, much more stable, still powerful though, 1.5 turns on the needle is very fine, what happened is, the glow came loose, luckily I realized after flight, but somehow the engine went so hot, the remote glowplug plastic cap protector melted, and it went broken, replaced and finally after 6 flights also at the end my rx battery became so tired so that the tail servo wasnt working properly anymore, although i still had green light on volt spy, so i found out how to land in a piruette ! Lucky my reflexes, nothing really went broken. So i feel now very happy in new year, jafa if you should be in tokyo someday, owe you couple of beers, tired I get some sleep
Heh - sounds great - this hobby always has some unexpected incident!
Well done saving the Sceadu
I agree that Sceadu hovers more stable than the Lepton
But the Lepton seems VERY fast in forward flight
Be careful with the voltspy
I used a variable voltage power supply to test ten of those devices,
only three gave results that would make for safe flying indication!
One was even green at 4.4 volts (that's operationally flat)
I do travel to Asia from time to time so maybe we can meet one day