Total G Collective problem [Archive]

Nutbag

10-24-2010, 05:35 AM

Hello all,

Hoping someone can help me.... I have mounted the G into its second machine and I am having trouble with the collective. I set 14Deg +/- on cyclic and collective, Back the ATV's down for ail/elev cyclic and leave Collective where it is. Set pitch curves to get 13+/- deg.

When flying it feels like im only getting 9Deg max of collective and the collective stick feels soft and almost delayed. You can up the ATV's for collective and get 16Deg on the ground then when flying it feels better but still Very delayed/soft. It gets scary to fly at that pitch as the stops are so slow, still dont think its getting the 16Deg in the air or you would hear it.

Cyclic ail/elevator control is perfect, at higher gains its almost too fast, so no issue at all there.
But a hard collective stop of any kind is impossible there is a weird delayed feeling and it's just not sharp.
Any help here on what I may have messed up would be greatly appreciated.

Heres my setup........

F.C gains currently 58 (tried from 40-80 at 80 it was worse)
Using trim lock pretty much all of the time.
Cyclic Stops are and everything else is still set std.

T700N LE, Std Align FBL Head
Radix 690FBL's running 1950H.S
Futaba BLS152's on cyclic (these are the new 31kgs torque each .13sec, faster on set the 6.8v so servo power/torque issues)
TotalG with 3 sat rx's
BLS251 on tail
JR 11x TX

This one has me really stumped as it seemed much better in my Vision 50 on the collective side of things but it did always seem to need 14Deg+ of collective set on that machine, Flybarred it was happy and snappy at 12.

Thanx in advance, Chris.

nwmtech

10-28-2010, 05:07 PM

Awesome to hear yours is all squared away. I figured I'd post what we found so that it might help anyone else with the same issues.

Re: Try this
Hey Nick,

You were right man, I moved the balls to 10mm and the bellcranks to the 3G settings (had to do all kinds of funky things to get them to work on the outsides of the servo arms) and its heaps better.

I adjust the gains and travels as you suggested and it just flew perfectly on tic toc and cyclic side of things. The collective still felt a bit slow I bumped it to 14Deg, felt better.

Then a mate stuck his on normal Radix690's while I wasn't looking, The collective was a big improvement again.
Im going to rob my other 700 of its normal Radix's for a good flying session this weekend, I quite like it how it is now. All my mates have 700's so plenty of different blades floating around to try.

Guess the new VBar is going in the Vision to have a play for a while, My good friend is the Australian ElyQ importer.. I have a Vision90 coming so hopefully they have addressed the geometry issues for FBL on it.

I would like to really thank you for going out of your way to help me.
I have been flying for over 20Yrs and im only 31, right upto world champs level (pylon racing).
Have always been a happy helper myself.

I'll be sure to pay it forward.
Cheers, Chris Graham.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nwmtech
VBar generally runs it's throws a little less than the TotalG does. Their control loop is based on about 8-10* of cyclic and Curtis has based his on 14*. Just a different way of doing it. I've pretty consistently found that the TotalG falls into right about the middle between a VBar setup and stock. Like I mention in your post you can always run longer balls on the inner swash to get some more collective throw out of it.

Just give all that a shot and let me know how it goes. Shouldn't cost anything and it's worth a shot anyway.

~Nick

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliNutt
Quote:
Originally Posted by nwmtech
Ok so my opinion is that you have way too much mechanical gain. Will this alone cause the problem? I'm not 100% postive but it definitely won't help. So here's the deal... even if you pull the unit and go to VBar I'm about 90% positive that you won't end up in the correct mechanical range anyway so in fixing this and trying it you won't lose anything. Drop down to the Align3G servo holes on the wheels. Now you're going to have to max out your ATV's and increase the values in the advanced setup menu in the TotalG software to get 14* but that's ok. Teach the TotalG the limits there. Then.. leave your pitch curve at full linear and just dial back your Pitch ATV in the transmitter to get your 13* or whatever it is that you want. Same thing goes for flip/roll rate. Dial back the ATV's to where you want it.

Now... set your FC gain at 55. Go into the Advanced Menu and Set your Flip Rate Gain at 30 and your Flip Heading Gain at 15.

That's where I would start. I sent you a PM because I was trying to be respectful and not give advice in Curtis' forum.
Thanx for your tips mate, I originally set up the machine with the inner holes on the align 3G wheels and because I have the 700E elevator arm and bellcranks I used the inner holes on them too.

Was able to get 14 collective but only 10 cyclic so I changed it back to std before flying. I have seen V-bars fly on all the inner (700E) holes an they seem to get the throw.

Makes sense to up all the travels in the G to get better resolution so I will give it a go.

Thanks again.