blade cpp, and intro

[Funky]

Blade CP Pro + HH gyro = Cheap Fun

Yes, the Rex is king of the micro electrics and a much better heli, but be ready to spend some big bucks and spend a lot of time on setup if you haven't done it before. Yes, many parts are cheaper for the Rex, but the Blade doesn't break often due to the low headspeed. I have wrecked mine 4 times in the same day and it was still flying. After most wrecks you can pick it up, straighten the blades and fly again (after checking it over of course) When I am not being careless or stupid with it, the Blade flies great and goes home in one piece every time. I love the Rex, but I would hate to add up all of my receipts for it. If you have the money, definately go for the Rex. Its the best flying micro IMO. If you aren't ready for a huge investment, the Blade Pro is still a great choice. I have found most of the Blades I have seen that are not flying good have been wrecked and not put back together properly (2 out of 3 times its something as easy as screws too tight causing binding in the head). Improper setup will doom any heli to fly poorly. Since the Rex is put together by you in the beginning, it is usually easier to fix the right way. With the money spent, most people spend more time trying to fix the Rex the right way. With a little research this is easily acheived on a Blade too... but most people don't take the time to do it and blame it on the heli instead.

[chopperdudes]

<cut>as long as you've got the skills to fly it<cut>


Even the Pro's crash perfectly assembled and maintained Helis. No reasonable person can agree the cost of a CP/CPP to be zero "as long as you've got the skills to fly it". IF that were the case then the better quality heli's would cost ZERO. The facts are that for every happy CP/CPP owner you can find I can find DOZENS that abandoned our hobby as a result of toy helicopters pandered by hobby shops in the name of profits.


hmmmm... i think i over stated abit... well, let's say as long as you don't crash it?! deal? and remember, you don't HAVE to crash it to learn it. your probably right about the dozen to one ratio, but those people basically either didn't get it set up properly (very important with ANY heli), or going beyond what they can do (ie. punching collective up first flight and oh sh*t, drop thorttle, and boom!)

well, actually, for me the repair cost right now is 426CAD (excluding upgrade tx, hh gyro, and dd tail, not to mention i have always used cf blades) for this 6 months, i make a spreadsheet on excel and put how trim it, i have to always hover with stick imputs, and that was fine with me until i learned how to trim out the bird and make it fly better, and yes, i believe i did spent alot of time on it, too much i think away from studying, but that's what a hobby is about, there's a guy that live across from me, he was the one that got me into helis basically, he bought a blade cp, and then i bought one, but that guy gave up... but he didn't have the patience nor the time.

i'm not really pushing them, but think about it, shelling out 1000 bux for something new to you isn't really that appealing, and i believe if i, (me only, not setting the bar high) am to keep learning on teh blade and no get a rex, i'd be pushing the blade's limits (ie, everything that can be done upright be done inverted) before i even get close to that 1k mark.

[Jermo]

Funky - I suspect you already know how to fly so your comments are out of context. If I'm wrong I apologise.

Chopperdudes- you can't exclude the cost of any upgrades. That's the entire point here. I also suspect you know how to fly more.

I'm not even saying the T-Rex is the best bird for beginners. I'm just saying if someone intends to get into this hobby and is totally brand new Eflight products are cheap poor quality.

I suspect you guys are very young and havent' learned yet.
I'm not going to argue anymore.

If you don't want to hear the answer don't ask the question.
Jermo

[Funky]

Funky - I suspect you already know how to fly so your comments are out of context. If I'm wrong I apologise.

I suspect you guys are very young and havent' learned yet.
I'm not going to argue anymore.

If you don't want to hear the answer don't ask the question.
Jermo

I didn't know this was an arguement. I was offering my opinion because I have both helis and experience helping others get their helis flying correctly. Just because someone doesn't agree with your opinion doesn't mean they are wrong. I guess if someone doesn't agree with you, they must be wrong and giving bad advice. I am not sure what your comment "I suspect you guys are very young and havent' learned yet" means. I'm somewhat young compared to a lot of the heli crowd, 28, but I have built up some knowledge about these helis through trial/error/hands on experience. The only way I have expanded what i know about helis is by experience and listening to others, considering all sides, even when they don't agree with me. You might want to give it a try instead of just knowing it all. I'm still new and still learning all the time. I have been flying under a year so I know I still have a lot to learn. I suspect even after being in this hobby for years I will still listen to others and look at things objectively instead of pushing my opinion as the ONLY right way.

I'm a new, I can hover my trex, I can't hover a friends CPP (not properly or safely.

Just because you had one bad experience with a Blade doesn't mean they are all bad. Mine hovers hands off for at least 3-5 seconds (more if you take it up higher and let it drift a while). It can almost be boring because it flies so calm compared to my screaming rex or loud nitros.

Jermo, I respect your opinion, just try not to discredit me/others just because you don't agree. Thats what these forums are for, getting opinions/experience from lots of different people to find the best solution that works for you.

[Jermo]

Noted: your experiece is different than anyone around here. NOBODY out of the 20+ models that were sold locally has been able to fly one out of the box without prior ability to fly heli. so it's not just me.

As a new person to the Hobby I think it's bad to tell new folks to buy something when the majority of folks with experience with the specific brand/product knows it's not suitable for new folks unless you have ALOT of hands on personal help.

If you get enough help you can learn to fly a 2x4.

You claim I'm trying to know it all. Maybe I am. Maybe I'm trying to save new folks from an expensive and frustrating mistake. If that means I know it all then I do. I don't base my opinion on my experience with the CP/CPP alone. Guys around here are begging folks to take the junk off their hands.

:dontknow what do I know. You guys are sold on supporting YOUR decision to go with the CP/CPP even if others see it as wrong. Just because YOU think it's right and it worked for YOU does that make me wrong?

Add it up for yourself..the posts are all here. What's the first thing you want to do with your CP/CPP? let's see, add a HH gyro because the gyro is trash, well the RX/TX isnt' very good...so we'll upgrade that...then there's a series of upgrades to the head, tail, motors.......etc on and on..... At the end of it you really don't have the CP/CPP you promote to new folks at some awesum low price do you?

Your opinion is just as valid as mine. I would just point out that your opinion should be noted to be from someone who has flown it for a while, has help, and has done upgrades. You are NOT the typical new person.

In the end we can agree to disagree. After all I don't expect any new person who gets the CP/CPP will think bad of me after their personal experience. I've told my opinions based on what facts are available both locally and on every Heli/RC forum on the internet. How much credibility would I have if I promoted an Rah Rahed for teh CP/CPP and the average new person really hated it? not much.


Jermo

[Funky]

As a new person to the Hobby I think it's bad to tell new folks to buy something when the majority of folks with experience with the specific brand/product knows it's not suitable for new folks unless you have ALOT of hands on personal help.


I didn't have any hands on help when I started. The only help I had when starting out was forums like this. Reading and research led me to my own trial and error. Although most opinions and help I had was from more open minded people willing to accept more opinions than their own, especially without more PERSONAL experience with a product :wink:

[Jermo]

Gratz on that Funky...you can probably buy a truckload of CP/CPP parts (slightly used/crashed) from around here then.

I tend to be more open minded when it doesn't cost money. Some of us are married with kids, house, pets..etc so we don't have that huge money tree in the back. We tend to be critical of things and not get suckered into things easily. As I've aged I've gotten to be alot better with my cash. I've learned the cost of something is almost NEVER what you pay to get it.

I'm not saying the CP/CPP is total trash (although my opinion of a stock model isn't very high). What I'm saying is that promoting it to new folks with little or no real hands on help is IMHO wrong.
Jermo

[Funky]

The Blade's simplicity is the reason I see it as a good choice. Not the only choice, like I said before, the Rex is king and if you can afford it and will take the time to learn about how everything works, its the better choice. But, an all in one package with battery, servos, remote, charger, motor etc for a low price makes getting into the hobby easy. The Blade is also extremely easy to repair if you take the time to learn how it works. For the price of the gyro and servos alone for the Rex you can be flying a Blade Pro today with everything you need. Its not easy for someone new to the hobby to start by spending 1000.00+ for a new heli. The Blade can get people started and once they are addicted, its a lot easier to see why some of us dump so much money into these helis and it can help them justify the price for moving up to the next level.


I'm not saying the CP/CPP is total trash (although my opinion of a stock model isn't very high). What I'm saying is that promoting it to new folks with little or no real hands on help is IMHO wrong.


This is true of any heli but even more true about a Rex. Anyboby new to the hobby should try to find someone experienced to help them get started and double check their machine before flying themselves. Especially one as complicated as the Rex with programming for the radio, ESC and gyro done by the user.

[chopperdudes]

hmmm... no experience here before either, no help, not even in forums, i 'found out' there's forums after i've learnt how to fly, the simplicity of the blade vs the trex makes it easier for new folks, when you upgrade a heli, your making it fly better, and with a better tx, you'd be able to use it on future helis, after all, if you consider the stock tx to be junk, remember that a trex doesn't even come with a tx. i spent less than 300CAD on repairs before any upgrades, and that being i can do stationary rolls. i just upgrade the tx because i can use it on future helis, and no need to use a different rx. the stock gyro is not junk, remember, the trex doesn't come with a gyro either.

when you upgrade the blade, you make it more capable, thus allowing you to learn more on it before moving to a bigger helo. just think about it, ppl upgrade the rex too, better motor, batts, tail servo, blings (anything other than SE) and tail system. so when a person first buys a XL, then upgrade, and crash, and learn to fly inverted, they'd spent as much as they'd like to admit.

when i buy a blade cpp and learn on it until you can fly it inverted, i spent less than 500 on it including upgrades (excluding tx because you can use it on a rex too), that equals 700CAD total investment. when you get a XL with let's say 4xHS-65MG's, same tx, gyro 401, align batt. & charger, you'll be over the 700CAD mark, and then there's upgrades... bling out head, improve tail servo, better batt, better charger... AND when you finally learn to fly inverted, i'd guess that repair/upgrade cost will cost you another 700CAD?! when that happens, one situation is you've got a trex that you can fly inverted... or, if you've learnt inverted on teh blade, you've got a rex and a upgraded blade... which sounds better?

[Jermo]

Again you miss it. Do the math. You can start out with the 450SA and zero upgrades. The repairs are still cheaper for the Trex than for the CP/CPP and it's easier to learn on.

:hug: have fun with your birds guys, maybe when you get to my age you'll see things the same way. If not that's ok because I'll probably be dead.
Jermo

[Funky]

have fun with your birds guys, maybe when you get to my age you'll see things the same way


:roll:

Hopefully when I get to your age, instead of arguing I will listen/respect other people's opinions even when they are not the same as mine :wink:

[shaggybirdman]

wow did i start something or what?!

[Funky]

I have to apologize. Going back and forth like this really doesn't help anyone, especially someone new that is just asking for advice. Please disregard the last few posts from me. Sorry Jermo, some of my comments are pretty immature and thats just not me. Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect is what makes this forum the best one around and I would hope I can help and contribute, not argue and take away from it.

ShaggyBirdman, the best advice I can give you is do a lot of research before spending your money. Anytime I rush into something I am not happy. When I take my time and research what I am looking for I make a lot better decisions. Good luck with whatever you choose. Either way you will be hooked :wink:

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

What happens if you buy the nice nitro, or T-Rex450se and find out you don't really like flying helis? Hell now your out a couple grand, get a CPP and only be out $200. I learned to fly on a blade CP, no sim experience, no t-rex, no heli forums, no radds, no upgrades, no training gear. Sure i went through alot of wood blades learning to fly, but the fact that I hovered 4 feet of the deck on my very first try gave me alot of encouragement. In just a couple of days I was hovering all over the place and had only had a couple of minor blade scrapes.

Yes you can learn to fly with a blade CP. Should be easier with a CPpro. If you hate it, well your only out $200.

[shaggybirdman]

i already know what i'm getting. i have decided to get a century hawk pro. i have too small a area inside to even conceder flying indoors with anything other than my cx2. plus i could fly for 2 years on what just 3 batteries cost for a t rex, or cpp.

a couple grand to do nitro? my hawk will cost somewhere around $600 in the air. i already have a heli radio. kit and motor $285 delivered, giro $75, servos $125, heavy duty landing gear $35. $520 so far. so i have $80 for misalanious items. i'd say that's far away from a couple grand. plus i can fly back to back tanks without waiting for the motor, and batteries to cool. will take more wind. wind is a factor for me. my area has been getting more windy every year.

now mind you i'm not looking down at electrics. i'd love a t rex, but it's just not fesable for me, and my area.

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

Dont forget, starter, fuel, battery charger, glow plug ignitor, fuel pump. Its great you have a radio already, that saves a ton of money. For someone who has nothing to start with, $2000 is not unfeasible for a good nitro heli, the century hawk is considerably cheaper than say a Raptor 90SE. Have fun and see you in the sky!!

[jediwannabe]

hmmmm... i wonder what i'll say once i get an SE

You won't recomend the BCP anymore.
I always liked my BCPP(at the time) and learned alot with it(and defended it to the ground in here), but I fly my TREX almost exclusively now.

[shaggybirdman]

Dont forget, starter, fuel, battery charger, glow plug ignitor, fuel pump. Its great you have a radio already, that saves a ton of money. For someone who has nothing to start with, $2000 is not unfeasible for a good nitro heli, the century hawk is considerably cheaper than say a Raptor 90SE. Have fun and see you in the sky!!

all the ground equipment i already have. i bought a hobbico ultra tote that had everything needed to start a nitro plain. i upgraded the starter motor to a sullivan. that was only around $55 or so. i forget now. got it 6 years ago. i had 2 helis back then. a 30 size, and a lite machine. my friend phsycaly put his radio in my hand and i drove his serpent impact. well i was sold. i was trying to beat his impact with a lessor car... till then. i sold off the radio, and 2 helis, and bought a impact. now i'm trying helis again. but this time i'm going to learn to fly. it's a do or die situation this time http://i.imdb.com/Photos/CMSIcons/emoticons/evilgrin/evil9.gif i've been in the hobby for quite some time, and have acquired alot of ground equipment.

lets see 285 heli with motor (found a smoking deal), 199 spectrum DX6 radio, 75 gyro, 75 flight box combo (if it's still avalible), 45 starter drive, 13 gallon of fuel (that's what i remember it cost. car fuel is 27 a gallon last year). i come up with $692. somethings maybe +- some, but well under $1000 all said and done buying a 30 size heli. a raptor 30 with out motor is 299, so adding a extra 150 for the motor would be $842. thank god for tax return time, and i have a ton of stuff to sell. non rc stuff.

[Buzzkill]

I've had a CX2 for about three weeks, my first RC anything. Love that little bird. Bought a CPP three days ago. What a difference !!!!!!!!!! When I started with the CX2 I got mad when I saw post saying it was a toy (well not mad but hurt my pride). After first two packs on the CPP I flew my CX2 again. Hate to say it but ya its alot more toy like than the CPP. Been reading the exchanges in here and everyone has lots of opinions. Personaly, I've only been flying for three weeks. I've been through about 6 stock battery packs for my CPP and recently got a $25 11.1v 2000 MaH battery. With the new battery I get 30-40 min. flights and the added weight adds stability to the CPP. Since I wont be doing more than hovering and forward and backwards flight for a while thats fine with me. Ran the pack (2000MaH) twice now with no crashes, no excesssive heat and tons of fun!! Damn the CPP is quick. Best of all my girlfriend is flying my CX2.

My point is:

If, and I can't argue since I've never flown anything other than the CX2 and CPP, the CPP is hard to fly would'nt it be a better beginner heli to start with? I mean I'm looking forward to my next bird (probably a Trex 600) especialy after reading tons of post saying how much better it is than a CPP and how much better it handles. I'd rather learn on the little sensitive (dare I say squirely?) CPP than on another machine just to get owned on a CPP when I tried to fly it.

I hope that the CPP is as hard as everyone says it is because if it got much more sensitive I'd never be able to fly RC heli's again.


Advice to new pilots with a CPP: After you've famliarized yourself with the feel of the thing, get it off the ground!! The CPP handles alot differently 2'-3'+ off the ground. Hovers are a lot more stable.


Please lord. Let the Trex be easier to fly than the CPP :fly

[Buzzkill]

I've got a blade CPP (for less than a week). At first I was like "Oh @%^&" I just wasted $250. I thought it was hard as hell to fly. Tonight I was hovering one handed, with my right hand. I tune the thing before every flight and I mean 100%. gain, porportion, tracking and I make sure everything is where it should be before I get going. Now I'm not doing 3D manuvers and have only flew outside a couple times (Chicago, windy city, go figure :arggg: ) luckily my app. complex has heated underground parking so I get to fly in a pretty open space alot.

My point is : The CPP is extremely frustrating at first but after a few battery packs I'm was loving the thing and still do. Personaly I'm glad I got the CPP instead of a TREX. From what I've heard if you can fly a CPP you can handle just about anything so I have a lot to look forward to. Yes a TREX is definately my next bird, I havent heard a bad thing about it so far.

On that note, whats the best TREX to start with ? I'm looking forward to putting it together almost as much as flying it !!

[jediwannabe]

I started with a BCPP as my first heli as well. Once I go tthe hang of it I loved it. When I built my TREX and bought a DX-7 I ran out and bought the micro rx and the Blade is now on my DX-7 as well. On a nice computer Tx its even more fun because of the fine tuning you can do.

Everyone has their opinions on what heli's are good/bad for beginners...one week at the local flying field and those guys told me to ditch my TREX450 and get a 90size Nitro! I do feel that if you can be smooth with a BCP you can fly anything.


On that note, whats the best TREX to start with ? I'm looking forward to putting it together almost as much as flying it !!

Opinions will vary...here is mine! Get the SE! Get good servo's, gyro, tx,rx. Once your stepping up to the TREX your opening up the door for advanced flying and larger heli's. The money you may save up front you will probrobly regret later. What ever TREX you get, get the kit so you can build it(valuable learning exp), if you get an ARF everyone suggests taking it apart and double checking the build anyway!
Last take on the SE.. I bought the TREX450S with CF frame. It is a great bird, but after 2 crashes I've stepped the plastic parts in the head up to the aluminum and my tail gears are all metal now...its pretty much an SE but it cost me more. Heck get the latest version of the SE, if you don't you'll be reading TREX forums about what to watch out for or what are the part #'s of the correct upgrades!

[slikrx]

I picked up a blade CPP. FOr me it was either "try out" the hobby for $250 or nothing. If I wanted, I could (and probably will) buy a TRex with all the trappings.

Now for me, since when I *DO* get into something, I generally try to buy the best I can get. So that means the SE and a DX7. Add in a couple LiPos, Charger, and motors, and I'll be north of $1,000.

$250 for a "possible throwaway" is something I could stomach. $1000 plus 20+ hours (a guess) in setup is just something I could not justify unless I already knew I liked the hobby.

So, from my perspective, saying "don't get the CP, it's a waste of money." is a tad harsh and ignores the fact that not everyone wants to or is able to invest lots of time & money intoan activity they might not like.

My comment to a prospective heli flyer with zero or limited RC experience would be more "If you want to dabble in the hobby and see if you might like it, the CPP is a decent option. Just be aware that this is NOT the easiest thing to fly, and things will get easier with more money. BUT, if you decide you don't like the hobby you aren't out tons of time and money"

Now, someone that already loves/likes RC planes and already enjoys the tinkering would probably be better served getting the TRex to start, since they are already an enthusiast of many of the things that are part & parcel of RC heli flying... (rebuild, repair, buy more stuff, etc)

The CPP isn't for those that frustrate easily. Then again, I don't think that RC heli flying in general is a hobby for those that frustrate easily.

I think that recommending a TRex is good, but I think that recommending a CPP is good as well, as long as you manage expectations and explain what they're getting into.

[Funky]

Well said. I sink a ton of money in this hobby because I love it, but its not for everyone. Testing the waters with a 1000.00+ heli is just hard to justify for someone completely new. 20 years ago my dad bought a Competitor Pro .60 with the best of everything for around 3000.00 (including everything to start, etc). He spent almost a year putting it together and setting it up, making sure every last detail was perfect. Then he flew it 4 times before quitting. A few weeks ago I asked him why he quit and he told me he almost wrecked it his last time trying to hover it. After almost losing control he was scared to try it again with so much money invested and time setting it up. Even though it was the best possible machine in its day, it didn't make it the best choice for him (especially with us kids draining his wallet). If he would have bought something more affordable and easier to work on, he probably would have stuck with it longer. He flies full size helis for a living, so it was not a lack of interest that stopped him, just time and money.

FYI, I started with a Rex.... but I had no idea getting into helis how much money I would spend and how much time it took to get off the ground that first time.

[b00ridge]

A total n00b can learn to fly on a CPP, but it isn't easy. Buying a T-Rex is a much steeper learning curve, you have to get it setup and running yourself, but it flies 100 times better than a CPP. Either way you are going to have alot of fun and alot of heartache.




My buddy bought a couple of CXs and we both learned to fly on them (I have been flying fix wing for a few years and am a full scale fix wing pilot. That means absolutely squat to rc heli flying, I've noticed). My friend bought the CPPro and we both tried to fly it some. I could do ok with it, but it was twitchy as all get out. I attributed most of this to the fact I was/am new to helis, but man it sure was intimidating (especially since the heli I was nearly crashing wasn't mine to begin with!).

Well, long story short (too late), I decided to look at getting a cp type heli myself and after doing a lot of research, I decided on the T-rex series of heli. I just finished putting a 450SE together and I must say, it is 100 times easier to fly than the cppro, imo. Due to the weather, I haven't had a time to take it outside, but I've been able to hover it in a 6'X5' space at the house (much to the chagrin of my g/f and her concern for her valuables!)

There are some serious drawbacks to the trex compared to the cppro. Price and initial cost is the main one. I already had a 9303 radio system, but I still spent a solid $750 on the trex, gyro, servos, receiver, and associated building/equip. I'm not even including the new batteries I bought because I can at least use them in my stryker and fw190. The $250 for the cppro and the fact that extra batteries are cheaper is something to consider. I'd also consider which brand of heli has more support in your local area. The whole "waiting for parts to arrive" game will get old quickly.

[Helivudrug]

Gotta put my 2 cents in here...

My first heli was a Venom 3D. The electronics smoked the first time I connected the battery. LHS swapped it out for me and then the second one broke the seesaw linkage everytime the blade came in contact with anything heavier than a grain of salt. I went back to the LHS at least ten times buying spare linkages before I called Venom and demanded my money back.

Got the Blade. Better quality but I ended up spending three times what I paid originally in repairs and upgrades just to get it flying as stable as my Rex which I finally bought a few months ago.

The T-Rex flies like a dream and is a real quality machine.

Bottom line is I could have just gotten the T-Rex and saved my self a ton of money and headaches trying to learn on smaller twitchy helis that are designed to keep the hobby shops in business in sales of spare parts. I could have purchased a spare T-Rex for the money I sunk into repairs and upgrades on the Blade.

Its a nice heli now but I never fly it now tha I have the T-Rex. No reason to. I can hover the T-Rex in the garage more safely than I can the blade even though its a lot bigger.

Do I regret getting the blade? I regret spending the amount of time I did repairing it insteading of flying. The t-Rex is so stable and predictable that the only time I crash it is when Im getting really crazy tryin to learn a new maneuver.

Shoulda just started with the T-Rex.

Should woulda coulda...

:arggg: