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nwmtech
03-30-2011, 11:30 AM
That's great news!

Starcruiser
04-01-2011, 10:08 PM
I own both and the Beast (v2.0) is an easy setup once you understand it, just as the Vbar is, yes the PC is a requirement but I like the analyzer. Both have issues with vibrations (no surprise there!), I have my Mini Blue on a 450 and it is sweet, a no brainer to toss around, I really enjoy it.

The Beast is on a 250se so no direct comparison (i.e. 450 to 450), but seems fine so far, not had much time to finish the tweaking on the BeastX (should be done tomorrow), but so far both seem on par.

I to went to the Pro on the Vbar right off the bat since I am using analog servo's (65MG's), I have 5.0 right now and have not upgraded (I do not like jumping on the bandwagon until it has been out for awhile), I will upgrade later this summer I am sure, so far no need for the governor since I use the one in my ESC.

Vinger
04-02-2011, 07:37 AM
5.1 is SOOOOO much better than 5.0, you will absolutely love the new feel and how lively the heli is, but still rock solid.

im4711
04-02-2011, 08:47 PM
I am trying both. Using the microbeast for some time and still a bit new in the mini vbar. the vbar I noticed is way more sensitive towards vibration compared to the microbeast. I learned it the hard way.
A little bit of tail vibration made my TREx 500 roll left on ground (before take off and after landing). Was not very funny. I had the microbeast on it before and no such issues.
However the vbar in reverse does make a real beast out of the heli. Extremely prceise (like the microbeast) and very fast using the 5.1 Pro with 25% FB simulation. I am stunned. Another performance difference is that vbar does stop at dead point where the microbeast is a bit softer on hard stops. That is OK for most but just noticed it myself.

One more thing I also noticed. The vbar does not like extreme pump outs and might kick out the tail a little bit (not very much but again just noticed it). The microbeast does not do it.

I only happened to compare both systems on the same heli in same overall setup.

Overall rating -> vbar mini with upgrade to 5.1 pro cost almost $350 where the microbeast did cost me about 200. So I have to say the microbeast is outstanding for what you pay. However if you do not look at the money the vbar would be a bit better due to more insane flight capabilities.

myrseth
04-03-2011, 04:08 AM
If tail goes out in pitch pumps you need to adjust precomp in the tail setup expert menu. A vbar setup right is rock solid tail included. I had the same on my atom 500 now the tail is perfect whatever I do, as long as the tailblades can keep up with what I want to do.

im4711
04-03-2011, 05:39 AM
If tail goes out in pitch pumps you need to adjust precomp in the tail setup expert menu. A vbar setup right is rock solid tail included. I had the same on my atom 500 now the tail is perfect whatever I do, as long as the tailblades can keep up with what I want to do.
I did see that information and still working on getting it tweaked. However no issue on the MicroBeast in comparison to the VBar when it comes right out of the box with initial setup.
The VBar does require quite some tweaking before you get it right for your heli. The MicroBeast is much quicker setup and way more forgiving. It still is very crisp on and well after getting some advice we are even able to fly crack with a MicroBeast. Still it is softer on stops which could cause issues in some maneuvers (such as tail slide ...).
The VBar is simply better in 3D flight - therefore already for the VBar mini $150 higher in price if you upgrade to the 5.1 pro (I would highly recommend that).

So do not take me wrong -> the VBar is outstanding. I will not take it off. However I will not replace the MicroBeast on the other helis either (still using it on a TREx 700 E and Fusion 50).
I do have a full size VBar waiting to be tested too. That might go into a Henseleit as soon as it arrives.


Maybe another little info I found I will do when setting up a heli with VBar: I sure would run a test without main blades on to check if there is any kind of vibration before I would take off for the first flight. Could save some surprises.

myrseth
04-03-2011, 06:16 AM
The express versjon has some great base values and is less tweaking compared to the pro, just trying to give you pointers for a good setup I know from experience going pro from the start can be a bit overwhelming as I came from the beastx myself. Easiest way of fixing the tail is doing tail down tictocs or pitchpumps and rise the pitch precomp one by one until it's perfect, then fly and roll or big side tictocs and work with the roll precomp same way.

For feel beastx flies better then vbar express, about equally hard to set up just different approaches. But I really enjoy 5.1 pro I get it to fly exactly how I want to, and is the first flybarless sw I flown where I don't miss my flybar at all, my 3D plus will continue to fly the beastx still even if I have vbar on my 500 and 700.

SidewaysLS4
04-03-2011, 10:07 AM
Ok, I'll throw this question out there...

I have a T500 scaler running 1850rpm with 3 narrow 'scale' blades (real soft responding disk). Currently it has a SK360, which after a whole lot of tuning, still just isnt right IMO. My Vbar and BeastX helis point and laugh at it, lol. I'm pretty sure putting a Vbar on it would make it the way I like, but I'd like to save a little $$ and use a BeastX. Currently my only BeastX experience is with a T250 pod/boom running 4K headspeed, so it is a quick responsive heli...but do you guys think a BeastX could handle something like a scaler-type rotor disk/heli response?

myrseth
04-03-2011, 11:52 AM
With the new software (not sure if its in the current or if its still at testing) there will be the possibility to adjust how many blades you have.

mguw
04-03-2011, 11:55 AM
Hi

If you talk about the micro setting software you can adjust the phasing, but not the number of blades (which actually doesn't make sense as it depends of the head geometry...)

http://www.beastx.com/software/Windows/SetupMicroSettings.msi

regards

Marcel

SidewaysLS4
04-03-2011, 12:32 PM
I'm actually wondering about a slow(er) responding disk. The SK360 control loop apparently expects X degrees/sec for a given pitch change, and if you provide it with significantly less rotor authority, like with lower headspeed/narrower blades, it starts getting weird. To get control inputs under check (no bounce on cyclic input stop) I have to run ridiculously low Bell gains (which in turn result in a very 'slow' heli), and then the Hiller side is somewhat confounded by this as well resulting in no 'locked in' performance. I guess it mimics a flybar so well this way, you are constantly compensating for roll and pitch in standard forward flight.

I know the Vbar exibits none of this foolishness on other scalers I have....but the BeastX is a question still for me. Ideas?

mguw
04-03-2011, 12:55 PM
Hi

May be you should reduce your ATV's not to ask more then the disc is capable of with your SK360?

On the microbeast I love to fly with very low RPM (I fly some soft 3D at 1200rpm with my logo 600)
and the fliprate is still the same then at nearly twice the headspeed even if I already have 10 pitch just to hover...

watch my very first flight with a microbeast 1 year ago
http://vimeo.com/11072767

you can see (actually hear) the head speed changes that do not affect the cyclic at all ( though, I do change the tail gain with the headspeed)

Regards

SidewaysLS4
04-03-2011, 05:27 PM
Well, if you can do 1200 on the Logo ok, I think I'll give it a shot. Beast #2 on order :)

Here's the pain-in-the-behind heli in question...lots of work flying it compared to Vbar and Beast helis I have in various flavors

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vljjbu7fARo

airjawed
04-03-2011, 06:48 PM
Well, if you can do 1200 on the Logo ok, I think I'll give it a shot. Beast #2 on order :)

Here's the pain-in-the-behind heli in question...lots of work flying it compared to Vbar and Beast helis I have in various flavors

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vljjbu7fARo
Since the MB doesn't have settings for multiblade yet I would try to 'trick' it. Basically I would use a lower value for the 6 degree cyclic setting. I would also reduce the total available max cyclic and collective pitch range. I would do it based on the idea that 1 extra blade makes is 50% more right? So instead of 6 degrees I would measure in 4 degrees. Instead of collective at 12 degrees I would put in 8. Max cyclic instead of 12 I would put in 8.

Lastly I would use parameter B on a low setting. The presets have built in expo by the way so don't use transmitter expo on them.

SidewaysLS4
04-03-2011, 07:37 PM
I havent gotten that far...but I'm thinking keeping the 6* setup spec as-is for now (when I actually install it). The 3rd blade isnt really doing all that much being that it is very narrow in comparison to a standard 425mm blade. At least that's my thoughts on it right now.

I'll be really happy if the thing can fly clear across a parking lot in 5-10 MPH winds hands-free with no cyclic corrections needed (like my BeastX T250 does). Because with the current Sk360...it doesnt, by a long shot, lol. And the Hiller gain on the SK360 is very close to approaching oscillation...so ??? It hovers nicely...flying, not so good

SidewaysLS4
04-09-2011, 09:38 AM
Ok, I patched in the BeastX to replace the SK360 in the 3 bladed T500 heli above (with narrow flexy plastic blades no less). All I gotta say is..."Ummm, Wow!". No bobble at all after getting violent with the cyclic stops (and 3 bladed blade farts on cyclic sound cool :D).

So far I only did indoor big garage flights at work today to get the hover trim and tail gain set, tommorrow it is supposed to be warm and I'm off, so it's flying time :). Just on default pot positions in the garage, I think this thing is going to take the 'quick setup' awards in the FBL arena.

From what I can compare so far, it does none of the stuff that annoyed me with the SK360, and it is much more locked in and crisp in comparison. Quite impressive considering what blades and headspeed this thing is running (1850rpm)

ElectricSheep
04-13-2011, 10:00 PM
Edit.