Spektrum AR6100 Rx "stuck servo" firmware bug (Mar

[kgfly]

The following is from rcgroups.com and is yet to be confirmed but is sufficiently credible that I though it should be shared here in case anyone wants to ground their bird until the issue is cleared or confirmed and a fix provided:

From RCG: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7140844
** UPDATE ON DX7-AR6100 GLITCH **
I've been told by the Spektrum folks to announce the following:

After using my procedure to replicate the servo LOCK on the AR6100, Spektrum was able to duplicate the problem and RESOLVE the issue with a firmware upgrade to the receiver.

You heard it here folks, Spektrum has found a fix to the AR6100 and will be releasing a firmware upgrade for all AR6100 users. Horizon Hobby should release a statement on their website next week. My guess is that you'll send your receiver(s) back to Horizon Hobby, they'll add the firmware upgrade, and return the receiver to you.

Is it just me or can I hear people out there screaming "YEEEAAAAA!!!" and "WOOOO HOOOO!"

My upgraded receivers and radio should be here tomorrow. The weather is pretty bad here but I'll try to give the upgraded AR6100s a quick test. As always, I'll keep everyone posted.

Please don't call Horizon Hobby until next week. They only got the information TODAY so they'll need some time to set up the right people to handle to upgrade process.

Happy day fellas. Let's here it for Spektrum!

Exactly - they were working on the problem for the past several days, but until they could repeat it themselves they could not really say it was a problem. Now that they can finally repeat it (with Lee's help) they are addressing it. I would wait a few days before doing anything to see what they post on their site.

[peterob]

Since this is a firmware issue I take it all current AR6100's are susceptible?

Guess I'll stick mine in a foamy then, shipping back and forth won't be worth it for a $50 RX.

[kgfly]

Some more info on how the original poster reproduced the "stuck servo" problem.
Hey fellas. I've had several people ask what my "procedure" was to duplicate the problem. After re-reading it a few times it sounds silly...and I'm sure some of you might say "Well of COURSE it's going to fail like that". But, since it did allow Spektrum to finally see something on their equipment, I figure it's still worth sharing.

1) I am just an R/C enthusiast. I make NO claims to be a technical expert.
2) I don't work for Spektrum...or any other R/C manufacturer.
3) Please don't get frustrated with my steps...as strange as they are.
4) I have only tried this on one receiver.
5) You may not get the same results.

Okay...enough legal stuff...on with the steps: :D

***
These were done AFTER my crash:

1) I sat the plane exactly 30 paces away from me.

2) The radio was at my waist with the antenna pointing straight up (or 90 degrees from base).

3) Holding the BIND button down, I moved the sticks. The surfaces were responding, but slowly (weak signal I assumed).

4) While holding the BIND button down, I turned my body to the right (90 degrees away from the aircraft) and moved the control sticks. It was at this point while moving the elevator up and down that it HELD DOWN ELEVATOR in place. I turned back to face the airplane and was not able to move the elevator anymore. I released the BIND button and still had no control over the elevator. I COULD move the other surfaces of the airplane, but the elevator was still stuck down. ** Another servo may lock up besides the elevator so try moving all of them. **

5) I walked up to the plane and still had no control. I finally turned the radio off and back on. All the control surfaces went neutral and I resumed control of the aircraft.

You certainly wouldn't be doing this while in flight but it did recreate the problem of a stuck servo.

Before the glitch, I moved the TX antenna slightly while the plane was in flight. Shortly after repositioning the antenna is when the aircraft went haywire. For nearly 5 seconds, I felt like I had no control and was literally running towards the aircraft thinking I had lost the signal. I had aileron and throttle control but NO elevator.
***

There ya go fellas. Go have fun! I would like to know if anyone else can duplicate on their gear.

[Finless]

Hmmmm pretty wierd to recreate.... I hope this is really is an optional upgrade as I dont want to send my RX 's in to Horizon. So I am hoping this is just to fix this CAUSE and there are no other causes or problems related to normal operation.

Bob

[wwenthin]

ewww I was just about to plunk down some cash but I think I'll hold out for another month.

[WayneBrown]

makes you wonder how many paying customers are unwitting Beta testers...
This is a perfect example of why I won't be the first in line to buy or try new technology.

[DavidH]

This is a perfect example of why I won't be the first in line to buy or try new technology.


Wayne,
You must not be reading all the threads. Nothing can happen to this technology. It is invincible.

David

[WayneBrown]

This is a perfect example of why I won't be the first in line to buy or try new technology.


Wayne,
You must not be reading all the threads. Nothing can happen to this technology. It is invincible.

Daviduh huh... :wink:

[nedloh]

Sorry, but I think this guy dropped his TX or has a loose connection from the factory. If this had happened to me I would have bugged the hell out of horizon till they told me something that would appease me. So maybe this guy wasn't satisfied till it was Spectrums fault. My reasoning for this is because the only time he has an issue is when he wiggles the antenna.


4) While holding the BIND button down, I turned my body to the right (90 degrees away from the aircraft) and moved the control sticks.



Before the glitch, I moved the TX antenna slightly while the plane was in flight. Shortly after repositioning the antenna is when the aircraft went haywire.


I don't think I need to send my Rx to Horizon. There is no way I could take my hand off the Tx long enough to "reposition" the antenna without slamming my heli into the ground.

[BarnOwl]

I don't think I need to send my Rx to Horizon. There is no way I could take my hand off the Tx long enough to "reposition" the antenna without slamming my heli into the ground.

I do think so: The Spektrum DX7 antenna just needs a quick hit to repostition it.
I agree we shouldn't jump conclusions, but the fact that Spektrum is releasing a new "bug free" firmware says enough.
And the experience I had last week with the AR6100 does not give very much confidence to fly such a reciever again in one of my heli's.

Never had any issues with the AR7000 so far and I still think it is a great system.

[TRex888]

Please post if Spektrum releases a recall or similar. This can be a major set back for DX7 users.

But reading through the thread it seems the Rx lost the signal from the Tx at step 4 and after entering fail safe did not re-sync with the Tx correctly until the Tx was re-sync in step 5 via a power re-set. S/W can do this. If it was a S/W issue in the AR6100 I would guess that the AR6100 did not flush out any crap data after the Tx re-synced with it. A S/W patch can be written to do this.

However, it would appear to me this only happens in the real world when the aircraft is flown out of range. If you keep it close then it should not happen (unless the lost signal is caused by interference).

I have not put a AR61000 in a Trex yet, but I have one in a foamie and have flown at least 1/3 mile (>400m of the Futaba 146 range, well beyond the range a TRex would fly)

BTW, I have range tested my foamie with the Bind button depressed and got > 100 paces with it. 30 paces seems weak and not normal.

[Finless]

My 3rd weekend flying DX7 and two 6100's in my Trex SE's,
No issues here... I would also like to say that MANY of the guys at my field have been flying DX7 and AR6100's since they came out with no issues seen so far.

There was a bit of conversation about the AR7000 though. A crash at Vegas; a lockout with no response but the user has not seen a problem since on the same RX, and a full negative crash at BHam. But lots of speculation and no facts leaves me wondering what the issues are if any!

I remember when I bought my 14mz. After reading a lot about problems with the G3 Rx and lockouts etc I was afraid to put the G3 in my Vibe 90. Eventually I did and never had a problem. I put a G3 in my Lepton EX even with Hirobo's warning NOT to use this RX. No problems. I got a G3 in my Trex600... NO PROBLEMS.

So I can only conclude that we here on forums hear about the bad stuff more than we hear about the 1000's of users that dont have a problem. We all have to remember that no manufacturing process is 100% problem free and there will be some defective units. Some will get defective units! Additionally there is so much variability in how a user sets up a heli that we also have to take into account problems here as well.

Anyway I am finding it interesting that because we hear of a few problem we seem to be quick to blame the technology, design, bugs in the software, etc. I myself am guilty of doing this as well! But reflecting on my own experiences vs what I have read online, I am finding that in fact you have to take what you read about some people having problems as just that! Some people will have problems and dont be so quick to blame the design or technology. Had I did that I would still have my $350 G3 RX sitting in the box and would not have enjoyed the 2048 feel and improvements in technology. Same now for my DX7 on my little helis! The "connected" feel of the DX7 system is in fact true (at least over the feel of the 1024 system I was using). I myself feel it was worth it for now (until I can use my 14mz on 2.4g).

My .0002 cents ;)

Bob

[dutch_anykey]

Hi,

received my dx7 and 2 additional ar6100's last saturday. Started out with mounting one on my compy300. Man those rx's are small compared to my hitec supreme 8 channel rx :D
I had some strange trouble in the beginning....i didnt set failsafe...and i forgot to charge the rx battery that i used when setting up the heli.
But after that...no problem at al. And i hope to keep it this way :D
So far after 2 days of flying....no problem at all. In fact the DX7 feels better then my eclipse 7....

So i'm happy with it so far.

Maurice

[Finless]

In fact the DX7 feels better then my eclipse 7....


I would imagine it would! The HiTech radios are only 512 resolution....

Bob

[dutch_anykey]

Bob,

Its Hitec, and a ppm, not pcm version (ultra narrow dual conversion) :D
So that couldnt be the difference right?

Maurice

[Finless]

Dual conversion doesnt have anything to do with the sample rate of the sticks etc.... The Ecplise is still only 512 resolution radio.

Bob

[dutch_anykey]

Hmm yep,
That i understand, but i was refering to the eclpise being a PPM instead of a PCM modulated radio. (regarding the 512 resolution.)
PPM hasnt got a "resolution" like PCM does right? Or am i mistaken? the puls on a ppm signal can be anywhere i was thinking. (not bound to steps)
Or is it the way that the hitec "computer" part devides it in 512 steps?
O man radio stuff is difficult :D

EDIT::::


the sample rate of the sticks etc


Oops. I guess you already answered it Bob :D


Maurice

[kgfly]

Official Horizon Product Bulletin: http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Bulletin.aspx?ProdId=SPM6100

Product Bulletin:
AR6100 DSM2 Microlite 6Channel Rx, Air[SPM6100]

AR6100 Reprogramming Bulletin

Horizon Hobby takes your modeling satisfaction very seriously. Although there are thousands of AR6100 receivers on the market being used with great success, a small number of customers have reported un-commanded elevator outputs during flight.

After extensive testing, our Spektrum engineers have duplicated the problem. This issue only occurs under very unusual and specific circumstances and does not affect the general performance of the product. Our team has implemented a programming change on all future productions eliminating this issue altogether.

If you wish to return your receiver(s) to our Service Center for re-programming, please complete the attached Return Form. This is a free service.

If you have any questions, please contact our Product Support Team at 1-877-504-0233, Monday through Friday, 8am to 7pm CST.

We appreciate your support of Spektrum and apologize for any inconvenience this causes.


AR6100 Reprogramming Bulletin

[Babalu]

Any idea how when purchasing a new AR 6100, we can make shure that it has new programing. I would hate to buy one and find out I have to send it back to them!

Bob

[Hughes500Bob]

The Horizon Hobby return shipping charge of $7.99 (cheapest way) sucks! Can't we just enclose a return padded shipping pack with the postage and return label on it? At 3.5 grams it can't cost that much to ship!!!!! I appreciate them owning up to the problem ..... but getting ripped off for return shipping is just WRONG.

[RCHeliJim]

The Horizon Hobby return shipping charge of $7.99 (cheapest way) sucks! Can't we just enclose a return padded shipping pack with the postage and return label on it? At 3.5 grams it can't cost that much to ship!!!!! I appreciate them owning up to the problem ..... but getting ripped off for return shipping is just WRONG.



They are paying the return shipping on these, just as in any warranty issue - call them and ask.

[TRex888]

What if you don't get firmware upgraded? Will someone get killed or injured?

I think they need to let out more otherwise there may be a few insurance claims going around.

Maybe they need to do a worldwide recall and replace everything before it gets to that. :roll:

[Finless]

Yea what I want to know is if we "dont do" the specail circumstances do we need to worry?

Bob

[JC]

The people that are having problems with their receivers didn't have a problem until, well... until they had a problem. Sounds silly I guess.

Not all cars that are effected by a certain recall ever have the problem, but the potential is there so they recall all that may be effected. This however, seems to only be an offer to fix rather than a "recall".
If you wish to return your receiver(s) to our Service Center for re-programming,...

If Spectrum says they have confirmed a problem and are offering to fix it for free, I'd say go for it so you don't have to wonder or worry.

I just got one and it's still in the bag. I'll be sending it in. Easy for me though as I don't have to rip it out of my bird.
If it was installed, it would suck to have to remove it to send it in, but it would suck worse to have to repair my heli after a crash caused by the Rx, and then still have to send it in.

I too would like to know how we'll know if one on the shelf is updated. Is Horizon going to have all the dealers return stock for updates? I'd bet not.

[Cityflyer]

well i don't read forums so i fly till i die i guess ;)