To The VBAR users I ask....

[OICU812]

As a functional unit, in regards to performance in flight..... is the Vbar a worthwhile investement. Since the begining of the Vbar release I have been following some threads, some by members of this forum. I have been interested for certain. Now I see posts of being able to do the tuning etc by a PDA which is making it more interesting.

Thing is I really want to focus on flying this season and reall stepping up my flying to the next level. The Vbar is expensive, I could do it though, but then I get to thinking....

Am I going to be always messing with this thing?
How long does it take to get these VBars dialed into your heli and style?

If you have a crash is it a big deal to get it flying the same again, can you just replace the broekn parts or is it an "all over again" procedure?

Are the gains truly worth it?

Thanks for your time, I am thinking of a Vbar for my 6003D but really can not decide if the pros weigh out the cons, especially since I have never seen one in person or tried one etc....

:wink:

[LITHIUMSTATIC]

I couldn't help with this Shawn. All I can say is you have awesome helis!! Man my E-620 is a tird compared to your stuff. Man I'm jelious. :noteworthy

[Motions]

Shawn, just some things to consider. The V-bar system includes a tail gyro which most people forget about which prevents having to buy a $300 gyro, so the price looks a little better. The flybar less head is also extremely minimal in parts, (head block and grips) so your crash parts list goes way down.

Efficiency and flight time also increase. The V-bar increases flight time by an average of 20% or increases potential payload by about 20%.

I can't say how hard or time consuming the setup is, as I haven't set one up. I'm sure there is some tweaking to do even after a crash but you have to do that on any model. My main reason for getting one is for a scale project. But if it's that bad a**, I may have to put one on my 3D machine too.

[MrMel]

Let me put it like this.

Im thinking of putting VBar on all my helis that I fly regulary.


Regards to crashing, its actually EASIER to setup...
I totally smashed my Logo 14.

Rebuilt the kit, with no paddels, mixingarms, head takes about 10 minutes to rebuild, Used a swash level tool to make sure swash was leveled.
Went out and flied, adjusted tracking, done, exact same fliprate, piro-rate and so on.


New heli: took 3 flights to dial it in.
Have adjusted it a few times since, not to "fix" it but to get it more agile...


Pro's:
- More flighttime, Lower that headspeed since you can get same or better agility anyway.
- More power, if you keep the headspeed, you will see about 20% more power.
- Inherited stable, if you dont move the radio and the heli moves, the gyro will help you, for sample in gusting wind.
- Lighter overall heli.
- Want stable heli for AP? Its a flip of a switch, or do you want to try faster cyclic, same thing, pre-program "banks" of setup.
- Get the BlueTooth unit and trim without a computer (if you like to re-trim often)
- Less stuff in the head that can go wrong.
- Crash resistant, Ive totalled my VBar Logo many times, main shaft and spindle goes, maybe blade holders, probably link-arms, perhaps ball on swash, defiently servo gears, but the special head holds up.
- And last, you can carry the heli at the side without those darn paddles hit your leg :)

Cons:
- Price
- You need the computer to trim the heli.

[Motions]

Price is definitely the only thing holding most people back. If it was $500, everybody would have one.

Mel, I guess I need to get l41d. :lolol

[OICU812]

I have not seen a vendor yet with this bluetooth module... Do you just buy the module for the VBar system somehow and allready own the PDA or is this a total buy kit thing? I can find the VBar and the Head peices but no Bluetooth stuff for it.. :dontknow

[MrMel]

Its just released, think its only in germany so far, but ive talked to Dave at revolutionmodels and he had order on them and was expecting them soon.

And you need the PDA..

[OICU812]

Man! Cause that would be the way to go by the looks of the screenshots Motions posted, all there and wireless. Any idea on the cost of the Bluetooth Module?

[Motions]

If I'm not mistaken, it's $149 for the BT module. You have to use your own PDA. I have one if you need one though. :D

[jmiceli11]

OICU812,

The V-Bar will be available with just the sensor and control box, no air speed sensor, this is suppose to lower the cost. Since most 3D guys aren't using the air speed sensor. This is according to the USA importer.

[Motions]

Has anyone tried with and without the airspeed sensor? I'm curious how much difference it makes.

[BobbySmith]

Yup i was flying a L10 for 1 month wiht no sensors on a Vbar works flawless

Shawn tis like this IMO if you fly big the Vbar Rocks!! the power is just crazy for sure But.... if you fly in a box 3d the heli seems to bobble here and there over all it is really cool i fly alot in the box so i never did put it on any mroe machines

my .02

[MrMel]

I dont use the airsensor either.

[OICU812]

I only do long big runs to enter into things, my flying is mostly tight box flying. Setup and exit to maneuvers is what I do the long shoot out stuff with. That makes sense Bobby, thanks for that. In looking at some of the vendors that carry it I can not seem to locate one that shows a "with or without" air sensor price. So far it looks like the VBar core is 900-1000 USD than another 120-160USD for the head components, then of course I do not have a PDA, but that would be nice and likely another 200-300, then the BT module, whoa this is getting hefty, lol. :lol:

[Tomas Ahl]

If I'm not mistaken, it's $149 for the BT module.
I bought my BT module directly from Mikado and it was €149 which translates to US$200 approximately.

[OICU812]

Tomas Ahl, do you or anyone have a picture of this BT module? Wondering if it is just a small device that plugs into the Vbar receiver module or can someone show or explain how it intergrates to the Vbar box? Thx

[Lorents]

Hello Shawn,

The more I fly mine the better I like it :)
It is very predictable in the air and the power is fantastic. It doesnt take a lot of tinkering, when you first have it dialled in you just fly it and have fun :)

[OICU812]

Ok well, we'll see. I might be relying on you guys to get me over a couple of bumps if I get this. I can't understand a lick of German language and I have heard the instructions are poor? :dontknow It would be nice to see some power gains and little bit of extra flight time that is for certain.

Are there some basic starting point settings people have found to get a base setup for the L14/6003D size heli, or is it completely something each person has to tailor from what they see with the blades they are using etc? Guess I am asking if anyone has a base progam or screenshots to look at to get an idea of how many things there are to tweak and setup. I as mentioned do not own a PDA and would likely be looking at using my laptop for awhile.

[Voodoo]

Hey Shawn,

I just took two pics of our BT-Modul.
As you can see its not very big :)
Weight with cable and connector is 13 grams.

http://pics.helistore.at/Mikado/BT-Modul/P1070607.jpg

http://pics.helistore.at/Mikado/BT-Modul/P1070608.jpg

There are some basic sets of course.
The cool thing is, the complete setup files can be shared.

[Tomas Ahl]

Shawn, Voodoo beat me to the pictures. :)

You can always download the software from http://www.vstabi.de/download/index.html, install and run it to see what it looks like. You don't need a BT module to run the software itself to be able to look through its configuration screens.

By the way, the BT module is connected to the same connectors where the USB interface would otherwise be connected when used.

[OICU812]

Wow, now that is cool! Very nice pictures Voodoo! :D I like how small and compact in general that is. I never thought of the sharing files thing, if a person gets one setup, simply build another and get it close to the same, that would save "allot" of time for certain. Hmmmmm :wink:

[Voodoo]

I never thought of the sharing files thing, if a person gets one setup, simply build another and get it close to the same, that would save "allot" of time for certain. Hmmmmm

Yeah exactly :)

In the fact we are quite new to Team Mikado and the V-Bar System, Timo was so kind and gave us his Logo10 Set File. And it workes PERFECT as you can see in our Easter Vid. :D

Just fly, fly, fly get used to the extrem Power you have and the system runs exactly the same each time. even after a crash, if you replace the bad parts and set up the two linkage rods the same as before the heli should fly the same as before the crash, because everything is digital on software :)

[jmiceli11]

The V-Bar without the air sensor hasn't been released yet, but it is coming soon. :D

[OICU812]

Timo was so kind and gave us his Logo10 Set File. Wow that would be almost worth money! Yea that vid was rockin and that was dialed in no doubt at all.

[NTM]

The V-Bar without the air sensor hasn't been released yet, but it is coming soon. :D

Have you heard what kind of price break there will be on the v-bar without the pressure sensor ?