Learning damped by Hoping Blade CP (Solved)

[F1Atom]

It very hard to progress when your heli doesnt want to cooperate. I swear my heli is a schizophrenic or is bipolar. On some days it flys well and others its an absolute terror to fly. What the helli is going on.

Anyway, my blade has all of a sudden decided to become a frog! For some reason it really jumpy. I have gone through all the checks: motor is good, pitch is good, servos good, tracking is good. But some how I'm missing something and I dunno what. However, I did notice that the throttle is a bit more sensitive. Just holding the throttle stick in place is enough to send the heli popping in the air. When it happens, there isn't a change in the motor speed and it can't be the a collective pitch problem because I have already checked this before hand. I also checked the servos they are all fine; no glitches and has smooth throws.
This usually happens when in the hover. One moment its hovering, the next moment its trying to go to space. It isn't a slow ascent either. Its as if I went from hovering at 1/3 to full throttle in less than a second. It really scares the $%!^ out me when I'm trying to perfect nose in.
What should I do?

I am saving up for a Trex 450. I am hoping that I never see this problem again. Or will I? hmmm?

[txflyer]

im kinda having the same problem. everything checks out good, i am however going to go get some 3n1 oil and very lightly lube the main shaft at the swash plate. my issue isnt hoping but when in hover at times it will suddenly and very quickly shoot about 2 feet str8 down, then pop back up to where i was hovering. the only imputs i am giving is right stick , not messing with the throttle or rudder. the only thing i can think of is glitching, it did it real bad in my garage, then when i started flying out side it stopped but now is back again.

trying checking the ball joints, not sure if thats there techincal name its just what i call them. make sure none of them are loose. check for burrs around where the main shaft goes through the swash. this is whatthe heli guy at my lhs said to check when i told him about it.

[joehelicopter]

Here's what mine does-the Bell hiller mixing pushrods(the ones that go around the blade grips)rub against the grips ,causeing the collective to be "sticky".
Also --I recommend you toss the Eflite Radio in the dumpster and get a DX7 and AR6100 reciever.Makes my CP fly beautifully-very stable

[Rebuild]

Seriously consider trying the grip flip mod. It really smooths things out. The delta hinge effect you gain really improves tracking through the entire collective range too. I have done this to a HB CP2 and BCPP head with excellent results. No hopping hovers anymore!

Edit: This does require reversing the direction of the swash collective which can be done by replacing stock servos with some HS55s (using the stock tx) or by just using a programmable tx.

[txflyer]

ok so do the grip flip mod you have to also get all new servo's ?

[Rebuild]

That's the easiest way if you are stuck with the stock tx. Besides, I find the HS55s also improve the situation you are trying to fix. :wink: (I have seen the HS55s for right at 10 bucks each. I think Tower has em pretty reasonable when you buy in lots of three.)

[F1Atom]

THanks for the tip. Flipping the grips sounds like a good idea but I really don't wanna spend money on the Blade anymore because I have Trex 450 fund going right now. :mrgreen:

I was looking for a more uncostly fix. But I really appreciate all the input and help. Thank You All!

Anyway I was able to temporarily solve the problem by adding more pitch and using some silicone lube on the grips and ball joints. So far its ok for hovering. But when I increase the throttle ever so slowly it punches out on its own. That Little Bastard! :arggg: I'll be sure to check the head for binding. Never thought of that. As far as nose in training, I have to hover tail in to get some confidence back.

Can't wait for a Trex 450! :mrgreen:

[txflyer]

i dont know if this is good or bad, but last night i poped the peices that connect the swash to the flybar, they go around the blade grips. neways i took them off and filed the sides down enough to work they dont touch the blade grips. but now they arent as tight fitting. the ball joints snap on good but you can wiggle them around. my heli guy at the hobby shop is off for thenext 9 days. so i have no clue if its bad for them to have that much movement or not. but it seemed like a good idea at the time.

[F1Atom]

If you can wiggle them around like then you really have ruined it. I think that would be too much freeplay which allow for some serious slop and difficult flying. It may even come off leading to a disaster. I'd probably get some new ones later on.

[txflyer]

really ? damn well good thing i find out now. thanks man

would some kinda grease or lube when for plastic to plastic contact work. im getting tired of my heli suddenly dropping a foot or so then shooting back to where i was hovering.

[F1Atom]

I use a heavy duty silicone lube spray from Wal-Mart. I spray small amount into a small syringe then apply small drops to ball joints, swash, and blade grips.

[txflyer]

what about where the paddle control frame push rod rubs on the blade grips. those are the parts i shaved down on the inside.

[F1Atom]

You could put some there. But on my heli the push rods don't even touch the blade grips. I don't think it should. Its too tight if its hitting the blade grips like that or it could be deformed. Maybe, I dunno I haven't seen your heli.

[Buzzkill]

F1Atom: What brand you using? Any petrolem products in it?

[Schlumph]

I don't have my Tx here with me to check, but is it possible that you may have dirty contacts on the pot for the throttle? If everything else checks ok, perhaps a little forced air on the pot or contact cleaner?

[F1Atom]

Buzzkill:
I am using CRC Heavy Duty Silicone for use on Nylon, Rubber, Metal & Plastic Parts.
Its ingredients are Acetone, Heptane Dimethylpolysiloxane, and Hydrocarbon propellant.
Are these petroleum products? Please dont' tell me I have been using the wrong the whole time. If it is can you suggest me one?

Thank You!

[joehelicopter]

The Bell Hiller push rods are a ONE WAY FIT!-make sore they are facing
the correct way-If they feel sloppy you may have ruined them by putting them on BACKWARDS!

[sctholson]

Hi Everyone,
I'm wondering two things about your problems,
1) could the raised washer on the feathering shaft be flattened. this is just pressed metal and don't hold up well over time?
2) Have you all tried to see if all the ball links are tight on the balls. I see one of you filed the ball down, files don't seem to be the answer for me. I used the chuck from a dremel. I fit it over the ball and twisted, any high spots were very apparent and I just squeezed tighter and it too the high spots out, I kept doing this until all the ball links were smooth. You will need to do this from the swash up.
Good luck
scott

[txflyer]

when i get around to poping all the links off again, i plan on using a pair of hemostats. looks like i could just lside the ball link on to one of the tips and slowly push it up. cuz the tips gradually get bigger.

[sctholson]

txflyer,
Using the hemostats, will that ream out the ball link? If so, I wouldn't recommend it. The Ball link has an internal shape that keeps it on the ball. Maybe I don't know what you mean.
Hey but if you think it will work, give it a try.
Scott

[F1Atom]

I found the problem its the transmitter. I did a full tear down and rebuild of the head. I used baby oil to lube up the damper. Not bad.

When I took it out for a flight it flew very well. Then I gave it a second try and hopping had returned. In the end, I found out it was the transmitter. Im going to open it up sometime and see if I can fix it.
Hopefully this will solve the problem.

[F1Atom]

Turns out it wasn't the transmitter. It was the head. The head is worn out which is leading to slop. I think thats why I am experiencing the jumping. It has about 100 flights on it so I think its time to change it out. I hope this works.

[bbeverlie]

You can also get this with the TX as well the pots that are controled by the gimbals
get dirty! and will cause this especially if you mainly hover. You can clean them
with electronic cleaner from rat shack but in time the problem will be back and
cleaning will no longer be the cure....new TX time at that point!

[F1Atom]

Problem solved! It turns out the problem was the "Head and the Center Hub". The freeplay was way too much on the head. They worn both worn out after about 100+ flights. This is what probably caused all the jumping.

So... after buying new parts I went to install them. But I ran into a problem, after rebuilding the head I wasn't able to reinsert the retaining pin back through the main shaft. So to solve this I had file down the top main shaft until I could fit retaining pin through. Even after filing it was still a tight fit. Oh well..at least there is no slop.

When I got everything together I took it out for a flight. Tada! no more jumping (So far). YEAH! :mrgreen:

Oh ya! One more thing. During my rebuild after I had put the blade grips back in. I noticed that there was some freeplay. I was able separate the grips just a little bit, nothing big. I tried to solve this by putting some washers from the old stock motor set. I placed the washers on top of the rubber bushings next to the Center hub. This made the head really tight, no slop at all. I thought this would be a good thing until I took it out side for a test drive. Upon lift off about 3in off the deck, it started to vibrate like a mad man. It started to break dance almost. Thank God for the training gear which saved it. After landing, I went back to work and took head apart (again) and went back with the stock set up. Bam! It was like brand new again.

Anyway, just thought I'd let you guys know.

Ok...........now where was I? Hmmmm........... Oh ya, nose in.
:D

[txflyer]

dont you just love it when the cp's and cpp's fly perfect ? ive only had it happen a handful of times. but i learn more in that one pack here and there then i do most the time i fly my pro.