Which Heli??

[Bullwhip]

I know, same old queston. But I've got it limited down, so maybe the experience here can help guide me. My criteria is to NOT buy a touchy, 3d, highly manuverable, "fancy" bird. I want something rock steady in a hover, RTF. That's it. That's my number one item of importance. I've narrowed it down to a Blackhawk 450, an excell revolution 450, or a falcon 3d. Please tell me which to get and why.
Thanks in advance...

[kgfly]

You are out of luck. IMO there is no such thing as a 400-450 class heli that is "rock steady in hover" and certainly none that are RTF. At this size/weight they are all quite suceptible to wind and just inherently less stable than larger birds. Perhaps you should be looking at something larger ?

A TRex600 would certainly meet the "rock steady" specification. If you go with A123/M1 batteries it won't cost the earth either. If you want RTF keep an eye out for a good deal on a second-hand T600, get yourself a DX7 radio, a top charger (eStation 902 and two PB6 balancers or Hyperion 1210i and two LBA10 balancers), build up a few 10s1p A123 packs (about $130 each) and go fly.

[Bullwhip]

OK guys, of the three I mentioned, which would BEST suit my needs?
Anybody?

[wren1702]

Don'y purchase anything that you can'y readily get parts for, cause you'll be needing them. Of the 3, I would say the falcon 3D, not a bad price and they have good parts support.

BUT, to echo what kgfly said.....

Any of these are very touchy and take a lot of maintenance/set up time. I had a Revo CP for about a year.

I learned how to fly with it.

I learned how to set up a heli.

I learned how to repair and check crash damage.

Life was great when I moved to a 50 size helicopter. But my learning curve would have been A lot faster with a larger helicopter and a with fewer headaches.

Why not a Trex 450SA. Lots of parts, lots of help available and can be set up as stable if not more stable than the ones you listed.

[Bullwhip]

Well, it's all about $$. The 450 revo has:
[Specification]:
(1)Main blade diameter: 680mm
(2)Tail blade diameter: 130mm
(3)Length:650mm;
(4)Height:230mm
(5)Weight(Including Power System):About 670g
(6)power system: 450 class brushless motor/ 25A Brushless ESC
(7)Rotate ratio:12:140/110:22
(9)Professional headlock gyro
(10)Servo: 4 x 8g
(11)Tail System: Belt Driven Tail Rotor System
(12)Radio System: 6 Channel CCPM FM Radio
(13)Battery: Lithium Polymer Battery 11.1V 1600mAH 15C
CCPM
3D mode conversion switch and adjustable PIT knob
Hold Rotation System
Tail Belt Drive System
High Efficiency Blade
High Efficiency Tail Blade
Rear Tail Servo Stand
Super Iron Main Shaft
High Rigidity Aluminum Tail Boom
Super Iron Landing Skids
High Strength Carbon Fiber Tail Boom Support Set
Plenty of power and head speed for sport flying and aerobatics
[Package Include]:

Helicopter Ready to Fly 100% Assembled w/ 6-Channel Transmitter
450 Brushless Motor
25A Brushless Speed Controller
4x 8g Quality Servo's
Professional Head Lock Gyro
English Manual
LiPo Battery 15C 11.1V 1600mAH
This is for $299

Now to get a trex 450 with EVERYTHING shown would be??
I'm guessing $500 +
If I'm wrong, please help me out. I'd love to have a 450 trex, but....
Thanks,

[Bullwhip]

Dup post

[kgfly]

Bullwhip - don't believe everything you read. I am not personally familiar with the 450 revo or the Falcon 3D but with all that gear included, well you will get what you pay for. Quality, durability and performance are not likely to be good. The electrics and electronics on these cheap RTF are often poor. Even the tolerances and strength of the plastic/aluminium parts can be problematic. You may find yourself upgrading the servos to get decent centering/hold/durability. Then maybe the motor as the original is too weak or has bad bearings or overheats. Then the ESC as it overloads or the BEC overheats. Then the gyro as the one provided just won't hold. The radios that come with them are non-computer radios without sub-trim to properly setup the servos, pitch or throttle curves to tame the flight characteristics or the ability to grow with you as you move one day to better/bigger toys.

None of these problems may occur, but they are common in the cheap RTF pkgs. It is also common for the parts for the cheap RTF to cost more than those for TRex. Do a comparison on the common crash bits like main blades , main shafts, feathering shafts, flybars, main gear, tail blades, booms. Most of the TRex parts come several to a bag so be sure to compare the unit price.

Getting a TRex450 into the air with a good radio (DX7), good electronics (3xHS65mg, GY401/L2100T, HS56/HDS577/S3154/S9650), some batteries (HXT 3s 2200mAH 20c @ $35 each), a top quality lipo charger (FMS CellPro4S or eStation-BC6) and some tools and spares will probably cost $1000. I know that is much more than you were hoping or planning to spend. The problem is that there are many, many more "I wish I hadn't wasted my money on that RTF, it ended up costing me more than a T450" stories than there are "Wow, that RTF was a great experience, cheap, reliable, easy to learn" stories.

Certainly I agree with Wren, choose the one that has the best parts support in your local area and ideally someone else nearby that is flying it and can help check your setup or provide advice.

Do some research here and on rcuniverse.com and rcgroups.com for the models you are considering to see whether they have good or bad reputations or what parts usualy need upgrading to get them to fly well.

Also don't imagine that an RTF is really RTF! You will have to check every screw and bolt. Make sure every part has been mounted the right way around. Check the tunining of the head and tail. Very few people report that their RTF was properly assembled and tuned ready to fly out of the box, despite the advertising claims.

The low prices of these RTF CP helis makes them very appealling and it is frustrating to consider waiting even longer to save up for a more expensive heli, but it is likely to be well worth the wait. In the short term get yourself a decent simulator (eg ClearView for $30 plus an Esky USB controller from Ebay for $35) and begin your flight training while you save up for a heli that will really do the job.

[chris6414]

Greetings from Iraq. I am no EXPERT but I know plenty about the Revo 450 and Belt CP as we have 4 Belts and one Revo 450 flying out here. I have rebuilt the revo for a guy at least threee times and parts are there. (All Esky) and the thing is a very good flyer. For the price it is the best deal going in the 450 size realm of helos. The radio is user friendly and has manual pitch.range curve set-up, throttle hold, idle up, dual rates ALt switch and feels alot like my Futaba in your hands. The gyro it comes with(Esky 0704A HH) is very good. You need a bigger battery though to balance it better. The battery it comes with will fly it with a 9 volt strapped to the front of it to balance it right. 2200 MAH and over 150 grams is just right. Not too much can be said about setting these birds up. Helos are inhearently unstable no matter what the size. I repair full size ones for a living.

I personnally fly a Esky Belt CP (Yellow) and it is a dream to me. I learned on a Blade CPP and have about 15 years of plank experience. Mine has no mods and can toss it around pretty well. No 3D for me though. I too looked at the TREX and the price of the Belt was too good to pass up and I haven't been disappointed. There is a really good thread on the Belt CP on RC Groups and it is Identical at the Revo 450. Most Trex parts are compatible. If you want to do the head though you need to go all the way up. Esky does make some good aluminum upgrades for the revo and Belt including a tail set-up. All the Align Blades are compatible and the Revo will fly on Blades from 290 to 335 MM. Stock flies really good providing it is set-up correctly. ALL helos when purchased need to be gone over with a fine tooth comb. Loose screws, screws that are TOO LONG like I just found out the other day in the motor mount that touch the motor windings and overheat your ESC. :bomb: No apparent damage and the Thermal cut-off on the ESC does indeed work as I found it. :mrgreen: It could take you a whole day to go over your bird to make sure she is ready for her first FCF. If you remember only one thing, remember these are not toys and they are indeed AIRCRAFT and they can seriously hurt you and innocent by standers. They are designed well but you must understand the difference between flying and crashing is a very obscure line. Get help, get trainer gear, get a sim and don't play it. Fly it like it will cost you your aircraft if it crashes. That is the one downside to sims. The ones that "PLAY" them cannot learn on them.

I don't know about the Falcon but have read good things about it also.
I also looked at the Black Hawk 500 and it was going to be expensive.

If you want to know more about the revo 450 let me know. I believe it to be a great flyer in the 450 size realm. I sadly have never flown a TREX and I'm sure they are the next level in regards to performance for those that have Half a G to throw down just for starters. I have some pics and video of my belt in flight if you want to see if it is for you. The Exceed is a better deal because your get the radio too. I'm using a Blade CPP radio to fly mine.

[Bullwhip]

Thanks for the info Chris. Looks like I'll be going with the Exceed 450 revolution. Any additional info, tips, tricks you can provide about it would be greatly appreciated. :thumbup: Thanks again for taking the time and sharing the info!!

[chris6414]

Anytime, if and when you crash. Flybar case, flybar, main blades, tail booms, main shafts and even tail shafts and main gears (soft,something has to give)from the sudden stops. The grips are very tough and only seen the guys break a few of those.

Don't worry about power as she'll have more than you can handle.
Take care

Chris

Oh yeah, don't forget to check the motor mount screws. Take the motor out and make sure they have plenty of clearance between them and the windings. Some are gtg, others (like me) have had problems with them touching the windings.

[kgfly]

Great info Chris, much better from someone that knows from firsthand experience, thanks for chipping in. :D

[r_cpilot]

I got a Heli-Max MX400 to learn on. The heli is inexpensive and a lot of the Trex parts can be used.