SOLVED: Separate Tail ESC

[thaiboxer]

Here's the deal...

I have switched things over to the Parks 370 4100kv, 8 tooth pinion, Micro Heli auto-rotation gear, Common Sense 1250ma, Spektrum DX6, G90 HH gyro, dual tail motor mount, and I am building the Fiber Body frame kit to swap over any day now.

My problem is the speed control for the tail is giving me a lot of problems. I am currently using the old 3-1 to drive the tail but I can not use Idle up because it won't hold. I bought an Eflight 10amp ESC to drive the tail (it was the smallest in stock at my LHS) and it is driving the tail too hard. If I try to hover it takes serious left rudder input to hold the heading and if it tries to make a correction it over drives and puts the heli into a clockwise spin...

Is the 10 amp ESC too much for the tail causing this or is there an easier fix? I tried to turn down the travel in the DX6 for the rudder, that seemed to have no effect.

Any help you could give would be great. Everyone here has helped so much in the past.

[txflyer]

the 10amp should be fine, you can even run that on the main motor. dont wast anytime with the tail esc setup.. spend that money on the belt drive kit for the cpp... im sure mortificate will chime in here on it. but for 99 bucks shipped you cannot beat it.. i have almost the same set up as just minus the lipo.. im running a tail esc as of tonight cuz i blew my 3n1. as soon as i have another 100 im buying the belt drive tail..

btw

the 3n1 CANNOT supply enough power to hold the tail during acceleration. like giving it a punch of throttle. the belt drive will hold like a rock once setup correct.

[Mortificate]

Yep, Freestyle belt mod= awesomeness.
I am gonna make another CPP with all my spares soon and I am thinking of making it run a seperate ESC just to see how it performs.
I never had many tail issues with the Dual tail motor mod untill I changed to a 10t pinion on my Park 370 4100kv. Once I did that the tail was compleatly useless. The FSBM solved that problem.

[thaiboxer]

I have seen the posts about the belt drive... that would be great, but I already have everything to run in separates.

I have everything set-up as instructed on the Heli-Hobby website, and the gain on the DX6 is set high around 115%. As it hovers it will surge clockwise then slow then another surge of power. If I hold it in my hand it will fight the rotation when I turn it but it feels WAY more powerfull than with the 3-1 hooked up.

any ideas?

[txflyer]

try not using the gyro sense.. pull that plugg out of the rx. then set the gain on the gyro its self..

[Mortificate]

hahaha, naww that is a question for someone else. I never had a too much power issue with my tail. It was always the opposite.
Have you tried turning the gain down?

[txflyer]

thats why i said unplug it.. that gain setting is seriously high...around 80% in hh mode gets me tail wag..

[txflyer]

ok so an update since hooking up a pixie 20p esc on the tail of my pro. ive got a 15second flight in this mourning before the rain started. my pitch is cracked out it took almost full throttle to get her off the ground. but boy did she rocket up. THE TAIL HELD fairly good from what i saw but i was in oh shit mode..seriously one click up and its 15ft off the ground in about 2 seconds. i think i got maybe a 5in tail slide then it went right back to holding the tail.. i cannot wait for the the rain to stop os i can trim out the pro and get flying good again..ive actually regressed (spelling) in my flying abilitys

[thaiboxer]

I will check out the gain. I had it low before and it was spinning counter-clockwise. I started putting the heli back together last night, I had it in pieces getting ready for the fiber body but I want to get it working as it is and then chage it over later.

Also, the instructions on helihobby said to pull the positive and negative wires coming from the tail esc to the gyro... if I do that the esc does not arm. If run all three wires to the gyro it arms correctly but am I going to fry anything?

Thanks for the advice so far, keep any ideas you have coming...!

[thaiboxer]

One more thing, what modifications do you need to make to the fiber body to run the belt tail? I feel another 100 bucks going soon!

[txflyer]

i dunno about the body, but just unplug the red wire wire. thing is your main esc powers everything else. so when you tie 2 esc into the same power source. the lipo. you dont want both of them trying to push the current through everything.. my tail esc gets it power from the battery. but i pulled the red wire on the plug that goes into the side of the gyro. so that way the main powers everything since it has a bigger bec, and the tail sends all of its power to the tail motor.

dude i dont even use a body on my pro.. its a pita to get on and off. the trex is so much better, just 2 body mounts and the canopy kinda locks onder the frame

[thaiboxer]

Sorry for the misunderstanding... I was refering to the Fiber Body kit from Heli-Fever.com (300class EP Heli. Fiber body) It is the whole frame assembly. You posted on the forum about it I believe.

I was curious if the belt drive set-up would work without major modification over just using the stock carbon boom?

As far as the body goes I just use the top two body mounts just like my TREX 450, I have the battery stuffed into the nose to counter the weight of the dual tail motor also.

[txflyer]

id email don at freestyle-hobby.com

[thaiboxer]

well. I pulled the red wire from the esc and i could not get it to arm again. I held left rudder for a 10 count and no response from the tail. I will have to get a video up to show what is happening, because I have no ideas left as to what the problem could be.

If I turn the gain down on the gyro the tail drives the nose clockwise non-stop. as the gyro setting gets higher the tail will wag, but it pushes the nose clockwise as it surges, just like before.

[txflyer]

here is how mine is wired up
main bl esc runs everything.. the tail esc ties into the wiring for the battery.. using the jst y harness. the rx plug on the esc goes into the side of the gyro with the red wire removed. the gyro then plugs into the rudder channel.. a video would help

[thaiboxer]

That sounds the same as my set-up. I can put up a video tonight, I tried to video it by myself late last night but that did not work out.

[thaiboxer]

OK! I got it. I bought a whole new speed controller and everything worked perfectly. I got a 7 amp from the store... threw it on all sloppy and voila! IT FLEW.

Now I can set all the wires right and get everything looking good and hopefully be back on track with this thing.

Thanks for your time and effort figuring this thing out.

[txflyer]

no problem man good to hear your back in the air. weve got a solid week for thunder storms so i cant test out my setup just yet. i got a short test in and with a 85% throttle at high stick the tail held when it rocketed up off the ground due tosome binding then the servos over coming the binding and snapping to fullpitch..ive replaced my s curve feathering shaft with a new str8 one.. so im sure with what ive learned my heli should be flying better then ever...post up some pics of your setup.. i did mine super sloppy but since getting my rex ive learned that it is super super hard to get a cpp looking good in terms of wiring

[thaiboxer]

I can put up a picture in a little while. It is not very pretty but I think I finally got all of the wiring away from the main gear. I love the way this thing is running right now also, I had to turn the gain setting way down so the tail didn't wag... so there must be better response on the tail.

I am only running the single tail motor right now because I am waiting on another direct drive tail motor, and although there was not enough room in my garage to punch the throttle I have high hopes the tail will hold.

After lunch I will chime back in and let everyone know what my results were.

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

I had my 10 amp e-flite esc for my tail, all I had to do to keep it solid was adjust the rudder sub trim to counter the spinning. I used the gyro sense wire and it all worked fine.

[thaiboxer]

Here are a few pics of the blade after a full weekend of flights...[/img]