HeliJive Mode 4 Vs. Mode 6

[GimpyGolden]

So what is the difference how these two modes operate?
Is there any performance differences between M4 and M6?

Reason I ask is when setting up my throttle %'s on my Goblin I get drastically different head speeds for the close to the same throttle % between the two different modes.

Looking at the two here is what I get.
M4 53% nets 2100 on the tach.
M6 57%=1700, 58.5%=1800 and 63%=1900.

I would like to run M4 as I am most familial with the performance of it but can't get the head speeds I want until I can get a smaller Motor Pulley.

My two flights in M6 seemed not very strong in climb out I assume due to motor running low rpm(15,500-17,500) as it is way over geared.

Once I can get a 20t pulley and run 65% Throttle% in M4 to get my 1900 I expect to have better performance, is this correct?

[MrMel]

M4 vs M6 above 50% is no difference.

M4 vs M6 below 50% has different governor, M6 is softer, made for flying around in low RPM.


However, the drastic difference you see in RPM, make sure you have 100/100 atv and 0-100 curve when you swap modes (mode 1)

I have not played with it much but as described it's different P/I ratio, i.e. how agressive it is.
With it, its possible that it differs in RPM as well, as it's two different routines that runs.

[GimpyGolden]

Thanks MrMel.

On both tests I was above 50%, weird.
Always do M1 before changing modes and have not done throttle path cal on a HeliJive, was recommended not to. Also had linear T-Curve 0-100%

[dl7uae]

Mode 6: Continuous speed control.

The uplift throttle-->PWM is totally different from modes 4 and 5, look at the five graphs here (http://62.153.249.80/jlog/jlog2/faq/artverwandt-helijive-basics-kompendium/mode/modes-anschaulich/#HJ-Mode 4).

Below a certain value of PWM we have more differences concerning active free-wheeling, auto-timing and, as Fredrik said, P/I control parameters.

A speed freak like Oliver Jellen prefers to run mode 6.

Tom

[GimpyGolden]

So I guess you can't reach the same top head speed in M6 as you can in M4?

[dl7uae]

No, you should can.

[swalko]

No, you should can.

Then why my Helijive v10 in mode6 will no add more rpm's when i reach 75% throttle position. All is correctly calibrated at linear 100/-100 throttle curve. I use too bailout feature at about 20% throttle position, is this the cause?

[GimpyGolden]

Hmmm, I don't know what's up then.
Should my throttle percentages yield such different head speeds between modes?

Should mode6 still respect the "not go over 65% Tx%"rule for proper head room for Gov to function

I will test again to see at what percentage I reach 2100 on Mode6, if it will reach that head speed.

I know in M4 I can not reach as low as 1700. Got down to 18% Tx and Jive stops commutation. This is with Auto Bail Out enabled.

[swalko]

Hmmm, I don't know what's up then.
Should my throttle percentages yield such different head speeds between modes?

Should mode6 still respect the "not go over 65% Tx%"rule for proper head room for Gov to function

I will test again to see at what percentage I reach 2100 on Mode6, if it will reach that head speed.

I know in M4 I can not reach as low as 1700. Got down to 18% Tx and Jive stops commutation. This is with Auto Bail Out enabled.

With mode6 i reach much lower rpm's than in mode4, but in mode4 i reach higher rpm's than in mode6, however i use mode6.

[MrMel]

Then why my Helijive v10 in mode6 will no add more rpm's when i reach 75% throttle position. All is correctly calibrated at linear 100/-100 throttle curve. I use too bailout feature at about 20% throttle position, is this the cause?

That is fully normal.

1. The headroom you leave is 10% on top and bottom.

2. The Throttle vs PWM output has "uplift" as Tom calls it, meaning at 85% throttle inside the jive your at 100% PWM.

So overall, 85% then remove another 10 (headroom) points from that = 75% is full throttle.

But do you mean you get different RPM if you run Mode 6 vs Mode 4 at full throttle?

I will see if I can add some new features to my calc, Mode 6 being one of them, "Adjusted ATV yes/no" is another...

[Sandy]

Yes.....The mode 6 and atv calibration additions will be very helpful.

With 82/-82 cal, and running mode 6, I can get 1450 with 53% and 1750 with 65%. Do I get the advantage of mode 6 when my throttle% is above 50%?

With 82+/- atv cal , I can use throttle% much less than 50% to get 1450.

[swalko]

That is fully normal.

1. The headroom you leave is 10% on top and bottom.

2. The Throttle vs PWM output has "uplift" as Tom calls it, meaning at 85% throttle inside the jive your at 100% PWM.

So overall, 85% then remove another 10 (headroom) points from that = 75% is full throttle.

But do you mean you get different RPM if you run Mode 6 vs Mode 4 at full throttle?

I will see if I can add some new features to my calc, Mode 6 being one of them, "Adjusted ATV yes/no" is another...

Thank you for the explanation. Yes, i had higher rpm's with Jive 80 in mode4 than with Helijive in mode6 ... 1875 vs 1825. It was my first flight with Helijive and i do not spend a lot of time with measurements, because this difference may cause fresh charged pack vs pack charged hour/s before flight.