is Align 450SE v2 any good for a beginner

[ignis]

and I mean a total beginner, a person who has never flown an RC helicopter before? I was looking at the electric t-rex 450se v2 at my LHS and liked it quite a lot, but I thought I'd ask here first if it's a good choice for a heli noob like me.

if it is, what training gear, motor, battery, esc, gyro and servos should I get with it?

thanks in advance.

[dicko_trex]

Yes i think the v2 would be a good first heli and they can be tamed down to be fairly docile.
As for electronics the most popular choice is
hitec hs65mg servos for cyclic as they are very strong
futaba gy401 gyro and either a futaba s9650 or jr 3500g tail servo
stock motor and esc will give plenty of power for a beginer
Flight power evo 2170mah lipos or 2500 for more flight time but are a bit heavier, the stock align battery is no good and will puff after a few flights you are best to sell it or trade it in at your lhs

[Jermo]

T-Rex450 SE V2 is an excellant first chopper but I'd suggest you invest in a simulator first and checkout RADD's school of rotary flight (google it). If you don't push beyond your limits you have fewer crashes and be flying circtuits in under 90 days if you practice every day. Also ask around and find local help that is something that translates well.

[rabidguineapig]

With about two weeks work and some patience... a v2 turns into this:
http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee60/rabidguineapig/IMG_0512.jpg

[ignis]

thanks for advise guys.

I bought my 450se v2 and RealFlight 3.5 sim yesterday. now I have to get the rest of the required items. as advised here, I'll be getting:

hitec hs65mg servos
futaba gy401 gyro and futaba s9650 tail servo
hyperion 2100 lipo (can't help loving hyperion batteries and chargers)
Spektrum DX7 radio (?)

now the questions.

1. Spektrum DX7. it's quite expensive, so I guess the reasonable question is: will I be able to figure it out? it will be my first air radio and I just want something reliable and not so difficult to set up.

2. where can I buy training gear for 450se v2? I've checked a few online heli stores like readyheli and amainhobbies but have not been able to find a set of training gear for align 450 helicopters.

3. are there any online 450se v2 assembly manuals out there? something better than the stock piece of crap which seems to have been made for a different helicopter kit on the first place?

thanks in advance.

[rabidguineapig]

you can buy any kind of training gear or make your own; search the forums in the 450 section for it... Get the DX7, it's a very nice radio and has many great programming features- you can watch Jermo's DX7 video on programming... and watch all of Finless's vids for the setup they will help you out A LOT. Have fun building and good luck flying :thumbup:

[Skiddz]

A couple dowels, some wiffle balls and some epoxy and you've got training gear. do like rabid says, search the forums and you'll find a dozen different ways to make a set and get 'em mounted up.

As for the manual, it's not going to hold your hand. You have to consider the people that wrote it aren't catering to the guy who's never built a heli kit before. Your best bet is to download and watch Finless's 450SE build videos. While not the same kit, it's pretty dang close and all the principles Finless explains in the video and the techniques he shows you apply to almost all helis.

The DX7 is *VERY* reasonably priced for what you get and has more then enough capability to hold you for several years and several models.

I'm sure you've heard this before, but this is not an inexpensive hobby. You *WILL* crash and you'll need to know how to rebuild and set up the heli to keep the enjoyment factor up. Having said that, I can tell you this is one of the most enjoyable hobbies one can have and the people here are top-notch in helping out..

Good luck and don't be afraid to ask questions.

[TheBum]

Your best bet is to download and watch Finless's 450SE build videos. While not the same kit, it's pretty dang close and all the principles Finless explains in the video and the techniques he shows you apply to almost all helis.

Along with those videos, watch Finless's RC-Tek Diablo head setup video. Finless uses a tool there that allows you to get the correct lengths on the servo-to-swash linkages the first time, making setting up the rest of the head a very speedy process.

[PilotSmith]

Good choice. I wish I started out with the TRex 450 instead of the BladeCP. TRex so much easier to fly! Although more expensive up front, I think I would have saved money starting out with the TRex as I constantly crashed the Blade CP, and after many flights with the Trex, only 1 significant crash. Get plenty of practice first on the simulator. For me the simulator is harder to fly than the real thing. So if you get good at flying without crashing on the sim, you should do well with the real thing.

[Claude626]

I started with the Trex 450SE V2 not too long ago (back in May). Love the thing.

Download all of Bob's videos and have each one running on a loop as you build that particular section. It's very helpful. I find that the instruction manual does a good job at illustrating what needs to go where and which part. Bob's videos shows you all the "tricks" and little gritty things that'll come up in assembly, which are very helpful as well as assuring you (at least for me) that you're going at it the "right" way.

As for the DX7, I love the thing! I'm sort of a gadget guy, so navigating its menus and figuring out which does what wasn't a problem for me, but the instruction manual that came with it (roughly 45-50 pages regarding helicopter setup) was very helpful in setting the thing up complete with screenshots of the radio screen.(I think if you can handle that blinking 12:00 on your VCR, you're good enough to handle the DX7 menu lol) Watch Jermo's DX7 video, it covers pretty much all that you need to know really. The only thing I haven't been able to nail was the tension screw on the throttle stick; either too lose or too tight, but that's only me not being able to find the right tension I'm comfortable with.

Since you've already decided to get 3x Hi-tec HS65MG, you won't want the servos that comes with the DX7 kit. There are plenty of trusty ebay shops that sells the DX7 and the AR7000 receiver without the servos at a chopped price. Just have to look.

I didn't think the training gear was much of an importance. I made my own training gear out of a coat hanger; used it for about 5 flights and just decided to follow Radd's instruction and keep it off. I've been able to do training in hover and positioning the thing around me(basically can make it go where I want it w/out fighting it too much) without the training gear. Haven't crashed since the last boom strike I reported from a hard landing.... *knocks on wood*

You'll love this thing!

[ignis]

all righty then, I've bought my DX7 (gorgeous thing it is, I was pleasantly impressed when I first took it out of the box) and gy401 today and the servos are back ordered and I should get them soon. I've also downloaded pretty much all the t-rex 450* and dx7 related videos I could find so I'll have something to watch and learn while I'm waiting for the servos.

in the mean time I have been playing around with RealFlight 3.5. my first intention was to find a proper T-Rex 450SE v2 model and practice on it. however, after googling a bit the only thing I've found was T-Rex 450SE (close enough) on Knife Edge (http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=1852) forums. I've tried importing it, but RealFlight gave me an error: The aircraft variant "T-Rex-450 SE (Noob)" could not be loaded. It is based on an aircraft you do not have. I have no idea what it is that I'm doing wrong so I just started to practice on Axe CP instead. any advise?

and last, but not least, knowing full well that as a total helicopter beginner I'm bound to crash sooner or later, what crash kit should I buy in advance for my 450se v2?

thanks in advance ;)

[atcspaul]

as for the simulator i practiced with the axe cp which is a hard copter to fly. my thought is i wanted to make learning as dificult as possible so when i flew my 450se it would seem easier. and actually it was. as far as things needed in a crash kit if your local hobby store has parts i would just buy them as you need them. depends on the crash what you might need

[TheBum]

Here are the things I bought for my RC-Tek Diablo crash kit:

Main rotor blades
Tail rotor blades
Feathering shafts
Main shafts
Tail rotor belt
Flybar rods
Paddles
Servo gear sets (metal, to eventually replace the stock plastic)

I may pick up a spare tail boom, but I'll see how it goes.

[TheBum]

BTW, my first crash a couple of days ago bent my feathering shaft, so I was glad I had spares in my crash kit.

[ignis]

I have another question, this time about receiver battery.

what is the weight limit for the reciever battery on 450se v2? problem is, my DX7 came without a receiver battery (Spektrum apparently do not have DX7 kits with chargers compatible with european sockets, so they decided to remove the receiver battery as well).

now I have to get an aftermarket one, but which one whould I get? long 5 cell 1100 mAh or somewhat square, slightly heavier, (~170g) but 2100 mAh?

[Claude626]

I don't think the 450 needs a separate battery for the receiver. I don't use mine. It's just sitting in the box. The Rx works just fine powered by the main battery.

I used my receiver battery when binding the AR7000 to the DX7. Also, when setting up the servos and stuff like that without wanting to plug in a main 11.1v LiPo.

But to answer your question, the battery is 4 cells 4.8V 1100mAhr NiCd. Dunno about weight. I'm curious... How would Spektrum expect you to bind the Rx with the Tx w/out the battery...?

[ignis]

you mean to say that the stock ESC has an in-built BEC and I don't actually need to use a separate receiver battery?

and I don't think Spektrum had much to say regarding the packaging here. my LHS probably bought ordinary american kits from Spektrum and removed the charger and the battery from it.

[Claude626]

Yup, I believe so. I didn't need the Rx battery for flight with the included ESC with the 450sev2.

[vteknical]

ignis,
Download this version from http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=509
Model# T-Rex-microHELIS_EA

It's pretty agressive for a noob, so here's what to do to tame it:
Click:Edit Aircraft
Click:Airframe then fuselage then main rotor
Adjust Collective Pitch Max to 8 deg
Adjust Collective Pitch Min -8deg
Adjust: Cyclic Pitch Deflection 4
Adjust: Cyclic Roll Deflection 4

Hope this helps

[piwko4]

do the heli orientation trainer in the training menu before u do practice the 450. the experience you get from it is worth its weight in gold. oreientation or lack of it will be the cause of 90% of your crashes.

[ignis]

ignis,
Download this version from http://www.knifeedge.com/forums/downloads.php?do=file&id=509
Model# T-Rex-microHELIS_EA

It's pretty agressive for a noob, so here's what to do to tame it:
Click:Edit Aircraft
Click:Airframe then fuselage then main rotor
Adjust Collective Pitch Max to 8 deg
Adjust Collective Pitch Min -8deg
Adjust: Cyclic Pitch Deflection 4
Adjust: Cyclic Roll Deflection 4

Hope this helps
I've downloaded that heli, but here's the problem: it starts to shake uncontrollably every now and then. I've attached a recording of it doing that. needless to say, flying it becomes rather impossible and I have no idea what causes it and/or how to fix it. I've tried changing the main rotor settings as you advised, but it still goes wild like that all the time.

[vteknical]

Hey Ignis,
It sounds like you worked with an un-modified and then modified helicopter. I'm lost then, have you tried other models from knifeedge with success?

I downloaded T-rex 600n ver 6 and many other models with no problems, the Mikado models are pretty good too.

Sorry I can't help any further since I'm not too well versed in this software, I know enough to be dangerous.

Perhaps another member can try downloading this file and report their findings?

[jongalt26]

Hey, I'm working on my first "real" heli myself, almost similar stats
[v2, 401, s9650 ds, 65HB's, DX7 etc.]
I'd say im about halfway done for the assembly, i had to wait for the rest of my tools to come in [which will ahppen tomorrow] which includes my ball link resizer.
Anyways, to make a short question long.
Is there any easier way to put the plastic ball link holders on the push/pull rods?
There has got to be some sort of trick, or easier method than just using my meaty ole fingers.
I searched the forums & googled the internets, but couldn't find an answer. Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks!
j

also, this hobby is made a heckuva lot easier with Finless vid's and the general broad support!

haha i found the answer to my question i think:
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=41201&highlight=push+rod&page=2

[Claude626]

Hey jongalt26, I built my 450se v2 not too long ago and I ran across the same issue. What I did was take a tiny phillip screw driver that came with the kit and slightly enlarge the openning in the ball link holder. That way, it's easier to begin threading. Take a pair of plier and pad the jaws with papers or something so that you can grip the metal rod without damaging it. Then I just thumb screw the pre-widen hole of the ball link holder into the clamped rod. Half twist at a time and applying decent pressure every twist. I guess you can use gloves, but I prefer to be able to feel the rod and holder as I twist to know if it's tilted. It's a pain in the behind, but those damn ball link holders aren't pre-threaded...

[jongalt26]

Thanks for the advice!
I ended up using an Xacto knife and chamfered the hole a bit so it would be easier to start threading. I found it best when right after I got the one end started, i'd thread the other end, this way I could twist either side and the opposing side would keep the bar from twisting. This way I didnt have to use pliers.
Thanks Again!
j