I'm new to this

[Shaver]

Hi,
I'm thinking of starting a business in Aerial photography. All I'm doing right now is intense research into it. I've never flown a helicopter before except for in a simulator and I know very little about the hobby. All I have to spend on it is about four grand. I've decided to do this because, where I live people have very little immagination, so nobody else does this sort of thing and I think I could get a return on my investment by doing residential photography. It should also be noted that I'm just finishing high school and will be going to university soon, where I will be taking a pretty stiff load of courses so I won't have a heck of a lot of free time on my hands. But if I had a business, I wouldn't have to spend time at a job to support myself either.
So I'm wondering if anybody has any suggestions on how I should get into this, any warnings on what to avoid, and suggestions on what I should be researching in the mean time.
Thanks

[LoopBaCK]

Most important is to learn to be very proficient flying the helicopter. It's a long way from no flight experience to flying a helicopter well while concentrating on the purpose of the flight - photography. You'll find it is a lot of work coordinating visually the heli from dozens to hundreds of feet away while switching focus to the camera image composition.

Certainly an attainable goal but I recommend you start flying heli's off the sim as soon as you feel you're ready. When you can fly the real ones (nitro, electric,...) forwards, backwards and can auto like it's nothing... then you'll almost be ready for AP. Most importantly - don't rush it. Everyone here had a first flight, a first crash, and so on... you'll get there. Start practicing and keep practicing.

Another detail to remember - flying AP is more like flying scale aircraft. No flipping and such - just smooth transitions and steady hands.

[SeaHawk]

I would use your budget to learn to fly first. I would not recommend buying or trying any photography yet. In fact, if you are going to be very busy in school, I would leave a portion of your budget for repairs. If you really want to get into it before you graduate, stick to flying only straight and level, no aerobatics, and practice what you need for aerial photography...it will save you money. When you can fly nose in, can auto, and feel proficient, then you can think about camera work. Your best bet would be patience. Learn to fly now, get a few years experience and hopefully do well enough in school to land a good paying job. Then you will have the expendable income to absorb the inevitable, expense, crash. And, don't get married right away because your wife will bit*ch constantly about your hobby (until it starts making more money than it costs...and then she will want the excess spent on stupid stuff like landscaping and interior decorating). Best of luck.

[Shaver]

Thanks for the advice, guys. But when I'm in university, I won't have time to start a business, so if it's going to happen, I have to get things started this year. I already have a lot of experience on the simulator, though. Would it be a good idea to buy a cheap helicopter just to practice on?

[trackhead]

Hi,
I'm thinking of starting a business in Aerial photography.

nobody else does this sort of thing and I think I could get a return on my investment by doing residential photography.

Buy a mast (not a heli), a nice DSLR, and go for it.

If you have limited time, and in the future will have less time, then the mast is likely your best bet.

[Shaver]

There is something to be said for that. The thought did cross my mind, but aside from the obvious drawbacks (cumbersome, less versitile), I think a miniature helicopter would be a selling feature in itself as it is much more interesting. However if I would ask someone if they wanted a picture of their house taken from a mast, they might think otherwise. But I'm just speculating. Are there any successful entrepreneurs who only use a mast that can state otherwise?

[bullaculla]

Well, we are all helifreaks here so i think we all have RC helis ;)
Unless you really love flying and fixing and tinkering with miniature helicopters, I’d go with a mast first. I don’t have any experience with them, but they seem to be more cost effective, and to me more versatile since you can use them in low light conditions and long exposures, and also in places where there are a lot of people or trees. Then buy a heli that is capable of AP, and learn to fly that really well before you try to put a camera on it. The sim is incapable of reproducing the way a heavy AP helicopter acts in the air, but it does help. I still spend almost an hour on the sim everyday... but I’m working on tictocs and piro flips :mrgreen:

[trackhead]

There is something to be said for that. The thought did cross my mind, but aside from the obvious drawbacks (cumbersome, less versitile), I think a miniature helicopter would be a selling feature in itself as it is much more interesting. However if I would ask someone if they wanted a picture of their house taken from a mast, they might think otherwise. But I'm just speculating. Are there any successful entrepreneurs who only use a mast that can state otherwise?

Your client doesn't care how you get the photo. Climb a tree if you have to.

A mast is safer, cheaper, easier, and in many cases, a better tool to get the job done. You can do low light shots, panos, etc, etc. With a mast, you won't have to worry about crashing through someones window.

[furyphoto]

But if I had a business, I wouldn't have to spend time at a job to support myself either.
Thanks

If you are looking to start a business to help pay for your university, a mast will get you up and running and making money quickly. Then you can spend a bit on the heli and learn later.

I have an existing photography business and am trying to add aerial photography (with a heli) to it. I am almost a year in, and well over your $4000 limit, and I am still not ready to go out and use it daily to make money. If you are going to have little time, and limited funds then it will take a long time before you are ready to shoot with a heli.

If you want a heli because you like the idea, then buy one, and have fun with it, but if you are looking to start a business, and make cash asap, start with a mast, and add a heli later.

[Shaver]

But masts are quite expensive. All the masts I've found are selling for prices comparable to those of a heli. I don't want make that kind of investment for a mast. Also, If a heli is designed to be used only for ap, isn't the technology available to make flying helis more or less risk free? http://www.neural-robotics.com/ is just an example. Now, this is miles outside my budget, but is there something that will do something simpler for less?

[trackhead]

But masts are quite expensive. All the masts I've found are selling for prices comparable to those of a heli. I don't want make that kind of investment for a mast. Also, If a heli is designed to be used only for ap, isn't the technology available to make flying helis more or less risk free? http://www.neural-robotics.com/ is just an example. Now, this is miles outside my budget, but is there something that will do something simpler for less?

Heck no. Heli's are NEVER 'risk free'. Any 10-20 pound object with a rotors spinning at 1200-2000rpm is never 'risk free'.

Hate to be a show stopper, but 4 grand and no experience isn't going to get you very far. And your time frame is a bit too fast too, in my opinion.

Slow down, listen to the advice of others, and give your self time. It won't happen overnight.

A mast system is still way cheaper than a complete heli system. And your results WILL be better photographically, for atleast a year.

[Tonystott]

But masts are quite expensive. All the masts I've found are selling for prices comparable to those of a heli. I don't want make that kind of investment for a mast. Also, If a heli is designed to be used only for ap, isn't the technology available to make flying helis more or less risk free? http://www.neural-robotics.com/ is just an example. Now, this is miles outside my budget, but is there something that will do something simpler for less?
Have you investigated the cost of a NRI heli? I don't think your whole budget would be enough for a deposit!

Please listen to the wiser counsel above. Get a mast first, as something like 80% or more of paying jobs will be within the capabilities of the mast, and it will be fully paid for in no time. Then use further income to start out in helicopters. As furyphoto says, it is likely to be at least a year before you can seriously consider flying AP heli missions on a commercial basis.

As for a risk-free heli, make a list of potential points of failure with a heli, ANY one of which could spell disaster, and the case for a mast is compelling. Plus of course practicality in busy environments. I have taken shots from my mast from the footpath six feet from 6 lanes of fast-moving traffic, shooting through powerlines. Don't try that with a heli!

Not wishing to dampen your enthusiasm, but you need to do a lot more reading before leaping into this, IMO

[furyphoto]

Don't get us wrong. There isn't a single person on this forum that doesn't want to see you learn how to fly, and start a successful AP business. That's why we are here in the first place, to share experience, and help each other out.

You are getting the responses you see above because we have all been there, and we know how much it will cost, and how long it will take. We are sharing our experience with you, not trying to discourage you.

We know that based on the budget, goals and time line you have set forth ($4k, earn money for school and maybe more, and ASAP) that it will be quite a while before you can realistically learn how to fly proficiently, advertise, get jobs, earn decent money, cover you investment, and be out of the hole financially. Especially with a full course load!

If your primary goal is to start a business, and earn some dough, then heed the advice above. If what you really want is to start a heli AP business, and the earning can wait, then go for it! Spend you money, fly, crash, rebuild like the rest of us, and eventually you will get there.

My advice is this:
Many hobby stores have simulators on display that you can try, find one, tell the hobby store guy what you want to do, get a little coaching on the sim, and try it, right there, in the store, zero investment. You might walk out and head for the closest place to buy a mast, you might walk out with $4000 worth of heli parts in you hand!

Either way, good luck!

[Shaver]

Ok, well, I knew that it was unrealistic to begin with, but I wasn't planning to make any investments any time soon. Hell, I don't even have a drivers licence yet, so I wasn't planning to make an investment for a few months at least. Right now I'm just doing research and learning about helis and so forth. I thought that gaining knowledge would be the most crucial thing to do, but I guess practice with a real heli is important too. Anyway, I'll probably get a mast, earn money on that, and then buy a small cheap heli, and proceed from there based on how difficult I find it.
Btw, does anyone have any comments about doing ap with a blimp?

[MLaBoyteaux]

What camera are you using for your photography? The camera you intend to lift will determine which blimp/heli you'll need for the job.

Figure 1 oz of lift for each cubic foot of helium, then subtract the weight of the blimp itself, that'll give you your net lift.

[crewchief]

...Also, If a heli is designed to be used only for ap, isn't the technology available to make flying helis more or less risk free? http://www.neural-robotics.com/ is just an example. Now, this is miles outside my budget, but is there something that will do something simpler for less? No. 95% of safety and success is piloting skills. You'll find when you start getting jobs that those skills will be constantly challenged, either by trying to maintain a steady high hover at an odd orientation, or even more so, in trying to safely negotiate takeoffs and landings from tight spots, around tree limbs, power lines, etc., while keeping public safety always foremost in your mind. A little kid can get away from an inattentive mother and start heading straight for your "safe" position. As always, it is not the mundane and routine aspects of your well-intentioned planning that is critical, but rather your ability to cope with the unexpected. No amount of electronics or mechanics can substitute for your judgement and skill.

Helicopters are a LOT of fun to fly, and a large part of it is related to the satisfaction of knowing you are mastering a difficult set of physical and mental challenges. It sounds like you really want to learn to fly, so maybe you should get into the hobby for your own enjoyment, without trying to turn it into work right off the bat. You will then begin to appreciate the depth of experience that is behind the previous postings. If I were to summarize their excellent opinions I would say the pattern of advice that emerges is a) yes, RC helis are great, something you would probably enjoy, and b) you will probably deeply regret getting into something as demanding as AP at the same time you are trying to bring your flying skills up to par.

Best of luck!