Can a responsible, cautious newbie be "safe"?

[windchimes]

My Trex 600 E is 90% complete. I have never flown a Heli before and the anticipation of my first flight is akin to the excitement a child feels the night before Christmas. .. I have been diligently practicing with the Phoenix simulator for two weeks and I was starting to feel resonably confident that I could get my bird into the air and safely down again. Very eager to fly! ...THEN I started reading the SAFETY posts. Wow!!! The graphic images make it very clear that serious injury is likely if you argue with your heli. Now I am not feeling so proud or confident of my simulated flying skills.

Being a new pilot, it is very easy to get brain drain and push the controls when I should pull. So, even though I feel I am a consciencious an responsible person I realize my brain may fake me out occasionally. This may not have much impact when training on the simulator but could be disasterous with the real bird.

I would really appreciate some advice from experienced pilots! Specifically:

When trying to land my simulated bird I tend to get sideways drift just as the bird touches down. This causes a crash every time. If I bring the Heli directly towards me during landing I can see the sideways drift and compensate for it. Now I can see where this may be a very unsafe practice. Can anybody please describe the best (safest) landing approach for a new pilot?

When flying the simulated bird close to the ground, as in attempting a landing from a hover state, I try to keep the Heli close enough to me so that I can see its attitude yet far enough away to reduce the likelyhood that the bird will eat me if I make a wrong move. Even so, I have experienced the simulated heli comming briskly my way when trying to stabilize a crappy hover. When things go wrong they seem to go wrong in a hurry. ... Is it advisable to keep the real heli on the ground until I can control the simulated heli 100% of the time? Obviously, the better I am with the simulator the better my odds will be with the real thing. But I wonder if I will ever be 100% with the simulator. Sure would like to fly the real thing some day.

Thanks in advance for your valued input!

Windchimes

[philiusm]

WOW learning on a Trex 600e. I thought I was nuts learning on a Swift. The following approach worked for me when I was learning to hover, I still have to master forward flight. I have had two or three crashes in about as many months most down to me flying when it was too windy or just pushing too hard. I learnt to hover in the back garden with a good set of training gear, not the crossed sticks type. The ones that I used had carbon fibre rods with balls on one end the other end going up into a central hub at an angle. The benefit is that this training gear raises the heli up away from the ground effect and has a good degree of spring. The heli tends to bounce rather than crash. The Trex might be a little daunting to fly initially, my Swift still scares the crap out of me sometimes. I got some really big training gear for that baby. The rods are 8mm carbon fibre, each one at least 600mm long. It came with some little plastic rollers/wheels on the ends of the rods. I found that they tended to catch in the grass and I replaced them some 90mm wiffle balls so that the heli could roll about on the training gear if necessary. If you can get someone to trim your heli so it just hangs in the air for a few seconds before it starts to drift then you will find learning to hover very much easier.

My preference is to do all hovering practice at a low level, almost skimming the ground. If it all goes horribly wrong you can just close the throttle and everything comes to a stop. As punishment for getting it wrong you have to walk back to the heli and reposition it to its starting point. Much the same way as Radd's school of flying suggests. I found that trying nose-in the helicopter was always trying to get me, it was like a moth to a bright light. I usually stand at one end of the garden with the heli at the other end some 6-8 metres away. I took to cutting the throttle once it had moved more than a couple of metres away from its starting position. The disadvantage with flying at low level with training gear is that it can catch if you tilt the heli over too much. If you let it build up too much speed before you bail out the heli can tip over but it just depends on how big the training gear is in relation to the heli as to how prone the arrangement will be to tipping.

To start with it's all up down up down, lots of little hops but you gradually get the hang of it. The key is not to push it too far and dump the heli back down in plenty of time. The more gently you can put it down the less bounce back you get. I have got to the stage where I have taken the training gear off my Swift and my little GAUI and just left the training set on my Trex 450. On a good day I can hover in any orientation and fly very slow circuits round and round the garden. On a bad day I might as well just give up and go and watch TV.

Most importantly make sure you have a throttle hold switch set up to that if you accidentally knock the stick you won't have the heli spool up on you inadvertantly. I had my Swift on the garden table spooling down after I had checked the tracking. I dropped something on the floor and as I bent over to get it I managed to get my backside clipped by the rotor blade, it hurt more than I expected, so just be very very careful.

[ChasHeliCop]

Try reading and starting out with Radd's School of Rotory Flight.

http://www.dream-models.com/eco/flying-index.html

The most important thing to remember is patience, practice and discipline. Don't try to put it in the air the first pack. You have to learn to crawl before you can walk.

Just my two cents worth............... good luck

[Gimbal Lock]

Hello Windchimes, I started from ZERO R/C flight experience, so I hear myself in your post. The 600 can be an excellent first heli, but it's a very serious piece of machinery, and needs to be treated like you would any other potentially dangerous machine. I'd say that your posting this question shows that you see that and are looking for ways to mitigate the risks, so you're on the right track.

As for me, I flew the sim for 4 months before buying (dec-april last yr), building and flying the real thing. I could hold a tail and side in sim-hover, and was starting to do lateral flights.

I gotta be honest, for me, htose first real flights are pretty damn scary. There's a lot of money, and a lot of liability,hangin' off your thumbs. That and it took me a few flights get over being distracted by the sight of the turning head, which looks nothing like it does on the sim (to me anyway).

The biggest thing for me was the very real rush of fear and adrenaline that comes up on the first months of flying, the sim is a great tool, but there's no rush.

As a newb just traveled the same road you're headed down I'd offer these recommendations;

Please, please give the sim some more time! Practice until you can land it in at least one orientation, every time without drifting or rolling over. Several here on the freak have said "if you can do it on the sim, you may be able to do it for real, but if you can't do it on the sim, you wont have a chance for real"

Also, keep flying the sim until hovers feel really natural.

Before the first time you spool up, search out somebody near you to check things out. I've always been one to jump into things with both feet, but helis pretty much require a support group!

[R1R 7humbs]

My approach to flying and experience is similiar to what Gimbal Lock described. I practiced in the sim a lot because I knew the 600 wasn't a toy and I really don't want to crash something that costs upwards of $2,000 (radio and kit + mods).

As much fun as it is to fly for real... don't do it until you're extremely comfortable in the sim with basic tail in, and side hovering. If you're flying into yourself.... it's going to be really bad in real life if it hits you. Check some of the video links in this section of the forum, to see what happens.

Before I flew for real, I could fly inverted and do autos no problem in the sim. Just hovering and doing basic flight was stressfull the first time I flew for real (at 30 feet off the ground). The first landing is also tough and after bobbing up and down a few times I just said to myself "the hell with it.. fly it like your in the simulator... so yeah, i was talking to myself during the first landing LOL! Now after 12 flights my stress level of flying is just starting to relax a bit (only a bit). My biggest fear is a mechnical failure... I keep thinking it's going to throw a blade at me. :eek:

[BirdManNJ]

Hello, I am also a newb....i have had ~ 6 very good flights, and only 1 not so good (in my defense, this also was the only time i had a buddy box hooked up, both the instructor and i lost sight of it only ~ 10 meters away....stupid part was if I would just put the damm canopy on it wouldn't have happend.....it was late and getting dark just a $ 300.00 DUMB ASS BLUNDER!!) But any way back to you....you should fly the hell out of the sim until it is almost second nature... I can't stress how important that is...Further I strongly disagree with the concept of flyiing close to the ground and if you get in trouble cut the throttle for the following reasons:
1) Provided you can comfortably fly the sim, hovering several feet off the ground is easier and for the most part safer, when hovering at grounf level or in a "light" condition the heli is subject to turbulence from rotor wash and ground effect. So it essentially will be harder to control. Further you must be very aware of the wind more so close to the ground because of dynamic rollover tendency of a helicopter. By no means am i ragging on traning gear they are excellent and should be used until you can take and land without any lateral movement, the key here is to take off.....air and altitude has never crashed anything it is alway the damm ground
2) To use the throttle as your planed and praticed out can be dangerous. even assuming that you are set up wth maybe a -3 or -2 collective low stick setting, this method of learning does the following: It reenforces a very bad habbit....what if you were in Idle 2 practicing foward flight and you panic...so as you have trained you dump the collective/throttle, but this time you have -10 degres of pitch , well you will crash for sure even if you do manage to put it on the skids.

That is where sim training counts....hopefully you have at least un-dumbed your thumbs enough so the heli responds to your thought, not first thinking how to make the heli do what you want, and then thinking what your thumbs have to do. Your bail out should be a flight condition you are comfortable with i.e. tail in. But there are times when we all just lose orientation in that case we use throttle hold....that must become your panic button.

Additionally find a local club or a local freak and have them help you. Make use a buddy box if you are getting the itch to see your bird fly, most importanly be patient, This is a great hobby----but you really need to respect these things

[philiusm]

Hadn't thought of it that way. I must admit I've taken the training gear off all but one heli now and I now tend to give the heli some throttle and try to get it tail in to recover. I still land if it's starting to go wrong but it's very controlled rather than a panic. I am flying in a very tight space. Although the heli is about 30 feet from me and there's places to run to if it decides to come for me. I've got only about 15 feet flying room side to side, not much of a margin for error. Flying the Swift side on in that space is very challenging but once I get it stable I can normally keep it still. It's getting it stable that I find difficult. Today I flew my GAUI 200 through the apple tree. It trimmed all the little bits of twig off as it went through the lower branches and emerged on the other side none the worse for wear.

I'd be interested on any tips to bring the heli into a hover following forward flight. I guess just practice on the sim.

Regards,

Phil M

[Skiddz]

Stop that lateral movement before you set the helicopter down. That's why it's called "flying" and not "try to keep up with the machine".

Training gear is a good thing. Contrary to popular belief, gear like the rotopod that slightly elevates the heli does not get you out of ground effect. Unless the heli is 4+' above the surface, it's going to be in ground effect. Ground effect, in and of itself, is NOT a bad thing. There is NO way to avoid it and each successful flight requires flying in GE at least twice.

The training gear's purpose is to make the landing gear as wide a platform as possible to prevent the rollovers so prevalent among new pilots.

Some people swear by Radd's to learn. Those people say it's a good thing. I'm a firm believer in the sim as it develops much needed muscle memory and the proper hand/eye coordination.

Spend more time on the sim perfecting those landings. The 600 is a very stable machine, but as you've seen, it can do a significant amount of damage. However, if you keep it far enough away from you and GO SLOW, you can minimize the danger.

The sim is good, but actual stick time is better. Strap on whatever training gear you've got and spool it up until it's JUST light on the skids.. You don't want it leaving the ground. Now work on keeping it pointed where you want it and use the cyclic to scoot it across the ground (This is easier on concrete or asphalt) stop it, then hold it in position. Move to another spot and hold it there. Your goal is to learn to start and stop movement of the heli and maintain heading with the "rudder".

Your movements on the sticks should be very small.. Most newbies end up overcontrolling the heli and that's where the trouble starts. If you're "churning butter" witht the sticks, lower the throttle a bit, let the heli stop moving then try again.

Again, don't get too close to yourself. The 600 is big enough you can 30+ feet away and still see it just fine.

Good luck!

[ke6d]

One thing the sim does not teach at all is setting up the heli. You need to take the bird to the local flying field to have experienced heli pilots check it over. Most of the time, they will even take it up to a hover and trim the heli for you. Learning will be much easier if the heli flies correctly when you start.

I have help quite a few new pilots going over their new heli and also trim it out for them. A lot of times, I found small problems such as reversed gyro, tail blades spinning backward, or blades out of track.

For a TRex-600, you should keep it at least 20 ft away from you at all time when you learn to fly.

Good luck,

Dan

[great_life]

You have got to be kidding me. Nobody is except only one person here is telling you not to fly the 600 for now. Would you seat inside an airplane and take off in it after weeks or months of training on a simulator? Would you let your kid drive your car on the road after months of training on a simulator? Because this is exactly what you are going to do, putting your life and others at risk. "hovering 20 feet away is safe", even that is not safe if you are a newbie. This machine can slide over so fast toward you from 50 feet when you panic. A few month ago after I got pretty good on the sim, I tried landing my 450 about 20 feet away and the blades hit the ground sending wood chips flying about 30 feet apart. The broken blades barely missed one of my friends. A lesson learned, After the incident, I went back to the simulator and the Sabre and practiced intensely before I flew my 450 again. What I am trying to say is more simulator time is a necessity but not the means to an end. You should not fly a 600 no matter how much sim time you have, Until you learn to master a Dragonfly #4 or Sabre you should not fiddle with your 600. When I say master, I meant you should be able to fly the Dragonfly nose in and safely land it without thinking. Flying a 600 is a great responsibility and you can theoretically kill someone with it. After reading some of the posts here, I have great concerns on the type of risk us heli-freaks are ignoring. Simulator is not the only solution to safety. A beginner must combine real life experience using safer models before binging out the big guns(450 and 600). You should believe your first instinct about the threat of the 600 which was the main reason why you posted here. At least you are a very responsible person which I admire.

[Rotor Ruiner]

I agree that a 600 is not a machine for the beginner. I learned a blade CP, then stepped up to a Caliber 5 (600 size nitro). The first time I spooled that thing up, it scared the hell out of me. A 600 size heli is a serious piece a machinery. I think the best way to go about it is definately more sim time. Then once you feel accomplished hovering and landing in all orientations, find a good pilot in your area and hook up a buddy box. That way if things go bad, which they can and quickly, you will have someone experienced at your side to hopefully stop a good time from becoming a bad experience. I had a blade from a Trex 450 come in contact with with hand during spool down, and it still required 28 stitches and I couldn't fly for two months as I cut a tendon to my thumb. You should enjoy your 600, just remember to give this machine the due respect it deserves.

[Skiddz]

You have got to be kidding me. Nobody is except only one person here is telling you not to fly the 600 for now. Would you seat inside an airplane and take off in it after weeks or months of training on a simulator?

Why not? This is how a lot of pilots are trained. When I started flying helis, my 1st few hours were in a sim. 1st actual flight, I was hovering with all three controls. Sure, I had an instructor next to me, but *I* was flying the heli. Was I shooting autos and making slope landings? No, but eventually I learned to do so by flying the heli *AND* practicing in the sim. Did it happen overnight? Nope, but it was all learned slowly and with small steps - same as we learn to fly RC helis.

Would you let your kid drive your car on the road after months of training on a simulator? Because this is exactly what you are going to do, putting your life and others at risk.

A lot of kids can't see over the dash or reach the pedals so this is kind of a silly argument. Yes, a 600 (or any other size helicopter) has risks inherent with its operation, but we try to minimize these risks by practicing on the sim and with actual stick time.

"hovering 20 feet away is safe", even that is not safe if you are a newbie. This machine can slide over so fast toward you from 50 feet when you panic.

IMO, most newbie's panic move is to slam the collective down, not bang in a ton of cyclic when it's getting away from them.. The sim and some training gear will minimize this risk as well.

A few month ago after I got pretty good on the sim, I tried landing my 450 about 20 feet away and the blades hit the ground sending wood chips flying about 30 feet apart. The broken blades barely missed one of my friends. A lesson learned, After the incident, I went back to the simulator and the Sabre and practiced intensely before I flew my 450 again.

This all depends on the "pilot". I have a whopping 4 flights with training gear on a heli - and those were in 1993 when the only sim available was Skylark and I didn't have it. The heli was a Schluter JR50. After learning to scoot the heli around on the ground with control, I took the training gear off and managed to hovers lots of times. Yeah, I did crash the heli twice, but one was a mechanical failure and the other caused by a rush to get the heli to the ground to avoid an oncoming unleashed dog. 12 years later, I bought a new heli (Raptor 50) and not only hovered, but did slow circuits with no training gear. I bought a Blade CP shortly after that and that thing was a handful compared to the larger heli.

What I am trying to say is more simulator time is a necessity but not the means to an end. You should not fly a 600 no matter how much sim time you have, Until you learn to master a Dragonfly #4 or Sabre you should not fiddle with your 600. When I say master, I meant you should be able to fly the Dragonfly nose in and safely land it without thinking.


Why? The sim is a great tool for developing muscle memory and learning orientations. It's that muscle memory and orientation training that'll help with actual stick time. Training gear will minimize the risk of a tip-over.

Flying a 600 is a great responsibility and you can theoretically kill someone with it. After reading some of the posts here, I have great concerns on the type of risk us heli-freaks are ignoring. Simulator is not the only solution to safety. A beginner must combine real life experience using safer models before binging out the big guns(450 and 600). You should believe your first instinct about the threat of the 600 which was the main reason why you posted here. At least you are a very responsible person which I admire.

I have to wonder if you've flown a 600. It is MUCH more stable than a 450, not as quick on the controls and much larger so orientation isn't as much an issue. Again, all of this is dependent on the pilot. I learned solo. I never had any help and until 2 years ago, didn't have a sim. Until a few months ago, I never even flew with anyone else. I learned by doing and realizing one of these models can F you up. Telling someone they have to go buy yet another heli to learn is ludicrous. Buy a sim, learn your orientations then go spool up.

Exactly what risks are we ignoring?? I'm not trying to start an argument here, but what the OP is trying to accomplish has been done by a lot of people who have zero experience, only these days, with the sims and online forums like this available, it's quite a bit easier.

[ke6d]

You have got to be kidding me. Nobody is except only one person here is telling you not to fly the 600 for now. Would you seat inside an airplane and take off in it after weeks or months of training on a simulator? Would you let your kid drive your car on the road after months of training on a simulator? Because this is exactly what you are going to do, putting your life and others at risk. "hovering 20 feet away is safe", even that is not safe if you are a newbie. This machine can slide over so fast toward you from 50 feet when you panic. A few month ago after I got pretty good on the sim, I tried landing my 450 about 20 feet away and the blades hit the ground sending wood chips flying about 30 feet apart. The broken blades barely missed one of my friends. A lesson learned, After the incident, I went back to the simulator and the Sabre and practiced intensely before I flew my 450 again. What I am trying to say is more simulator time is a necessity but not the means to an end. You should not fly a 600 no matter how much sim time you have, Until you learn to master a Dragonfly #4 or Sabre you should not fiddle with your 600. When I say master, I meant you should be able to fly the Dragonfly nose in and safely land it without thinking. Flying a 600 is a great responsibility and you can theoretically kill someone with it. After reading some of the posts here, I have great concerns on the type of risk us heli-freaks are ignoring. Simulator is not the only solution to safety. A beginner must combine real life experience using safer models before binging out the big guns(450 and 600). You should believe your first instinct about the threat of the 600 which was the main reason why you posted here. At least you are a very responsible person which I admire.

C'mon, a lot us learned to fly helicopters all by ourselves. As long as the helicopter is checked out and trimmed properly by an experience pilot, the 600 is pretty safe to learn on provided that the new pilot could get some sort of safety instructions (radio power up/down, preflight check list, etc..) from the experience pilot.

I learned on a TRex-450 SE after 2 months on the sim. I spent the first few battery packs to keep the heli from sliding all over the place (heli is just light on training gear) If the heli was sliding out of control, I throttle it down and went over to reposition it in tail in position before trying it again (Radd's school). Once I could keep it in a 3 ft x 3ft box, I started to raise it up a few inches (up to a foot) then set it down. Gradually, I was able to hover it 3 ft off the ground, then it went on from there.

My first crash was well into my 200 flights when I was learning to do loops and rolls. I am crashing more now because I don't fly level anymore :)

Lots of people trained on 30-50 size machine because they are so much stable and easier to see than the little 450 or Blade CP.

If safety is observed, learning on a TRex 600 is actually much easier than on a 450 or BCP.

Dan

[wlfk]

I taught myself to fly on a T-Rex 450 + sim. I recently bought a logo 600. I have to say I don't think I would teach myself to fly on a 600 size.

I could fly pretty well on the sim before I powered my T-Rex up for the 1st time, and I still crashed, despite training gear. It was actually one of my most expensive crashes to date. I crashed to a greater or lesser extent every outing for the next week.

I also had a number of setup problems with the T-Rex. On flight 1, I had inadvertently set the gyro to rate mode; it didn't hold the tail and part of the reason I lost control was that I was having to work hard to keep it tail-in. I also learned a few useful lessons the hard way, even after I could fly pretty well. For example, if I'm taking-off from boggy ground I now do so slightly violently, so that if one of the skids has stuck slightly the helicopter doesn't keel over as it would if I took off slowly. There are a fair few things I know now, that I would not have liked to learn on a 600-size.

So, to my maiden flight on my logo 600. I took off and it seemed very squirrely. In part this was because it took a few flights for the ball links to loosen. But more so, I had forgotten to add any expo on the TX and I normally fly with 20%. What's more - I had left the gyro in rate-mode! I landed pretty sharpish; rectified both faults and had a good days flying, but the truth is I came considerably closer to trashing the helicopter than I like to admit. Had I not been really pretty experienced by then, I would have crashed for sure.

So...

If I were in your situation, I would find someone willing to buddy me for the first few flights. The sim is great and will help your learning curve considerably, but my experience was that it took several flights to learn the difference.

If I couldn't find someone to buddy me, then by a 450 size. Frankly my T-Rex is just as easy to fly as my Logo - which is in part due to the settings. But truth it's plenty stable enough to learn on. You will almost certainly save enough money to pay for it, and then you can sell it on when you're ready.

K

[KrazyKyle]

We plank pilots (and until I finish this T-rex, that's what I am) know that bigger planes often fly better. At about 72" span, depending on wing loading, they start flying more like the real thing, not so twitchy. Do helis follow the same phenomena? It seems to me that size doesn't matter as much as solid design and a tame setup. I'd rather teach someone to fly fixed-wing on a 100" Telemaster than a .20 sized Pitts...

[WJackson]

More sim time. I have three pilots learning on 600N's and are doing incredible. More sim time though. If you can do the Rads school moves on the sim, and I mean every time, then and only then is it time for the real thing. Get your setup verified by an experienced pilot, and maybe even a test flight. Other than that, have fun.:thumbup:

[wlfk]

I'd rather teach someone to fly fixed-wing on a 100" Telemaster than a .20 sized Pitts...

The OP isn't talking about being taught how to fly - he's talking about teaching himself.

K

[KrazyKyle]

I taught myself to fly fixed wing...with a nice BIG, slow motor glider. Not a 40" span acrobatic plane. My point is, size doesn't matter as much as the setup of the aircraft and the attitude (respect for the danger) of the pilot.

[Skiddz]

The OP isn't talking about being taught how to fly - he's talking about teaching himself.

K

Nobody taught me to fly either planks or helis. My 1st heli was a 50-sized Schluter... Never hit myself or anyone else. No sim, no help from anybody, just a copy of Ray's Authoritative Helicopter Guide...

[wlfk]

I'm not saying it can't be done - I taught myself to fly too. But given the choice I wouldn't teach myself on something 600-sized.

K

[Skiddz]

We didn't have much choice for anything smaller back then. :)

The larger helis are more stable and a little slower to react which only serves to help the newbie.

The bottom line (Sorry Finless!!) is this; learn (or try to) on whatever you're comfortable with. No need to buy 3 "disposable" helis to learn with when a sim will get your muscle memory and orientation skills up to speed.

[Jim T]

I learned to fly, by myself, with a Raptor 30. I did make extensive use of the Rotopod deluxe trainer gear: http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=103602 The nice thing about this particular gear is it lets the heli rotate and tilt somewhat. The advantage of this is being able to hover without actually leaving the ground.
What you're proposing can certainly be done. As has been said, get in lots of sim time and take tiny baby steps as you progress.
All that said, I must say that if I'd had a mentor to work with, I'd of progressed much faster. I'm still not all that competent, but making headway.
Also, I'll say that I would be less concerned being around you doing what you're proposing, than I would some of the 3d hot doggers I've seen videos of. As a spectator, that looks scary to me.

Jim

[Tim Smith]

I did not have any instructions that came with my 3dx450se or a manual for either radio or heli .I had no idea what possition any switchs belonged in before you plugged in the battery and guess what..............:arggg:Yep it was in Idel and pissed off when it flew across the coffe table into the cleeing and my welted arms ..........:wow2:

So I guess maybe if we as newbies knew finnless boob before hand we could save some cash and painful lessons being safe newbies,But some places are way to into saling you stuff that they don't warn you or give you a good talking to first .They just want your money ,and for you to leave.So my awnser to your question s is no,

[Tim Smith]

I learned to fly, by myself, with a Raptor 30. I did make extensive use of the Rotopod deluxe trainer gear: http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=103602 The nice thing about this particular gear is it lets the heli rotate and tilt somewhat. The advantage of this is being able to hover without actually leaving the ground.
What you're proposing can certainly be done. As has been said, get in lots of sim time and take tiny baby steps as you progress.
All that said, I must say that if I'd had a mentor to work with, I'd of progressed much faster. I'm still not all that competent, but making headway.
Also, I'll say that I would be less concerned being around you doing what you're proposing, than I would some of the 3d hot doggers I've seen videos of. As a spectator, that looks scary to me.

Jim :hug:about this hovering with out leaving the ground? Can that truly be called hovering? Think of Dynamic tip or roll over.This is what trining gear does .It stops the skid from touching the ground and becoming a tip over or roll point. ANd I personally found that the best alt to practice your hovering is around 4 to 5 feet. It lessens the ground affect of the rotors and allows you to hold the heli in on place better so you can get a feel for what the heli is needing if any trim or minor adjustments. Land adjust . and then go to 6 feet .then 10 and practice that is what was best for me. And I found that if you pop up a bit after you spool up the skids come away from contact with the ground more evenly and quickly ,eliminating Dynamic tip over.just get up there and deal with it. :banana:clappp

[windchimes]

Hello again! …I really want to thank EVERYBODY who offered suggestions to this newbie.

After some consideration I decided to take the advice offered by several of you and purchase a cheapo to learn on. Turns out, that was exceptionally fine advice.

I went ahead and purchased a Honeybee King 2. Spent several hours setting it up. The motor fried before I even finished adjusting the main rotor tracking adjustments. I purchased a JGF 400DH 4400KV brushless, outrunner motor and a Dynam 30 amp ESC from RC Super Sales and installed them. No more motor problems.

Read all of Radd’s training then tried to apply what I learned. It seemed impossible to keep the bird within the 3-foot box that was suggested. Every time I would get the heli light it would scoot to the left and seemed beyond my ability to keep it where it belonged. I spent some time making mechanical and trim adjustments but still had no success. Decided to take the bird out where there was more room and get it air-born and see how it handled.

I noticed it was more stable once I got it two or three feet in the air. Still, I was only able to keep it in the air for 10 seconds or so before my courage was depleted. Definitely a joy watching the heli go into the air. What a trip!

I invested one more battery in just trying to hover. I have got to admit, my hovers were pretty squirrelly. No bragging rights here!

I purchased my Trex 600E from Dee Tee Enerprises in Eugene, Oregon. Dennis, the owner, told me I was going to crash. “It is just part of learning to fly helie’s” he said. So, I expected to crash but hoped to postpone it as long as possible. Never the less, splattering $1800 worth of heli didn,t really appeal to me so I put the Honeybee in as pinch hitter for my first real flight.

I waited eagerly until the wind died down to nothing. …I am lucky to have 110 acres as a “yard”. One of the wonderful advantages of living in Oregon. Anyway, flying room was no problem, so I found a clearing about 50 yards from some trees (lots of them), set the bird down and turned on the transmitter. I connected power to the heli then backed up 50 feet or so. Took a deep breath then spun up the rotor. Got the bird up 6 feet AGL or so and tried to hover. As before it was a pretty poor exhibition of skill. Enough of that I thought. Lets see what this bird will do.

I added power and went into forward flight. It was absolutely beautiful to watch the machine fly. Got up about 30 feet or so and to my surprise a gust of wind caught the Bee and started taking it towards the trees. Things are happening fast and I am trying to turn the bird around but my brain goes into freeze mode. I decided it was time to apply my previously defined “escape maneuver” which was to cut power. I actually had plenty of time but panicked. As you might expect, the heli came down hard. The main rotor shredded, the flybar was bent, canopy was cracked, the tail boom was bent and the tail housing was a bit damaged. Nonetheless, I was elated! I was stoked! I finally flew my helicopter. What a great feeling.

I trained on the Phoenix simulator for a month or so before flying my Honeybee. I was able to control the simulated heli pretty well and could generally land without a mishap. I discovered the sim is a great tool in helping one develop coordination and learn to anticipate the heli action, or reaction from my input. BUT, it definitely did not replace the experience of flying the real thing. It is a bit like driving a race car in a video game as compared to driving the real thing.

After investing $40 to repair the Honeybee I am back in the air. These parts are cheap and the experience is almost priceless. I am now focusing on improving my hover now that I got the novelty of forward flight out of my system.

As a newbie I admit I do not know much and my skills at flying heli’s are almost shameful. Nevertheless, I am really jazzed with my new found hobby and committed to learning to “do it right”.

I am thankful to the folks who recommended that I purchase an inexpensive machine to learn on. Taking that advice has saved me bookoo dollars and will, no doubt, prevent my nervous system from becoming completely shredded. … Besides that, the honeybee is actually fun to fly!

Windchimes