Logo 500 3D Ok for a beginner

[tnelson]

So what if I just skip buying and paying $ 700.00 for a Trex 450, and pay another $ 300.00 and get this engineering master peace? I promise to do a lot of simulator work first? I know the parts are more expensive, but $ 700.00 for the Trex would buy a lot of parts. :lol:

[AusAnt]

Well it worked well for me. I wanted something well engineered and big enough to be really stable. It was more expensive than the smaller helis, but way more stable and easier to fly I think.

I just ordered the heavy flybar paddles that come with the DX, and set it up in the least aggressive holes on the mixer arms (mentioned in the manual). I used 550 blades to get a larger (therefore more stable) rotor disc. I got training gear to save some money from tipovers (am still using it after 20 or 30 flights now, and the traininng gear has saved a lot of small tipovers). I practised on the sim for about 6 months first, so I could hover comfortably in all orientations etc etc.

In short, this is a brilliant beginner heli because it is so precise and stable, and it handles wind really well, easy to see in the air etc. I love it and am really happy with my purchase. The only downside over some other helis is the cost, but if you don't mind paying a bit more for quality, it is awesome!

Ant

[tnelson]

Thanks Aus Ant, Where did you purchase your 500 3D, and where can you get parts?

[AusAnt]

I bought mine from Ken at www.rcflightstore.com (http://www.rcflightstore.com) - he is based in the greater Vancouver area and is a great guy, really easy to deal with, good pricing etc, especially if you buy a lot of stuff from him. He keeps spares too, and is very quick to get them in the mail.

But it really depends where you live. Most Mikado dealers also stock plenty of parts. www.espritmodel.com (http://www.espritmodel.com) and www.fxaeromodel.com (http://www.fxaeromodel.com) are another two which come to mind if you are in the States (or they all ship worldwide too anyway).

If you say where you live, it would help in recommending a dealer.

Ant

[tnelson]

Ant, I live in Colorado. Which parts would you recommend to have on hand for spares, and which motor are you running?

[AusAnt]

My setup is in my signature at the bottom of each post - has worked brilliantly for me. HS is 2040 on 21t mod.05 pinion, which seems to be a really stable HS for learning.

Others will probably need to help out here on who is best to buy from - the only other place other than RCflightstore I have ordered from is Esprit Model in Florida - I have found them to be excellent to deal with also.

As for spares to keep on hand, I ordered none at all - I just figured that say I crash on a weekend, I can order the relevant parts on Monday from any of the online dealers, and have them by Wednesday or Thursday at the latest, ready to get going again for the next weekend. It is a super stable heli, so for the first while as long as you take it easy and have practised plenty on the sim, it's not as if you will be crashing every second flight or anything. However if you want to keep some spares handy, maybe somebody else can suggest a list.

Ant

[tnelson]

Did you purchase you oversize landing gear, or did you make your own? Also with your setup, and easy flying, what kind of flight times are you getting? I would think that with this heli being lighter that Trex's that the flight times would be a little longer?

[bladebraker]

I think thats a smart move! The Logo 500 flys 100 times better than the trex. Just get some good standerd size metal gear servos so you wont strip servos every time you crash and go with wood blades and you are good to go! Also get some nylon scews to mount your landing gear on so you do not break your frame when you crash.

[AusAnt]

There is a sticky at the top of the logo page on this site, called Power systems for Logos, Data and Graphs. It is worth a read to see what everybody is using for their setups. Here is a link to the second page which has my setup and info on it, and it also has another couple of 500 3d's, including Mercuriels which has the popular Hacker A40 setup. Even though most guys here are into 3d, and need much higher headspeeds than us, it is a simple matter of calculating the correct pinion to get the desired headspeed for a beginner.
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=25112&page=2

I chose the Kontronic Tango motor because it is known for high efficiency and cool running temps.

At the moment I just fly in basically little hovering circuits, very slowly and gently, and I land at about 7:30. I put back in about 3.3Ah to 3.5Ah into my 5Ah packs, so I could fly for maybe another 30 seconds or 1 minute and still be within the 80% rule.

For my training gear, I just bought this product
http://www.greathobbies.com/productinfo/?prod_id=HMXE2025
The other option is go to a kite shop and buy carbon rod about 3/8" dia and make your own with some plastic balls about 3 or 4" dia on each end. But this gear was so cheap I figured it wasn't worth making my own. The other thing is that this has a wooden block in the middle with holes drilled for each rod, but they are angled down at about 10 or 15 degrees, so the 4 legs point a bit downwards. Then they act not only to prevent tipovers, but have about 6 or 8 inches of shock absorbing capacity in them before your skids even contact the ground. Both these features have come in handy many times, even though I could fly perfectly well on the sim.

Bladebreaker's points are all good ones - my servos are good metal gear ones and I have had great success with them. As for the wood blades, he is probably correct, they are a good idea, but they only come in 500mm, and I wanted 550mm for stability. Plus I figured that carbon blades come pre-balanced, so I didn't have to balance woodies. Also I figured that by using the training gear for quite a while until I am really confident, I would just go for the carbons.

Have a look through this forum - there are build videos, power systems data and photos and videos in the stickies at the top, and there are many other threads with people asking for advice on various setups.

Ant

[th3tick]

As for the wood blades, he is probably correct, they are a good idea, but they only come in 500mm, and I wanted 550mm for stability. Plus I figured that carbon blades come pre-balanced, so I didn't have to balance woodies.

Do be careful with that theory. My RotorTech 560s came about 1/4" from the chicken-dance of death due to some significant imbalance. I no longer trust manufacturers to test that for me, and balance everything. I've had some similar experience with Radix 600s on my T-Rex. It's definitely worth 20-30 minutes careful balancing...

John

[tnelson]

Thanks very much, you guys, for your input. Do you have a link for info on balancing the main blades? Does any one bother balancing the tail blades?

Tom

[AusAnt]

th3tick,
Thanks for that - I didn't realise that it was still necessary to balance carbon blades, looks like I had better get balancing (especially as I am chasing a minor vibe at the moment)


tnelson,

Finless Bob has a video for just about everything to do with building, setting up, and flying a heli in Finless Bob's Helifreak Tech Room up high on the main page of Helifreak. Here is a link to it:
http://www.helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=60

There is a topic in there called Heli Skills and Setup 101 - http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=41692. This has a video on blade balancing, along with videos on pretty much everything else you will ever want to know. Of course there are logo 500 build vids by Mercuriel in the tech room or at the top of the Mikado page too - essential in my view.

Have a good trawl through the topics in Bob's Tech Room - I watched lots and lots of videos before I built. It is worth looking though the build videos of other helis too, because for example there was a GY611 video in the Trex 600 Build videos which I watched and it helped me set up my gyro.

Ant

[th3tick]

You're certainly welcome ;)

While in no way disparaging Mercuriell's fine work on build videos for the Logo :thumbup:

Finless has also started a build series for the Logo 500: http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=58079

John

[cptsnoopy]

Does any one bother balancing the tail blades? Tom

Yes, I find that most need a little correction.

[bladebraker]

Here are some 550 woodies if you want to go that route
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXMJX4&P=SM
http://www.readyheli.com/204303_Main_Rotor_Blades_Pack_Wooden_550_p/204303.htm
http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=101065
Look on this page on hoe to bal. blades
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=41692

[itsparks]

I bought mine from Ken at www.rcflightstore.com (http://www.rcflightstore.com) - he is based in the greater Vancouver area and is a great guy, really easy to deal with, good pricing etc, especially if you buy a lot of stuff from him. He keeps spares too, and is very quick to get them in the mail.

But it really depends where you live. Most Mikado dealers also stock plenty of parts. www.espritmodel.com (http://www.espritmodel.com) and www.fxaeromodel.com (http://www.fxaeromodel.com) are another two which come to mind if you are in the States (or they all ship worldwide too anyway).

If you say where you live, it would help in recommending a dealer.

Ant

Hey, can you pm me or email me ? Im buying mine from rcflightstore.com from ken too, ive been pondering the trex 500 and the logo 500. Im calling ken tomorrow to talk to him about prices and parts and availability, im a new flyer, i do have a mini titan that i fly around and stuff. Im looking for a heli that will last me a few years that i ca grow into being a really good flyer with, im sure ill crash and it will cost alot but im sure it will be a good heli, im looking to use a castle esc hacker motor and stock blades 500mm, with a 5s pack.

Pm if you wish :P

Im on vancouver island :P

Jase

[outspokin1]

Need some opinions on motor/esc for general flight,hovering,small slow circuits.
Flight time more important than power.

Thanks

[itsparks]

th3tick,
Thanks for that - I didn't realise that it was still necessary to balance carbon blades, looks like I had better get balancing (especially as I am chasing a minor vibe at the moment)


tnelson,

Finless Bob has a video for just about everything to do with building, setting up, and flying a heli in Finless Bob's Helifreak Tech Room up high on the main page of Helifreak. Here is a link to it:
http://www.helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=60

There is a topic in there called Heli Skills and Setup 101 - http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=41692. This has a video on blade balancing, along with videos on pretty much everything else you will ever want to know. Of course there are logo 500 build vids by Mercuriel in the tech room or at the top of the Mikado page too - essential in my view.

Have a good trawl through the topics in Bob's Tech Room - I watched lots and lots of videos before I built. It is worth looking though the build videos of other helis too, because for example there was a GY611 video in the Trex 600 Build videos which I watched and it helped me set up my gyro.

Ant


Thanks for the link ant, and I really appreciated the phone call last-night, helped me out alot, I tried to call ken again today to see about ordering this beast and no answer, do you know what pinion i need right now to order to use with the 5S pack, ? Does the l500 come with the main gear ?

I'm thinking about ordering the logo with woodie blades, then motor and pinion, then i can start the build. Next week ill order esc gyro and servo's.

Jase

[AusAnt]

No prob Jase,

When I got my 500 3d kit, it only came with the mod .5 main gear. The new kits now come with both a mod .5 and mod .7 main gear, so you can choose either one. Guys on high power setups (ie. 10S) are stripping mod .5, so they are using mod .7 . I have read that the advantage of mod .5 is that there are more teeth connecting at one time, but the teeth are finer, therefore smoother but more risk of stripping. However on 5S, you would be fine on .5.

Pinion size - here is a thread where BruceW created a headspeed calculator. It is really good and really easy to use. http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=55471

I plugged a few things into this calc, and on 5S with a Hacker A40-8L-8 (It looks to me like you would need the 8 turn motor for 5S so you fit within the range of available pinions), and with a mod .5 main gear, you would want a 21 or 22 tooth pinion (mod .5) and govern it down to a HS of about 2000. Mine has a HS of 2040 and the heli is super stable and solid at this HS, but is not too quick.:smokin:

If you went a .7 main gear, with the same specs as above, you would need the 15 tooth mod .7 pinion and do the same with the gov as above.

From what I read, the Jazz is quite happy being governed down to even around 60%, so you could order a pinion on the larger side and govern down for now, leaving more headroom for speeding up later. Mind you on 5S you won't want to spin too high a HS as you will probably get bogging (all well beyond my experience, just what I read) ;)

Hope this helps,
Ant

[itsparks]

No prob Jase,

When I got my 500 3d kit, it only came with the mod .5 main gear. The new kits now come with both a mod .5 and mod .7 main gear, so you can choose either one. Guys on high power setups (ie. 10S) are stripping mod .5, so they are using mod .7 . I have read that the advantage of mod .5 is that there are more teeth connecting at one time, but the teeth are finer, therefore smoother but more risk of stripping. However on 5S, you would be fine on .5.

Pinion size - here is a thread where BruceW created a headspeed calculator. It is really good and really easy to use. http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=55471

I plugged a few things into this calc, and on 5S with a Hacker A40-8L-8 (It looks to me like you would need the 8 turn motor for 5S so you fit within the range of available pinions), and with a mod .5 main gear, you would want a 21 or 22 tooth pinion (mod .5) and govern it down to a HS of about 2000. Mine has a HS of 2040 and the heli is super stable and solid at this HS, but is not too quick.:smokin:

If you went a .7 main gear, with the same specs as above, you would need the 15 tooth mod .7 pinion and do the same with the gov as above.

From what I read, the Jazz is quite happy being governed down to even around 60%, so you could order a pinion on the larger side and govern down for now, leaving more headroom for speeding up later. Mind you on 5S you won't want to spin too high a HS as you will probably get bogging (all well beyond my experience, just what I read) ;)

Hope this helps,
Ant


Thanks anthony, i think ill stick with the .5 for now im no where close to any thing 3d other than MAYBE if brave a flip, hovering and moving around is where im at, so that should be fine, ken emailed me tonight im ordering the logo 500 tomorrow, he has one aside for me, it does come with the alumium motor mount, im ordering the servos he has for me the Spektrum ones, then a set of woodie blades for now.

Then ill order my jazz esc, then motor, then charger batts and gyro :P

It will come together nicly.

Jase