HEEEELLLLLLLPPPPPPP, Please

[rockjock3]

I am new to helis (about 2 hours of total stick time outside sim). I am doing good with my "new to me" T-Rex 450 SE "mostly" V2. I watched all the finless vids and just got done with a complete total setup on the bird, from centering all the servos through CCPM settings, swash mixes, Throttle end points etc.

I have come up with a couple of concerns, but don't know enough to know if they are concerns or not. Please anybody that loves to try and wrap there head around a problem please chime in. I have included all the information I can think of below along with the issues that conern me;

concerns
Pitch +11/-10, Ail Cyclic +7/-6, Ele Cyclic +6/-4
I would like these +/-10, +/-6, +/-6, but can't get them any closer than what they are. I can shift the range up and down, but no closer to a central number.

another concern
When I set up my throttle endpoints on my CC35 I get a Travel adjust of +75%/-65%. Now these numbers are obtained straight from the method in the Finless vid for the HV85. I put the stick at full throttle with the travel adjust at +50% and at 72% the esc triggered so I moved it a few more to 75% and the same for the low throttle setting.

I have attached pics of my swash from both angles (in case something is out of wack that I can't see and also the DX7 settings. Thanks in advance for any help anybody can offer.

P.S. The heli doesn't fly crazy, I would just feel better if I could line the stuff up closer.

[Skarn]

I'm not familair with a CC35 but why do you need to adjust the travel adjust of your throttle channel? I haven't seen a Finless vid where he recommends this, but I only have all the stock SE v2 stuff so maybe I missed it because I didn't need it.

I guess I just don't understand why you would have to mess with your throttle travel adjust at all....I leave mine at 100% and never had an issue.

By the way, your swash looks fine from your pics. And your pitch is so close in both directions, I personally wouldn't worry to much about it. Heck I can hardly tell much differnce using my Align pitch guage anyway....

Sorry I couldn't be of any help,
Skarn

[HELINHAWAII]

Wassup man,

I've got some really usefull 450 tools that will probaly help you out. Next time I see you I'll hook you up and we can tweek your bird.

Your pitch travel should be symetrical for cyclic. I've never heard of it being otherwise. As for your collective pitch, you may not have the swash centered in the travel. Your swash should be sitting 10.5mm above the upper bearing block when centered (mid stick). If it's not, you'll see more pitch one way than the other. I guess maybe the same could be said for the cyclic...but I'm not sure.

[rockjock3]

I will try to explain my understanding of why you adjust the throttle travel for the CC35 (don't know if it is required for all ESCs).

The purpose is to teach the ESC where your throttle endpoints are for your radio. My ESC sees high throttle at 75% for my radio and low throttle at 65%. This really doesn't matter as much as in other cases where (Finless' video for example) the ESC doesn't see a throttle position until well above/below 100%. His low throttle was around 110% I believe. If you have a situation like that and you leave the settings at 100% then your ESC will never see either low throttle or high throttle (depending upon the direction) and you will lose additional power or not be able to fully spool your engine down.

Now, for my situation. My ESC was seeing full throttle with my stick in the 75% area and 65% area. Meaning that my curves and my actual throttle position (as the ESC sees it) weren't lining up. So, even though I would give 100% throttle I would only be getting approx 93% power since at that point in my throttle curve is set to 90%.

Radio throttle position/ESC relation pre adjustment for my radio.

0--------50--------80--------90---------100 Normal Throttle curve on DX7
------0------------------------------100 Throttle as the ESC sees it.

Radio throttle position/ESC relation post-adjustment for my radio.

0--------50--------80--------90--------100 Normal Throttle curve on DX7
0------------------------------------------100 Throttle as the ESC sees it.


I am probably way off on this, but this is how I understand it to work.

[HELINHAWAII]

Are you sure you're not inadvertently running the CC35 in GOV mode?

Also, your radio may be off. You can reset your actual stick travel and center points up in the service menu. It's complicated but can be done easily with the know how. I'll have to show you rather than explain it. It's easier.

[rockjock3]

Are you sure you're not inadvertently running the CC35 in GOV mode?

Also, your radio may be off. You can reset your actual stick travel and center points up in the service menu. It's complicated but can be done easily with the know how. I'll have to show you rather than explain it. It's easier.

Nope, radio is was on during setup and stick travel for throttle has been setup as per finless video. That's why my throttle is at H75%/L65%.

I'll check the measurement on the swash at center stick as well because that really makes sense. It might be just a hair high (as would be indicated by lower - values versus my + values.

Went back through all my settings for the CC35 and running in fixed throttle, not GOV mode.

Hey Jesse, I also did that LED/move hook mod to my radio (with the blue led). I could use that thing as flashlight now.

[HELINHAWAII]

Nope, radio is was on during setup

I'm sure your radio was "ON" during setup...what I meant was that your throttle/collective stick could be off in it's throw as the radio itself knows it. Something could be off in the software of your radio that you can fix via the service menu. For example, if you wanted to, you can go in and set your stick movement so that at 75% of stick travel will equal 100% as seen by the software of your radio. It's a pretty far flung possibility though...but something I can check out for you.

I've never heard of a CC being lower than 100%. Usually you have to adjust above 100% to get the full throttle tone and vice versa for low stick.

[rockjock3]

I'm sure your radio was "ON" during setup...what I meant was that your throttle/collective stick could be off in it's throw as the radio itself knows it. Something could be off in the software of your radio that you can fix via the service menu. For example, if you wanted to, you can go in and set your stick movement so that at 75% of stick travel will equal 100% as seen by the software of your radio. It's a pretty far flung possibility though...but something I can check out for you.

I've never heard of a CC being lower than 100%. Usually you have to adjust above 100% to get the full throttle tone and vice versa for low stick.

Ahhhhh, now I understand. Cool beans on that ont.

As far as the Throttle, Finless set the CC85 (actually castle HV85 I believe) to H93%/L110% in his setup video. I just wondered why mine was so far down. I mean, as long as the ESC sees what I want it to see from the throttle I guess it really doesn't matter though.

[HELINHAWAII]

I mean, as long as the ESC sees what I want it to see from the throttle I guess it really doesn't matter though.

No you're right...but it's still weird though!

[rockjock3]

No you're right...but it's still weird though!

I also just had a thought by running this thread. I honestly can't remember if I had my throttle setup with the ESC before I started my setup or after I I did my setup. If I did it after then since my travel is different in both directions that would also put me off a hair. That is what i get of course by setting up my heli while in an new-baby-induced lack of sleep state. :YeaBaby:

By the way. I am doing all this setup as part of my learning process, I have not crashed the heli since we flew last weekend.

[rockjock3]

Well, I'm gonna take helinhawaii up on his tuning/training session next time we are out (would have anyway), but I did make some changes.

I went back and ended up raising my swash 1mm. I also had to adjust my 1 arm on the washout block by one turn. After all that I adjusted 0 pitch at center sticks and went about making all my adjustments again. Here is what I came up with. Anything I don't list below is the same as the settings in my first post of this thread.

I changed pitch travel adjust to H100%/L123% and my swashes to Aile/Elev/Pitch 50%/-50%/50%.

I now have pitch +/-10, Aile +5.5/-6, and Elev +/-6.

So, I the adjustment I made in the head made a difference, bacause now Elev is right, and Aile is close enough. I shouldn't have to adjust my pitch travel though just to get that one right, but hey, for now it is throwing properly in both directions. I just need a hands on tutuorial showing me exactly how to line things up, because on some parts there are screws to line up, but on others there are no flat surfaces that run parallel with the ground or screws to line up (angled sides). So I am sure something is a little off, but all is doing what it should right now. Even if I take the adjustment out of the Pitch travel I still get +10/-9, so it is still close, but if I can straighten the head out right and remove that then I'll be happier.

So, thanks to all for the help, but of course, if you have anymore insight please let me know.

And just to note. The main shaft, flybar, and feathering shaft are all straight.

Thanks again.

[rockjock3]

First, could somebody tell me if my understanding of the way the travel adjustment works in post #3 is correct or not?

Second, I have seen a thread on here that has two or three pics up with a picture of the swash and superimposed lines over it for the exact way to line up the swash. If anybody knows that thread could you get me the link please? I think that would help tremendously.

[Skarn]

Hey bro,

Glad you got things fine tuned better. Again though I have to ask...why are you changing the travel adjustment for pitch???

Again on my TREX 450 SE, all my travel adjusts are at 100% like the Finless video's had me set it to and it's great.

As far as lining up the swash and stuff. I wouldn't make too much out of it on this heli, as long as your servo arms are set properly at 90 deg and the linkages are correct, you can eyeball the swash to get it level. Some people prefer to use a more precise swash leveling tool, but the eyeball method has worked perfect for me so far...I don't use any trim at all (subtrim to get the arms at 90 yes).

Good luck man...I'm looking foward to reading your "first hover" post!

Skarn

[rockjock3]

Hey bro,

Glad you got things fine tuned better. Again though I have to ask...why are you changing the travel adjustment for pitch???

Again on my TREX 450 SE, all my travel adjusts are at 100% like the Finless video's had me set it to and it's great.

As far as lining up the swash and stuff. I wouldn't make too much out of it on this heli, as long as your servo arms are set properly at 90 deg and the linkages are correct, you can eyeball the swash to get it level. Some people prefer to use a more precise swash leveling tool, but the eyeball method has worked perfect for me so far...I don't use any trim at all (subtrim to get the arms at 90 yes).

Good luck man...I'm looking foward to reading your "first hover" post!

Skarn

I had to adjust the travel on the pitch to get the pitch at the point that I wanted it. I have since found one control linkage that I needed to adjust one more turn to totally level the washout block. I didn't see it when looking at the heli, but did when looking at the picture. Now all my travels are right at 100% (except the throttle) and all my pitches are within +/1 .2 degrees.