Whats This Guy Done Wrong?

[ChuckTSeeker]

Hi all, well i'm progressing along at my speed and am now quiet comfortable gliding around the floor on my training gear, so am also ready for the next step, the hover :YeaBaby:

i have done lots of reading and looking at vids and one thing that seems to happen a lot to noobs is the heli comes off the ground then takes off sideways into a wall or other obstacle :shock: my question is "Why?"

what have these noob pilots done wrong? what should he of done control wise?

there are plenty of videos to watch but i have chosen this one as it's a good example, (sorry to puma1824 :P) so can some of the experienced pilots give us some answers and tips on how not to have this happen

cheers chuck


(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8xWXLQ-KHA)http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8xWXLQ-KHA
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8xWXLQ-KHA)

[jayrat]

Try Radd's School of Rotary Flight.

[LockMD]

Most comon 2 things:

1) swash is not truely level

2) new pilot just too anxious and overcorrects

[ChuckTSeeker]

Try Radd's School of Rotary Flight.

thats what i'm already using to learn to fly myself, i asked "what are these noobs doing wrong" so i and other learners might not make the same mistakes ;)

if only the wind would stop blowing i reckon i would of been in the air by now, but as i've said before i have plenty of time to learn :thumbup:

cheers chuck

[DIRTBIKERICK]

I Second Radds school of rotory flight, Read and do just as suggested, Certainly helped me out and got me into hover, (Still am). Also add some expo in your duel rate/expo menu in your tx, this will make it less sensitive and not so touchy. Over correcting and mixed inputs cost me 6-7 mainshafts and as many flybars/spindles, lost count on blades, Its a learning process, keep trying and as radd says, You get there faster by going slow. :thumbup:

[sparx-]

The reason is the TAIL ROTOR!

The Tail Rotor will push the heli when you lift off. A new flyer will not expect this and either

a) not account for it by inputing right aileron.

b) get excited when it happens and over corrects.


This is why it is NOT a good idea for new flyers to try and hover in confined spaces. BIG PARKING LOTS :). Leave the training gear on and get to a nice paved parking lot so the heli can "slide" on the training balls.

It is hard enough preparing yourself for hovering a heli, but to add in "obstacle" ( walls, couches, chairs, boxes, trees, houses ) just makes it even harder.

SPaRX

[sokal]

also after you discover it you can make your swash half a turn low on the right side to precompensate.
NOT RECOMMENDED FOR NEW FLYERS

[LockMD]

also after you discover it you can make your swash half a turn low on the right side to precompensate.
NOT RECOMMENDED FOR NEW FLYERS


Well you dont have to yell!

I would not recommend that at all. So to compensate for a one time 2 sec left pull to get a more perfect lift now you have to deal with too much right for your entire flight.

[sokal]

Well you dont have to yell!

I would not recommend that at all. So to compensate for a one time 2 sec left pull to get a more perfect lift now you have to deal with too much right for your entire flight.
acually not if you notice your trimm will be trimmed to the right this is like a mecanical trim or sub of the sub trim

Full scale helicopter do this same thing to help keep the controls at a nutral CG

[sparx-]

that is all fine and dandy as long as you keep your skids down :). But if you are inverted, that correction will make it worse on the inverted side

I do not trim my helis at all. All my trims are neutral. I level my swash with a swash leveler and check it through it's range of motion and go fly. I do not trim for a stable hover.

SPaRx

[sokal]

weather you inverted or not the effect is still thier is a helicopter phenominom.
i to set my swash to level and i do trim it out afterwards so it to the point i cal almost let go of the cyclic and it will hover in one spot but thats my technique

[skigolfmike]

I level the swash with the swash tool, then I trim for stable hover as needed. Basically I trim for no pitch or roll in hover. I have to give a touch of right aileron at liftoff, but that's OK once it's up the stick is pretty much neutral and I make little nudges for corrections.

I also think getting the CG right is a pretty big deal in how it flies. If the CG isn't right and you trim for stable hover, other trim issues will show up in flight and inverted hover.

[LockMD]

I guess we all have our preferences, but I'll agree with Sparx on this one I have all of my trims neutral and sub trims 0 and my swash is level - pretty stable in hover and FF

[Ti RX-8]

I guess we all have our preferences, but I'll agree with Sparx on this one I have all of my trims neutral and sub trims 0 and my swash is level - pretty stable in hover and FF

Agreed. If you're inverted, the "pre-compensation" will be backwards, and your stick compensation will be double what it would have been with an un-trimmed swash.

Real helis can have this pre-compensation since they don't fly upside down... ever.
You won't find a real heli with a rotor that will go to negative pitch. Even the handful of acro helis only go down to 0-degrees pitch.

[jayrat]

How do you end up with 0 sub-trim?

[sokal]

http://www.helifreak.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=44794&stc=1&d=1207804432

[supra6]

Try not standing as close as the vido shows, get a bit back and get the big picture, after a bit you'll learn what level flight loos like and when you notice your not in the position, picture, it will be easier to get back to the comfort zone.
When you get above ground effect and about chest height look for a point or reffrence line that the main roto is level with and I find it easier to maintain the height with ref to that point or line. I try not to get tunnel vision on just the heli or roto blades, keep aware of what's around you these things are dangerous

[Ti RX-8]

http://www.helifreak.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=44794&stc=1&d=1207804432

Yeah, I read the article. Doesn't go negative pitch. He can do flips and rolls, but can't stay inverted.

[carlo_the_wonder_frog]

yeah, dont trim the heli out to stay level, just manually lean it a bit to the right. The reason it moves left is beacuse of the tail rotor pushing it left as it compensates for the torque.

Also alot of reasons people initially pound ground is because the helis are not trimmed out and this isn't really noticeable until its off the terra firma.

[Mike_117]

How do you end up with 0 sub-trim?

Mechanical setup..

[sokal]

yes due to wieght an actual helicopter cant hover inverted.
also most helicopters dont have symetrical blades thier just about resemble flat bottom blades. they produce more lift.
this

[jayrat]

By mechanical setup do you mean finding a servohorn that is 90 from the start? My ds285's came with only one option, and all servos required some sub-trim to attain 90.

[LockMD]

By mechanical setup do you mean finding a servohorn that is 90 from the start? My ds285's came with only one option, and all servos required some sub-trim to attain 90.


yeah mine aren't exactly 90, but you can cheat with adjusting the links to comensate instead of the radio.

[sparx-]

yeah mine aren't exactly 90, but you can cheat with adjusting the links to comensate instead of the radio.


Actually this is not the right way to do it bud. You should find an arm that gives you as close as possible to 90 degrees and then fine turn it with sub-trim. The arms move in an arc, if you do not have them all at 90 degrees at center stick, your swash will not move up and down level because all of the arms are not moving in unision.

SPaRX

[Mike_117]

yeah mine aren't exactly 90, but you can cheat with adjusting the links to comensate instead of the radio.

the links will have adverse effects on cyclic if they are different.. extra strain on the ball links during flight may cause them to pop off. not much of a big deal just to maintain a hover, though


man i wish i was flyin.. - kansas weather. figures it might snow tonight! 30-60mph winds had 4 packs ready to fly if the winds were close to 20mph. although it never let up.. just got dark. no night blades.. :(