HELP?!? Belt CP setup with Spektrum DX6i and new servos

[rnbiker]

I have a Belt CP that I just upgraded to the EK2-0704A HH gyro, Spektrum DSP75 servos and a Spektrum 6100e receiver to work with my Spektrum DX6i radio. My problem is, in short, I don't know where to begin to set up for these changes. First of all, the new servos work OPPOSITE of the originals (meaning the "throw" of the servos is backwards). I know the Belt CP is an odd one in this regard anyway as I noticed the stock "reverse" switch positions on the radio were different than others I have seen. I created a new model on channel 2 of my Spektrum radio, did the binding and set for 120 degree CCPM swash (using three servos). The problem is, that I can't seem to get the right configuration to make all of the servos move in the proper directions with each movement and with correct pitch on acceleration. I have tried reversing various servos in the radio and tried setting the CCPM values to negative, etc. Now, I can't even figure out where to begin to get this set-up right. I even considered the "direct to swash" mod to see if it would be easier to set-up, but I would like to get it working right BEFORE I do anything else to it. It seems that something is always a bit "off" with each tweak (that is, my stick movements don't result in the movement of the servos as described in "how CCPM work" (that's how it is written....Chinese manual writers??!) in the Belt CP manual. Has anyone done this setup or can anyone help with this setup to get me flying again? I am a newbie and this is the most frustrating thing I have attempted so far. I can add that I know the new servos work the OPPOSITE of the stock Esky servos, if this helps. Someone....anyone.....please help me figure this out!! I've been working on this problem, on and off, for four days now. Please Helifreaks.......HELP THE NEWBIE!!!! I beg you!!! :noteworthy

[Grant_beltcp]

Hi, I have just set-up a similar set-up for my EXI, and used the dx6i on my belt cp aswell.
You will most likely be having problems because as standard they are all set to +60% i beleive. Its very difficult to explain, and i really couldnt figure it out untill i watched finless's ccpm part 1 and 2 and it told me EXACTLY what to do. in part 1 it takes you through which servo plugs in which port, and how to reverse them and how to reverser the mixing directions. VERY VERY helpfull.
As i said, i couldnt work it out untill i watched these, and now i understand how it all works, but its too hard to explain in words.
Sorry i cant tell you more, but the videos tell you everything

[flexbs]

try this
go to the (reverse) menu

Thro-N
Elev-R
aile- N
Ptic -R

diconnect the motor. Give some throttle and all three servos should go up.
turn left and your pit servo should go up and Ail servo goes down - elev servo should not move
turn righ and you Ail should go up and pit servo goes down - elev servo should not move
push up the elev sitck and your elev servo should move down and ail and pit servo move up
push down the elev stick and your elev servo should move up and ail and pit servo move down

if not play with the rerverse settings until it does the above.

[rnbiker]

Flexbs......thanks a TON!!!!! This is exactly the kind of guidance I was looking for! One question.... Do I return all the swash values back to all positive values first, as they were to begin with before my "mucking around"? I am going to try this tomorrow after work. Thanks again!

[flexbs]

Yes put the swash mix back to default. The munaul has default at +60 on all three AILE, ALEV, PITCH.

Also you want your swash type set to:CCPM 120

[helihathnofury]

Where exavtly are these DX6i setup videos please?

[merlin703]

Where exavtly are these DX6i setup videos please?
Video of the futaba 9z is here. I believe the set up is pretty much the same:

http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=11373&page=157

[helihathnofury]

Magic Merlin, thanks!!!!!!!

[Ian 777]

Hi biker :)

I just set up my dx6i a week ago Finless vid was invaluable.
*Disconect the Esc.
*Use the Servo reversers to make the servo's work together.
*Depending on your set up It may not be possible to get all the functions working in the
right direction with just the reversers. Don't Worry
*If all three move in the same direction when you move the throttle stick up and down
your OK
*Use the swash mix to make sure each function works the right way (If aileron swash mix
is +60% and the function works the wrong way then set the Swash mix to -60% Etc)

THEN
Set your servo arms to 90 Degrees.
Level the swash with the linkages.
Set the pitch -10 to +10 degrees with a 0,25,50,75,100 (0 degrees at 50)pitch curve
again with the linkages
Use rate settings and swash mix to fine tune the control throws (make sure nothing binds and the servo's arn't overdriven with full combined stick input)

Set your throttle curve 0,25,50,75,100 and pitch 40,45,50,75,100 for normal

idle up throttle 100,90,80,90,100 and pitch 0,25,50,75,100 or similar

Think this should get you close:) watch the vids though they are really good

Ian

[rnbiker]

Thanks to everyone!!!! You guys ROCK!!! I watched the videos today (downloaded to my phone and watched them on breaks at work!!) and they are AWESOME!!! I already have all of the servos working in the correct directions (pitch included!) and I'm about ready to set my servo arms at 90 degrees. Man, is this WAAAYYY off right now!!! No wonder I haven't been able to fly this thing! The setup from the factory is COMPLETE garbage and not even close. I can't wait to get this setup completed with all of the upgrades on this thing...it should fly pretty well I'm thinking. Thanks so very much for the info. BTW...Flexbs....your recommendations on initial reverse setttings were DEAD ON accurate. They worked great the first time. I had to reverse the tail servo as well, but it's looking good so far. And Ian 777..... I am going to follow your recommendations for settings for my initial runup...thanks for breaking-down the video content in a condensed and easy to follow format. I'll let everyone know how it goes and I'm going to "give back to the community" by posting what I did to solve this problem in case there are other newbs scratching their heads on this one. You guys are awesome and Helifreak RULES!!!!

[flexbs]

I am glad i was able to help. Now enjoy your DX6i and Belt.

[teprcp]

Don't forget to setup your gyro too. I'm not familiar with the DX radios, but you'll want to make sure you are setting up the tail with 0% gain (rate mode) on the gyro. Then I put the gain to about 83% on my JR9303 for Head Holding. However, I had to trim for the HH mode as when I switch between rate and the HH mode the tail would drift. Forunately, the 9303 lets you have multiple tail trims tied to the switch that controls the gyro.

I also have a Trex 450 SE, with a Logictech gyro and no problems on that beautiful bird once it is trimmed out. But I guess what can you expect for a $38 gyro from E-sky.

Have fun flying.

[Ian 777]

Your really welcome mate:)

The forum is brilliant for getting started I dont know where I'd be without the help and support of these guys:)

If you only have the stock rate Gyro the Revo Mix function allows you to compensate for torque so the tail stays straight when you throttle up and down!

All the best Ian

[helihathnofury]

Excusing ignorance, what is revo-mix?????

Mike

[Ian 777]

Just scroll through the adjust menu till you find it, its after mix 1 and 2. It allows you to alter the tail pitch to compensate for torque changes when you throttle up and down

It's only for rate gyros though, I would not bother with it untill you've got the rest set up though.

I also use mix 1and 2 to combine the swash functions with the throttle to compensate for the rpm drop when you input the swash. Again don't bother with that untill youv'e got the basics working right.

For the price I think this radio has amazing features.

All the best Ian:)

[psilo]

Hi rnbiker,

I just read through your post and have a question, have you upgraded your ESC or put in an external switch mode BEC? If not then do not fly with the new servos etc. The BEC that is built in to the stock ESC is not powerful enough to drive the rx and digital servos. In fact any ESC with a linear mode BEC will not suffice and in general most ESC's recommend installing an external BEC if using more than 2 digital servos.

If you try and run without the external BEC you have a high chance of suffering a brownout. You can get something like the Hobbywings UBEC (3A switched) for less than $10.

Hope you are getting closer to getting it all setup.

Gerd

[psilo]

Just scroll through the adjust menu till you find it, its after mix 1 and 2. It allows you to alter the tail pitch to compensate for torque changes when you throttle up and down

It's only for rate gyros though, I would not bother with it untill you've got the rest set up though.

I also use mix 1and 2 to combine the swash functions with the throttle to compensate for the rpm drop when you input the swash. Again don't bother with that untill youv'e got the basics working right.

For the price I think this radio has amazing features.

All the best Ian:)

Ian, did you use trial and error to setup your mixes or is there another finless vid?

Cheers

Gerd

[Ian 777]

Yes Gerd

trial and error Im affraid, I still have to get proper gear, Iv'e spent my share of our money for this month on the radio and the other mods. I just set the swash and pich by eye (using a protractor to eye through the pitch in relation to the flybar and then used the adjustments to make sure that there were no mechanical binds or servo's being over driven. It flew straight off the board but was a little too sensitive for me so I added 15% expo to the cyclic functions.

I know this sounds crude but I have a good eye, I used to make guitar fret boards by hand and they have to be spot on. I fine tuned the swash by altering the links half a turn till it hovered hands off.

EDIT

Sorry mate didn't read your post properly, yes trial and error Guessed at 20% for the cyclic mixes and +_10%for the revo mix and it works fine

I will get some proper kit next month:)

Ian

[rnbiker]

Update from the stupid nebie!!! I finally got this thing all set up and it looks great.....but I completely TANKED my battery in the process!! Yup, dropped it to just under 7 volts during my setup process and killed it! I bought a new one yesterday, but I still have to solder some Deans connectors to it so I can test fly my heli. I didn't even think about it....just kept it plugged in and kept adjusting. I was thinking about purchasing a seperate battery for doing this in the future. Does anyone have any ideas about the rating for the battery I should use? Finless mentions doing this in his videos (I should have done the same!), but I wasn't sure what voltage/current of battery he was using to drive the reciever and servos for his setup. Does anyone know what I should use? As for the results of my setup process, I'll let you know later..... Man, being a newbie in this hobby sure costs a bit with my serious of blunders! What a NEWB!!!!

[rnbiker]

Psilo....in all of my excitement, I posted before I read! Duh!! Yes, I AM running the STOCK ESC! My LHS told me it would work fine. He never mentioned these issues at all. Man, am I glad I read your post. I have a question though.... I was considering switching out my entire esc in favor of the one that is stock on my Blade 400. Rather that messing with the bec, would it be better just to put a new esc on it? If so, would my stock one on the Blade 400 suffice, or would you recommend something else? I want something that is good, but as inexpensive as I can go and still be considered acceptable. I was considering the one on the Blade 400 since it is already used with this model of receiver and because the "slow spin-up feature" that I like so much on my Blade 400 is "programmed into the esc" according to the manual. First day out of the box I hit the "stunt mode" switch on my Belt CP from dead stop and stripped the main gear completely. I was hoping to have this same "slow-start" function and some of the other functions that are stock on my Blade 400. All help and recommedations are appreciated. Thanks guys.

[Ian 777]

That's a shame but at least your winning with the setup :)
Keep us posted how you get on mate

The upside of breaking them is that you get arelly good understanding of how your heli works:P

Ian

[rnbiker]

Ian.....brother, you've said a mouthful!! After all of my "mishaps" so far, I really have learned a LOT more about these helis. I am learning so much, that when it comes time to upgrade to a big heli, I'll be able to build the kit from the ground up without any problems. That's one of the things that attracted me to the hobby. I get to tweak and hop-up, then fly to see the fruits of my labor. It has been a frustrating journey and I nearly gave up, but after getting my Blade 400 that was actually set up at the factory, I'm finding that I really can fly these things if they are set up correctly. That's one of the reasons I am working so hard on this Belt CP.... it's my "experimental" heli. It's also the one I will use to advance my flying techniques. I plan to use it for each advancing step while I practice what I am comfortable with on my Blade 400. Of course, by the time I'm finished with the upgrades on my Belt CP, it will likely be the better helicopter in the long run. I like the Belt, but I wish the manual had been written better with regard to proper setup. Hell, it didn't even explain what the switches and controls on the stock radio DO. It just named them and presumed you knew their functions and settings. That's how I ruined my main gear on day one before I even got a chance to attempt a hover! I assumed that the motor would spin up slowly as in my simulators in stunt mode...not the case! Thanks for your help guys. Any recommendations on the type of battery I should use just to power my receiver and servos for future set-ups? Also, any recommendations on a better ESC are also welcomed. Cheers!

[Ian 777]

Yeah man: I only started a couple of months ago and picked the belt out of a mind numbing array after trawling through the internet for a week.
When mine arrived not only is the manual rubbish like you said but one servo was naff, the feathering shaft was bent, the plastic head was so full of biinding I think that had killed the servo and the links were all the wrong length because I think someone in the factory had tried to set it to hover with a naff servo! R.T.F.? Ha Ha.
All this and no Idea what a heli was supposed to do.
With the Excellent help and support of my friends on the forum I have persevered.
I am so pleased I chose the belt. When you get them set up right they are a lovely little machine.
With the mods Ive done it probably flies as well as most Trex 450's and Iv'e still spent a fraction of the price. And that includes my early learning mishaps.
The experience of other learners is also a great encouragment, please keep your progress posted on the 'Progress Report' thread.

I really love flying mine I know you will too:thumbup::thumbup:

Ian

[helihathnofury]

Anyone got any other hints of tips on the set-up of a DX6i?

Mike

[shizack]

Anyone got any other hints of tips on the set-up of a DX6i?

Mike

Only this - expo sucks in general. If you find the heli to be a bit twitchy, instead of expo, dial in some dual rates. Expo only affects sensitivity around center stick - the larger the value, the larger the range of influence - but dual rates will soften the response evenly over the entire stick travel.

I dislike expo, but I've found dual rates to be a very helpful alternative to potential over-correcting. I prefer a consistent feel over the entire throw of the cyclic stick.

Start with about 87% d/r and adjust up or down accordingly. Standard setting (no expo; no d/r) was a little hairy, but with 88% d/r I can do circles, fig-8's and nose-in with minimal butt-clenching.