Thunder Tiger E550 Raptor vs Gaui Hurricane 550

[3D Dave]

Thanks Vinger and Tim.

Can you please tell me what the SUS tailshaft is and why I need it in place of the OEM stock part?

Also, my local heli guru said the 90 degree swash on the Raptors works just fine so I would just use my DX7 set for 90.

I'm very familiar with TT wood blades heating up the motor & ESC on my mini-Titan. I'm ready to upgrade the MT motor to a JGF450TH or JGF500TH for the hot summer here in the suburbs of Chicago.

The E550 kit at my LHS is the one WITHOUT the motor and ESC. That being the case, for a motor (on 6s 3300-4000's) would you buy a Z30A-1100, Z50A-1100 or Neu ????/??/?,

Or, I could have them order the E550 kit that includes the stock motor and ESC.

I was planning to buy the heli from them (they will match internet prices).

Also, I've found Align Pro wood blades the best bang-for-the-buck for my mini-Titan.

What are the best bang-for-the-buck wood and fiberglass 550mm blades for the E550? I see several CF mentioned but I'm looking for less expensive for now.

For batteries, I told myself I'd only buy the highest quality Li-Po's I could but in this case, I think I'll give True RC a try. They are actually local to me and I'd be willing to try their 4000mAh 22.2V 6S1P pack at $105 ea. but I'd have to buy a bigger charger. Otherwise I was leaning towards CellPro (2) 3s 3300mAh connected in series and not buying a new 2s-10s charger.

Once I get all your opinions on these items I'll put together an E550 spec sheet and see what you guys think.

Thanks for your help.

Dave D.

[flighttime]

Vinger & Tim are on the ball..
I have been flying the Stock E550 with TT motor & Controler out of the box. No problems with any of it, just fly..
You don't need any upgrades until you want to start pushing it along, and then all you need is lighter paddles... and if you really want to push it, then go to the metal head block & sus tail hub.
The sus tail hub does away with the grub screws, that can break if you over tighten them, or can also let go if you strike the tail on the ground. I wouldn't bother replacing the original, but thats just me, plenty will say to change it out before you fly. The fact That TT have not changed the way the make the tail suggest that most do not have any issues. Just build it properly and keep the tail out of the dirt :-)
.
It will do everything you want it to do, out of the box...
I use low cost 4000mah brick style Lipos & they slide straight in..

Glass or CF blades have an advantage for flight times and over all flight performance.. Woodies tend to fly ok, but will shorten flight times.

I'd be going nuts by now.... Just get one and get flying !!
I

[Vinger]

The stock 90 deg swash is perfect with the DX 7 as is the standard DX7 servos. As flighttime said, just get it and FLY.

The standard tail shaft works perfectly for my, as well as the standard tail box. No need to change anything. Get any 550mm blades that will suit your budget as the heli is not really that sensitive to blades, the TT wood 550 fly OK for learning and is a little less efficient than godd qaulity GF or CF blades, again you get what you pay for.

[Xipper]

I have found the Mavrikk blades to be a good bargain, I've been flying their wood blades to learn on without any issue. I also have a set of their carbon blades for when I work up the confidence that I won't be replacing them immediately ;)

[rotorhead58d]

where can i buy maverick blades?:fly

[Xipper]

Only place I know of is Heliproz.com, always have had great service from them for parts. They have the wood ones and the G4 carbon, as well as the newer G5 versions. Also keep in mind that white blades are easier to see, if you are concerned about that.

[3D Dave]

Thanks Vinger, Tim, flighttime.

Here is my preliminary spec sheet:


- TT E550 Raptor (K10 kit)
- Z-Power z30-1100 or Tonic-X brushless ???
- CC Phoenix 80 ESC
- CC BEC 10A switching regulator
- Futaba 9257 tail servo
- Futaba GY401 gyro
- (3) ---- JR digital servos or (Spectrum xxxx) for 90 degree swash (I need advice here)
- TT OEM??? E550 tail blades (are these included in the kit?)
- Spectrum AR7000 RX

How does that look???

Dave D.

[flighttime]

List looks ok Dave..
I know nothing about JR servo's so can't recommend a model for you, however, I would not think the 9257 Futaba will be any good on the tail & sugest you look at the 9254/401 Combo. The 9257 would be great on the Mini T but has not got much power for the bigger heli. Only a suggestion & I do stand to be corrected if wrong, but I would not use it on a E550. Go for a 9254...
I use Futaba's 3050 Digitals on the Head.. Metal gear, enough torque.. and cheap.. so far so good (80+ Flights)
On 6S the head speed is enough for me to suggest Glass blades over wood.. However, Wood is ok if you plan on keeping the head speed down a little.

[rotorhead58d]

i think i've decided on futaba S9452's for cyclic. metal gears, and fast too. 401/9254 out back. i'm really thinking about mounting the 9254 on the boom. that tail rudder linkage is waaaaay too long.

[flighttime]

Good servo combo, but I'd put the 9254 up front where it belongs.. Keeps it protected & there are no issues with the lond tail linkage as it's supported all the way... and plug straight into the RX.
If I could get my Mini T tail servo up front I would.. It's get's wiped out most crashes

[rotorhead58d]

Good servo combo, but I'd put the 9254 up front where it belongs.. Keeps it protected & there are no issues with the lond tail linkage as it's supported all the way... and plug straight into the RX.
If I could get my Mini T tail servo up front I would.. It's get's wiped out most crashes

the protected servo is a plus. there just seems to be a lot of deflection between the servo and the tail. a thick piece of carbon rod would be more rigid. that was my thinking.

[helicraze]

I didn't find any deflection, make sure your guide rod plastic pieces are glued to the boom.

[rotorhead58d]

With the canopy mounted servo it feels sort of mushy, as if I were using a slower servo, or had less gain set on the gyro. On the boom, there is a more positive snap.

BTW, head speeds are the same and running on governors, servo horn centers are the same also.

Maybe I should have mentioned one point - I am using a Quick UK carbon pushrod on the boom mounted servo.

You've only got to look at the flex in the linkage rod on the canopy setup to understand that it can never be as sharp and positive as a boom mount. It has an offset at the joint, and if you install it correctly, you have to bend it about 10~15 degrees before it gets to the servo. These kinks are major flex points when you are asking the servo to work hard. And if that is not enough, then you have some slop and / or friction in all of the rod guides

With a boom mounted servo with a carbon tube pushrod you have absolutely zero slop or flex between the servo and the tail crank.

If you think about it the tail rotor is rotating at something around 9,000rpm in idle up and when you suddenly put a few degrees of pitch on the blades, the heli will rotate but remembering Mr. Newton, the tail pitch slider will also have an equal force pushing on it. That force is directed straight into the servo linkage and any slop or flexing is putting more workload on the gyro and servo.

My first Raptor was gradually upgraded as I was improving my flying so I really didn't notice the difference. It was only when I built up the second one and flew it back to back that I noticed how much difference there is.

Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my practical experience and my theory as to why it is different. Maybe with a different gyro / servo combination you might see different results. But like I said, I was testing apples against apples with back to back flights and the difference WAS noticeable.

archiebald posted this in another thread. this really makes sense to me. i know there are tons of them mounted in the canopy, but this just makes sense to me.

[3D Dave]

Thanks flighttime,

It looks like I'll be using:

- Tonic-X Z30A/1110 brushless
- CC Phoenix 85HV ESC
- CC 10A BEC
- Futaba s9254 on the tail w/GY401
- Futaba s3050 servos on cyclic

I'm just trying to fugure out if I need to upgrade these from the start:

Aluminum head block. -
Aluminum washout base. -
SUS one-piece tail rotor. -

I was thinking maybe I could fly 50-75 flights before adding them.

Dave

[flighttime]

Aluminum head block. - Not Required until you either break it :-) or start to give it death.
Aluminum washout base. - Wear out the plastic one first.. Takes a while
SUS one-piece tail rotor. - I'd say not required (I've never had any fail R30. R60. R90).. but the next guy will prob say change it?

Will be fine straight out of the box. Just upgrade as and when you want, as things wear out (or get taken out :-)

[helicraze]

Head block is only needed if you plan to run over 2000RPM headspeed, otherwise it may rip off! It has happened.
Plasic washout, I wouldn't worry
As for the SUS tail rotor, I'd just change it, for the sake of $8US just get it, I have never read about so many failures, you can try your luck if you want but why whould you? If you tighten it up too tight it may be ready to break off.
Mine was good for about 10 flights, never had a hard landing, then upon spool up one day about to take off, the tail rotor whizzed past my ear, very close call

[3D Dave]

Thanks flighttime and helicraze!

I think I will keep the E550 just about stock to begin with except for the SUS one-piece tail rotor.

Last questions (I hope ;-) ) TT has a complete metal washout assembly (PV0445) that I was looking at. If I was going to do the "washout base" I might as well get this whole kit (when I need it).

Would you agree?

Then, after my 1st crash with my mini-Titan I had a tip-over due to the stock plastic mixing lever breaking off (probably had a stress fracture I didn't see) and the heli kind of exploded on the gound. Because of this I'm VERY tempted to put the TT PV0442 metal mixing levers on my E550 right away.

Then, there is a MVP Raptor 30 head button w/bearings at heliproz that I like (since it will give me a smooth surface to "hand-brake" the main rotor upon spin down).

http://www.heliproz.com/prodinfo.asp?number=803750

Would you agree with these?



I think after this I just need to decide on main and tail blades and I'm ready to do some ordering :-)

Dave D.

[3D Dave]

helicraze,

I'm not sure what the "standard" range is for E550 headspeed. Can you give me a range?

I'm guessing my "learning" setup will be on the lower end of headspeed but I was thinking about running wood blades (TT brand?) to start and then (after several weeks) trying some CF for the very first time.

Dave D.

[helicraze]

Standard is about 1900 at the most, if you go up a pinion size about 2100RPM which is when you need the metal hub.
I think the metal washout arms are not needed at all, i still use plastic and have crashed many times. However i always break the hoop links.
The top on the metal head is handy to get the rotors to stop faster, but unless you up the RPM probably a waste. My E550 got the E620SE metal head block and that doesn't have the head button.

[Tim Tompkins]

Dave , there is NO Need to upgrade any of this stuff. Wait until you see this kit on your table. You will be amazed by the quality and finish of the plastic parts. Please consider a set of good blades. The drag factor alone will make your batteries hotter. If you are nervous about crash expense just use some of the$ you were about to waste on bling. The blades will make a bigger difference than anything else you have talked about. TimT

[flighttime]

Hi Dave, I'd have to agree with Tim. No need to change anything in the head for now. Put that money into a good set of Blades. Your flight times will be better for it.

[3D Dave]

Thanks helicraze, rotorhead, flighttime, and Tim.

I really only want to upgrade what's necessary (except the black head button w/bearings for $12 and since the mixing arms are only $6 I figured I'd get them).


Here's my final spec sheet for my TT E550 Raptor. Let me know what you think:

- Raptor E550 kit TTR4730-K10
- Tonic-X Z30A/1110 brushless motor
- Castle Phoenix 85HV ESC
- Castle 10A BEC
- Align 4.8v step down regulator (for tail servo)
- Futaba s9254 tail servo/GY401 Gyro combo
- (3) Futaba s3050 servos (cyclic)
- SUS tailshaft (TTRPV0499)
- MVP Raptor 30 head button w/bearings (heliproz #803750)
- TT Metal mixing lever set (PV0442)
- Thunder Tiger 550mm wood or ??? blades

Since you guys are in agreement to get some good blades, please give me a few recommendations for wood, fiberglass, and CF.


If I missed something important, please let me know. Otherwise, I'm ready to pull the trigger :-)



Also,

I just read an old E550 review from RC Heli that said:

"The head had a "slight" wobble below 1700RPM". I assume I'll have no wobble problem running 1750-1900 with the Z30A-110 motor on 6s ???

It also said...

"Some pack configurations won’t fit regardless of the
huge battery tray (For instance, the 6S FlightPower
pack sold for the T-REX 600 is too tall to fit. In the
Raptor E550 this pack is fitted as two 3S packs
wired in series.)"

Can anyone verify if this pack: <http://www.fmadirect.com/detail.htm?item=2229&section=69> will fit in the E550 battery bay?

Thanks guys!

[helicraze]

Not a chance that battery will fit.
Any heli with low headspeed will have a wobble.
I wouldn't bother with wood rotors, never ever ever used them not even as a beginner. I do not know of fibreglass, Funkey make fibreglass/carbon reinforced rotors very cheap. Or TT do carbon 550MM rotors.
Any carbon one will be good, avoid no name brands

[3D Dave]

Ok,

what is the max size battery that will fit?

I thought the E620 and E550 frames were the same size and Vinger put 5300's in his?

How about Size: 41mm thick, 188mm L x 46mm W (5300mAh)?

If not, I guess I'll have to go with 3300mAh packs.


Dave

[flighttime]

Dave,

My 4000 6S packs are 140mmL x 45mmW x 52mmH.

Fit no prob at all.. and there is a few mm to spare on width, height is almost max, and I could run 2 pack together if needed..

Carbon blades have come down in price to be much the same as glass nowdays. I use NHP Razors which fly great & are cheap..ish, nice and smooth at low head speeds too...