tail question

[michael88997]

ok upon waiting for my packs to get here i had a question for yall... with the tail can i install this part and this part only without any mods?

http://www.readyheli.com/H60109_New_Tail_Rotor_Holder_p/h60109.htm

also.. has anybody tried the gaui cnc tail grips?

im worried at 2300 it will lock up and the plastic thrusted tail has alot of slop in it and ive never even used it, its like its to big and wobbles on the bearings

[skigolfmike]

Bolts right on - no mods.

It is almost 1/2" longer bolt hole to bolt hole (12mm) than stock.

I have the Guai CNC grips and I am not that impressed. The brass thrust bearing sits against the flat on the hub, so getting the bolt tension right is the key to getting this to work correctly. Too loose and it can still get cocked on the hub and lock up. To tight and it takes too much force to move it. The window between too loose and too tight is very small. I may try it again some time, but the Trex 600 TR hub and grips is working just fine for now.

I did cut .25" (6mm) off a pair of TR blades so I could get the stock TR diameter. The larger TR changed the TR gain by 10 points.

[clayboy]

i am running 2340 to2440 rpm on stock grips. no problem. think if u r worried u r better of with the trex tail rotor grips

[michael88997]

so that hub fits right onto the tail shaft and you can use the gaui pitch assembly?

[skigolfmike]

Yes - use the Gaui pitch assembly and slider.

[michael88997]

readyheli confirmed that so i guess ill do that... should i get some bigger skids for clearance?

[istandalone]

i'm running that trex 600 hub assy, and i've never once had a tail lock. i am however, using slightly shorter tail blades to make up for the larger disk area, as i was having too many incedences where my tail blades would scrape the ground.

[skigolfmike]

I shortened a pair of tail blades 6mm to get the disk back to the right size. The last 10% of the disk does 90% of the work.

[skigolfmike]

I'm not sure shortening the TR blades was a good idea in retrospect. Even though I balanced the blades, I got a lot of vibration in the tail. I really don't have any clearance problems with the Trex 600 hub and grips and stock TR blades though.

Also, I was going through the tail on my 550 last night and decided to go through the hub and grips. I found there was no lube on the thrust bearing on there, so I suggest taking it apart and lubing the thrust bearings before putting it on the heli.

[michael88997]

yea i dont want to cut blades because i dont have a balancer for it anyway... i do have the metal spacers on that kinda makes the butt stick up a little lol and if theres still not enough clearance i can put some 600 skids on it

[bearwood]

Raptor skids fit without any drilling. They stand 70mm tall (ground to top of skid). I use a raptor tail rotor and the K&B 30 tail blades.

No real problems with clearance - just the fingers don't do what brain is thinking!!;)

[skigolfmike]

Just to follow up, I got a chance to spool the heli up last night to see if I had figured out the problems I was having with the tail. Turns out the cut down blades were not the problem, it did the same thing with the stock TR blades. However, it wasn't as bad with the lightweight TR blades. So I went through the whole tail. Here's what I did and what I found.

I pulled out the boom and I completely disassembled the tail. I inspected the belt, pulleys, boom, TR case, shaft, slider, hub, grips, blades and linkages. The boom is crimped where it goes in the frame, so I decided to take that boom out of play and use a new boom. The belt and the pulleys looked OK, but I decided to put in a new belt anyway.

First I lubed the belt with Tri-Flow. I have a bottle of non-aerosol, so I put some in a paper towel and lubbed the belt. I got the belt in the boom and put the tail back on. One thing I did to take some play out of the tail case was to put a layer of scotch tape around the end of the boom. One I got that on, I slid the boom support, TR pushrod and servo back on the boom, then I put the boom back in the frame.

One thing I learned about putting in the boom in the CFS frame is it is very easy to over-tighten the boom clamps and crimp the boom. You also have to be careful not to leave it too loose because it boom will slip in the clamps. That's not good either. Since the Guai likes to have the belt pretty tight this is how I do it. I slide the boom in and put the belt on the pulley. Then I slide the boom out and check the direction of the TR. If all is good, I snug the clamps until they just start to tighten. If I can't move the boom in the frame, then I loosen a little so I can just move it. Then I slide the boom back as far as I can and I align the TR with the frame. Then I tighten the bolts about a 1/4 turn and check the belt tension. if it needs to be tighter, I work the boom out a little more and re-align. Check the tension again and if it's good, it tighten the tail down. If not, repeat the last step. Be careful how much you tighten the clamps on the CFS kit.

Alright, new boom, new belt, all is seemingly good. Next I put on the tail supports back on the frame. That was when I noticed one of the little screws missing from the Tail supporter pipe that holds the little plastic end on. It was on the back end of the pipe near the clamp on the TR boom. I found a screw that would work and put it back together and tightened the clamp on the tail. I put the TR servo back in place and got it setup up again. Then I slid small tie-wrap ends under the TR linkage control guides to lock them in place.

After going through the whole tail like that I think I know what was causing the problem. It was a combination of the tail boom being crimped too much and the tail boom support pipe missing the screw. The 2 things together were letting the tail move too much and, when the head speed got high enough, set off a harmonic imbalance that made the tail go nuts. It wasn't as bad with the lightweight TR blades because they are soft enough to absorb the some of the vibration aerodynamically.

Lastly, if you do have a CFS kit and you crimp the tail, all is not lost. You can wrap the tail where it's crimped with scotch tape. That will work as long as it's not too bad. I had tape on mine, but it was too thin. I could have used another layer of tape and probably made it work. That and fixing the tail support pipe.

I'll try to take a pic of the boom and post it so you can see what I'm talking about.

[michael88997]

i got the parts from readyheli today and it came with a free readyheli mint lol

[michael88997]

crap... one of the set screws is stripped that holds the gaui tail on... im not sure how i can get this off without messin up the gaui shaft

[skigolfmike]

One of the tail case screws? You can drill the head off and replace it with a socket cap bolt. I don't know why they hae phillips head bolts back there anyway.

[skigolfmike]

As promised. This is still usable in a pinch. Just have to tape the recesses.

[BL]

One of the tail case screws? You can drill the head off and replace it with a socket cap bolt. I don't know why they hae phillips head bolts back there anyway.

I think Michael is referring to the set screw of the hub.

I have the same problem, one of the my set screw was stripped.:roll:

So no choice has to leave it as it until I need to change the tail shaft.

[mysticmead]

sometimes.. and I mean sometimes, you can force a larger size hex wrench into the set screw and the get them out... only try it if the screw is soft enough to "stretch" around the larger wrench. or try using a drill bit to carefully bite into the screw and remove it that way.. use a pen drill if you go that route.. no power drills unless you plan on replacing the shaft

[mjdee14]

I'm not sure what size they are using, but I have found the stnd mm alens do not always fit correctly. I have a mongral allen that fits much tighter than the E flight set i bought and i try to use it whenever possible.

My stock Gaui tail has two set srews on the hub....sometimes you can loosen the good and it allows enoughh slop to get the bad one off. sometimes a flat driver can be wedged in the hole to get a little grip also. I think you can also get an "easyout" that small that you might be able to drill a hole and easyout it out.

Worst case is drill it out....the hub is pretty cheap....

[michael88997]

hey does anybody know if the trex 600 skids are taller than the gaui ones? i was going to get them to help with the tail blade clearance

[mysticmead]

as far as I know.. yes.. I'll have a positive answer in a few days :D

[xodarap1]

The trex 600 skids are taller and much stronger.

[michael88997]

should i use nitro or electric ones? also can i just get these

http://www.readyheli.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=H60126%2D87&CartID=2

and use my gaui skid pipes or do i need to get the regular ones... these orange ones look taller

[xodarap1]

I got one set of the orange ones for $6.99 for the z30 heli and then another set (same style) that were black to put on the z20 heli. They are tougher than the other thinner 600 gear and they work fine with the stock gaui skids.. just have to open up the holes a bit and run larger + longer screws to get a good secure fit.

[mjdee14]

should i use nitro or electric ones? also can i just get these
[/URL]

and use my gaui skid pipes or do i need to get the regular ones... these orange ones look taller

Gaui skid pipes don't work...they are too small.

he fact they say the CG is lower would lead me to believe the shids sit lower than stock, but may be the same width.

I use the stock ones and they can be had for about 10.99 with the pipes.

[URL]http://www.readyheli.com/H60038_Landing_Skid_Set_TREX_600_p/h60038.htm (http://www.readyheli.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=H60126%2D87&CartID=2)