Gaui 200 Tail not steady at ALL! Need help

[mmtecg]

:arggg::mad:Hi, I just got my Gaui about a month ago and so far my experience with it has been very dislpeasing.:arggg: I installed the GY401 and a 3154 tail servo.;) I use the second hole from the base of the servo arm but I've tried a few different holes. I've found that the closer I move to the base of the arm, the higher I can put the gain but I still notice no inprovement in the tail holding proformance.:mad::mad:

Now on to the problem... I am not able to "punch" the pitch without the tail giving up. It blows out about four inches each time making it INPOSSIBLE to flip or roll.:mad::arggg::mad::arggg: I had this same problem with my T-rex and it was the govener.... Thats not the case here beacuse I turned it off. As a side note the S3154 is very warm or even hot after a five minute flight.:arggg::mad: If anyone has had a tail holding problem with there Gaui and solved the problem, please tell me how you fixed it. No matter how it sounds. All around the tail is very "loose". I know, your thinking I should raise the gain but I can't get it higher than 35% without a wag. Please help.:confused::confused::confused::confused::conf used:
Michael

[stoatnchips]

Michael, have a read of some of the older posts and i think you'll find that the 3154 does get a little warm... can't speak from experience though. I am no way near you on skills but have fitted a LTG 2100 and LTS 3100 combo... any punch on the left stick is met with a very precise and firm response from the tail :) Please don't loose your patience with the Gaui... its a great Heli (can't comment on 3D), you probably just have a setup issue... It would be interesting to hear some comments from Hard Core users though...

[t-driver]

interesting,
i have 2 X 401's in other helis, and they work even without setting them up correctly, which i can't say the same for the 2100T i have in my H200......

interference may be the problem, try to relocate things like the gyro and esc.

[J-Heli]

The 3154 does get a little warm after a flight but it shouldn't be much warmer than room temperature. If it gets really warm, that would mean that it's under way too much load, or there's a problem internally with the servo that could cause it to be under more load than it should be. If there's something wrong inside the servo, then that would explain the tail blowing out. Just a thought...

[rotorhead58d]

with a 3S battery, would you need a step down regulator for the tail servo? just wondered.

[choppersuey]

a image of your tail setup would help

from servo to tail.

[Dufniall]

My first post...
Had mine 2 weeks now, same problem whit same gyro and servo.
Couldent get it steady, and the gain was down to 25 before i could even get to a okey hover. But still the tail was slightly going right, nose left.
The pinion was to tight to the gears, that fixed it.
Hope this helps you as well.

Regards, Soeren

[mmtecg]

I'll try that and thanks. I can't get any photos yet guys because I am on a laptop that does not have my files on it. I try to get you some photos as soon as I can. (About Sunday)
Soeren, Is your tail now rock steady? I mean can you do throttle pumps without getting a wag or blowout? I realy hope that what you suggested will fx my problem.
Michael

[Dufniall]

The tail is steady in hover, cant tell you if its steady when dying fancy stuff, i am not there yet. The weather is to bad here now, so have only tried indoors so far, so for agro pumping cant say for sure.
I am still new to this heli, and have been strugling whit the tail from beginning, just tried this today, and seems like its holding it. Off course i cant qurante it will fix your problem, just a seguestion. But you cant loose anything trying i think, but thats only my 2 cents off help.

Regards, Soeren

[t-driver]

with a 3S battery, would you need a step down regulator for the tail servo? just wondered.

no,
i run on 3S, the esc (not stock though) is stepping down the voltage.

[noz]

hi mmtecg
First post here on hf. My tail was showing intermittent wag every couple seconds couldn't get gain over 40. If your tail fin is vibrating that could be the coarse. Am now getting up to 120-130 (spectrum dx7 on). I glued a small steel rod right down the length of the tail fin..
Or just take the tail fin off for one flight.

[Buzzkill]

I'd have to say it's the head speed unless you fly in idle-up. What's your curves at?

I have one with 401 + 3154 and its solid. 3154 will get hot though.

[mmtecg]

Buzzkill! I think your on to something! I AM having problems with my head speed and some bogging. I just ordered some Gaui batteries (Ray Syacy said they were the best he tested) and as soon as I test them I'll report back. Just wondering but has anyone here had bogging problems? Like I said I am on a laptop also meaning I'm not at home but I'll get home tomorrow and try out the batteries. The tracking info says that the packages have already arrived. Thanks for all the great info guys. I'll try everything you said and report back. Thanks guys.
Michael

[mmtecg]

UPDATE: Gaui 200 batteries tested.

I just tested two Gaui batteries and they made things one-hundred percent... ... WORSE!
The gain has now been lowered to roughly 25% and I am still getting a wag. Also, (needless to say) the tail will wipe out at the slightest suggustion of wind or a small input from me! I can't tell you how much I hate this thing. I'm beggening to think that mabye this is all it has to offer. I'll tell you one thing though... I NEVER had these kinds of problems with my Blade CP. I love the Blade, and I hate the Gaui.
Michael

[jimgrant]

UPDATE: Gaui 200 batteries tested.

I just tested two Gaui batteries and they made things one-hundred percent... ... WORSE!
The gain has now been lowered to roughly 25% and I am still getting a wag. Also, (needless to say) the tail will wipe out at the slightest suggustion of wind or a small input from me! I can't tell you how much I hate this thing. I'm beggening to think that mabye this is all it has to offer. I'll tell you one thing though... I NEVER had these kinds of problems with my Blade CP. I love the Blade, and I hate the Gaui.
Michael

Blasphemy... lol. The Gaui is a far superior heli to any of the ones you mention. Do you have any vibration that could be upsetting the gyro?... are the tail boom supports nice and tight and supporting the tail?.. is there any vibration from the tail, caused by the tail rotor spindle off true, or tail blades out of balance? Main rotor bearings slack? I use 2 of Gaui's batteries, and they are ok, no bogging, plenty lift, tail solid as a rock even on a full power climb out. The other batteries I use are Hi Model 860mA 15c , and they are same as Gaui. My gyro gain is set 65% NO wag, even in fast backwards flight. But I'm using a CSM gyro and a JR digital servo on the tail. Keep at it , you will find the problem eventually, and when you do , you will see how brilliant this wee heli really is. Dont give up on it..... Jim

[psindrup]

..., and I hate the Gaui.
Michael

Send it to me, and I will dispose it for free. :tongue

Seriously.
There are so many very happy Gaui owners, so the heli is not bad as such.
There must be a cure for your problems.

Don't you have a local club, where you could get some help?

Good luck in debugging

Peter

[SlowWhite]

Ok I have the Gaui 200 Same 401 same 3154 Servo and have had exactly the same issues you have been having.
I also run the gaui battery packs, but the only thing I hate about them is my thunder power balancer doesn't work with them and I can't find an adapter for it so I can balance charge the pack.

Anyrate on to your problem. I was at the Huntsville event and a guy who was watching me put on the first flights of the heli came over (not sure who he was but a sponsored pilot) and he told me to move the servo slightly towards the frames.
What that does is cause the tail to now have a pitch (like the big heli's normally come stock like or at least my Fury does)

The slider arm won't be 90degrees like you think it should be set up. But if it's at 90degrees then you have 0 pitch on the tail. Anyrate between putting that slight pitch on it and taking the canopy off(I broke it from taking it on and off), It solved almost all my tail issues. My gain is still I think around 40% but I can flip it, roll it, backwards flight, and slow pyro flips with no issues, where before the tail would let go and it would immediately go into an out of control pyro.

And I'm still using the stock Plastic blades.

And running in Idle Up 2 (my fastest head speed) helped a lot in making the heli stable but that only works as long as everything still straight on the heli, if something is bent then that'll cause a vibration and make things worste.
The battery only lasts about 4 minutes where as if I just want to fly around in normal mode practicing hovering meneuvers it was last timed at 14 minutes by a guy in my club that was watching me. (well he was timing me because I was *****ing that I had to charge my battery for 1.5hrs for a 4min flight)

If your heli came with the stock tail control rod (the long one) and there is no brace definetely either get a piece of CF and stiffen it or by the new Linkage from Ready Heli that has a support 1/2 down the tail boom.
That by it self will help tramendiously. There aren't parts available near me, I have a vibration from one of my crash's and just watching that linkage move up and down during flight I know is why I can't raise my gain up any further.

Oh and I have flow this heli a few times in winds up to 20mph. Still doing loops and rolls, but pretty much only tried them going into the wind. Hope this all helps.

[mmtecg]

Don't you have a local club, where you could get some help?




Yeah... but non of them have ever seen a Gaui 200. Heck, theres only about three heli pilots there anyway!

[knucklesdragon]

I also run the gaui battery packs, but the only thing I hate about them is my thunder power balancer doesn't work with them and I can't find an adapter for it so I can balance charge the pack.


This one should work:

http://www.commonsenserc.com/product_info.php?cPath=32_39&products_id=263

Good luck!:thumbup:

[rotorhead58d]

slow, i have an adapter from common sense rc too. i use my 1010c/210v all the time with it.

mmtecg, the littlest thing will throw this heli off big time. bent boom, mainshaft, tail shaft, anything. you really have to be anal with the maintenence on this thing. i take mine apart after every crash.(down to the frames) i don't remove the servos, or electronics.

[Gr4yb3ard]

lot's of posts on the 3154 running hot.

The 401, and it's setup is a door-stop known, and you've set one up before, huh...

Have you made sure the led is lit, and you're really in HH??

Gr4yb3ard

[goldslinger]

I don't know the speed of the tail servo, but if it's slower than the 9257, then You need to adjust the delay on the 401 up a tad for the wag problem assuming it's not something mechanically wrong.

The tail slider has to move VERY freely on helis as You probably know. I would check that.

If the servo's getting hot and there is no binding in the ball and linkage at the servo when traveling full throw, then maybe it's hitting the upstops on the tail slider.

Did You adjust the centering, then adjust the travels (from the 401 pot with the gyro in RATE mode I.E. 35% on a DX-7) so the servo doesn't bind at full travel each way using full rudder on the TX?

going by the T-REX you want a straight shot from the servo ball to the tail lever ball, and You want the ball on the servo as close as possible to the center of the servo hub for maximum resolution. You want the resolution turned up on the gyro to be at LEAST 100% on the 401 for best holding power.

Also. . . You don't want ANY rudder trim, ever with the 401. You WANT a good foam pad ( the one that comes with it); the ones You find in stores are too dense, most of the time.

Keep gyro wiring away from all other wiring as much as possible until it HAS to plug into the RX.

When plugging in to fly, keep heli PERFECTLY stationary until the gyro arms (solid red light), then tuck wires in, etc.

I'm probably stating the obvious.

[goldslinger]

One more thing that helps and alot of people overlook this;

Set Your throttle hold for rate mode (35%) and keep norm in HH (72%), plug in heli in HH mode, wait for the solid red light, then flick the gear switch (or whatever switch you set the gyro sensor to Rate) back and forth 3 x or more fast stopping in HH mode.

The gyro light will blink once immediately after this, then go solid red.

See how it flies; if great, then rebind to keep the setting.

I agree with Gr4y that headspeed being high up on the list for blowout.

Gary

[Gr4yb3ard]

Wow!!

That's a new one to me! Worked well by the way, where is this documented (don't have my 401 instructions with me, but don't remember that.)

G4yb3ard
"...what's he dancin' a jig fer?... ...arr, one 'o them other blasted wizards give 'em a new charm for his iron parrot..."

[goldslinger]

It's in the 401 manual, in so many words, but I learned it in the T-REX forums.

Gary