Dier....I need a favor

[testpilot58d]

Work some overtime this month and pick up one of these and let me know what you think.

http://www.pegasushelisusa.com/store/p/156-G-Smart-18-Heli-W-Engine.html

[DierWolf]

Thats the G-Smart from Esky, same as E-smart only Gas with alot less metal parts.... (plastic frame)

Very expensive that price if you ask me (for mostly plastic) (guess you'll save on cost of batteries)

.18 engines you can get for under 100 bucks.. Up to you if you wanna fiddle with Nitro

[DierWolf]

heres a video with some closeup shots.....

a6HHmgegnys

[DierWolf]

here you go 25 minutes left

I'm over the nitro thing, Batteries is where its at these days from RC Cars to Boats to Heli's.... people get tired of lugging around glow plugs, flowmeters, 12 volt battery packs/car batteries and smelly fuel.

http://cgi.ebay.com/New-G-smart-Nitro-Pro-RC-Helicopter_W0QQitemZ130221958490QQihZ003QQcategory Z2563QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[testpilot58d]

so what you're REALLY trying to say is.....

lol

OK..so for a 600 size bird (even with as much as batteries are to run the damn things) you would go the electric route?

What are you using to power your e-smart? (I really like that heli BTW) and how much will it run me per battery?

Thanks!

[Ian 777]

I fear our brother Dier is a man of strong convictions, not one to be blown around by every wind of doctrine nor the craftiness of men wherein they lie in wait to deceive :lol:

Thats the old glo motor sorted then!!;);)

[testpilot58d]

Yeah,

But I watched it go at $380 RTF....I'm such a wuss.

[DierWolf]

Well you should have bid on it for 380... the ARF one you showed me was overpriced... for 380 it was a good deal RTF..

Batteries you need 6s batteries (22volts) for the Esmart... if you buy 6S they run between 120 to 170 bucks a pop.... OR!!! you can use 2 3s (the ones you have for your belt) in series, this is the route most people go and is much cheaper.

yes i have done glo engines for years in both planes and rc boats and cars, electric came along and demolished all speed records in boats (124mph in rc boats) nitro has trouble getting to 100mph, electric is the way to go as the torque is always there.

Plus like i said, carrying around a load of crap, instead of just multiple batteries.

[Grant_beltcp]

For me i figured Nitro was the way to go with a 50 size heli (600mm rotor's) for a few reasons.
1) the cost of reasonable battery for a trex 600 - 6s, 4900mA FlightPower is £190 each. You want a good 3-4 packs to get any reasonable flying done.
2) you can only charge 1/maybe 2 batteries before your car battery is dead
3) 1 bad crash and ruin your lipos thats a MASSIVE chunk of money gone, or if you short, or over-discharge one.
4) you get reasonable power at the start, but it quickly dies off unlike nitro. And flight times are MUCH shorter.
5) to get power to match the nitro or beat it, you need to go 8s/10s and cost just shoots up!

This is based on my views of comparison for a trex 600e and trex 600n - I have flown both, and I now own the 600n. I was very dubious after all te trouble with nitro cars, but the heli engines seem sooooooo much more reliable. Start first time every time, perfect. The sound is awesome, the power is awesome, and the smell is awesome. You just cant fly the nitro in some places, so thats all you need to look out for.

[testpilot58d]

Batteries you need 6s batteries (22volts) for the Esmart... if you buy 6S they run between 120 to 170 bucks a pop.... OR!!! you can use 2 3s (the ones you have for your belt) in series, this is the route most people go and is much cheaper.

Dier,

This will be 22v at 2200mAh when in series correct? What sort of flight time does this equate to when paired up against the 4000mAh batteries that are being sold?

I guess my question is 1) How long can the esmart fly on 2200mAh and 2) will the two batteries have to be the same age, roughly same number of cycles, etc etc. I can always cycle them in slow balance mode on my maxpro X6 if that would help make sure all the cells were *ahem* aligned before I flew them.

[DierWolf]

yes best to use batteries thats the same age/has same number of cycles.

in series just as you add the voltage of each 11.1+11.1 = 22.2volts you add the MAH, so if you have 2200 batteries it will equate to 4400 mah total... this is why most people go this route rather than buying expensive 6 cell 4300+ MAH...

Flight time will be about the same 8 to 10 minutes with using 2x2200 mah... again all dependent on the efficiency of your blades and your collective management.

All together its much much much cheaper to go the 2 battery route than the single 6s battery route.

[Grant_beltcp]

Dier - Can I just corrrect you on that?
2 batteries will not give you 22.2v @ 4400mA. In series you will get 22.2v @ 2200mA, in parrallel you will get 11.1v @4400mA. Thats why most 6s packs say 6s2p, usually means 6 cells in series, double up in parrallel.
Same goes for current draw, if your 2000mA pack discharges say 20C, then 2 packs in series will only give you 2000mA with 20C iof that to discharge (so 40A) in parrallel it will give you 80A discharge.
Just thought you might want to know before i blows your batteries.

[mnwizard]

You guys are so far over my head. I just plug 'em in, stand back and watch for smoke.

[DierWolf]

Yes correct sorry was thinking of the other guy that did 4 x 11.1 v (2 packs in parralel x 2 series)

Wiz its easy nothing different than putting alkaline batteries in series or parrallel, one way gives you double the voltage the other double the battery life.

[mnwizard]

Yes correct sorry was thinking of the other guy that did 4 x 11.1 v (2 packs in parralel x 2 series)

Wiz its easy nothing different than putting alkaline batteries in series or parrallel, one way gives you double the voltage the other double the battery life.

Now THAT I can understand :thumbup:

[testpilot58d]

Dier,

Ok...Grant's explanation was what I thought was correct which is why I asked. Most of the T-rex's (they are the same size right?) are using these like 4000 mAh and 5000 batteries, so I wondered how long the 2200 in series would work. Very interested in how much flight time you get out of 2 2200's in series. It will be my deciding factor in whether I'm going to get a 600 class e-heli or not. I just can't justify shelling out $200 per battery, But at the same time, who wants to only fly 3-4 min at a time if using 2 in series.

Please post flight time results once she's in the air. thanks!

[testpilot58d]

BTW...she's looking great in the build photos you posted!

[DierWolf]

2200 mah 11.1v + 2200 mah 11.1v in Series = 2200 mah 22.2volts

flight time for that will be around 5-8 minutes, again all dependent on your blade efficiency and setup.

LockMD in the Esmart forum is using 2x 2400 mah 11.1v batteries and is reporting between 8 and 10 minutes flying time, so just about the same your getting out of your Belt CP right now.

If you want you can even double up on that by using 4x2400 Mah (2 sets in series parralleled) which would give you 22.2volts with 4800 Mah... but there you must be careful that each battery is properly charged / balanced good or could cause a fire (as did happen to LockMD's first Esmart (he says his wife is at fault she unplugged one of the batteries charging before it was completed and didnt tell him) )

[Grant_beltcp]

That seems alot of flight time for those batteries, I thought the E-smart was of similar size/power to the 600e? with the 600XL motor on the trex 600e you get around 4-5 mins with a 4900mA battery. The 600xl motor is around 2000w, and still boarderline powerfull enough for hard 3D.
Although the E-smart does look nice, and seems to have good reviews i cant help but think somewhere along the line the specs arent quite right. And if you can pul the current from only 2200mA batteries, your motor must be tiny!. I mean i get mine hot in a 450, and i doubt you will pull the same or less in the E-smart?
Correct me if i'm wrong, but it sounds abit fishy lol.
Go for a 600n, theyre just awesome!

[DierWolf]

Well for my part.

Nitro : hard to get on island or bring in without a ton of paperwork
Noise : there would go my backyard flying

and like i said before, I did it before and the thought of lugging around all that crap just shoes me away from it :)

Let me review LockMD's battery capacity again and get back to you.

[DierWolf]

Ok,

he switched from 4x2200 mah (4400 mah total) to
2x 3S 4300mah batteries in series. He's getting back to me on his flight times with that setup.

[Grant_beltcp]

Ah ok that makes sense.
I was in between nitro and electric before i got my 600, but in the end looking at the specs the nitro seemed more capable of what i wanted it to do (hopefully some hard 3d). I cant fly in my back yard any more than basic flying so i needed something i can keep going when im out in the feilds, and 2 charges of a 5000mA battery would flatten my car battery and so i would need multiple packs. I guess if you can afford the initial start up of multiple big batteries and you can keep them charging whilst flying non stop then either electric or nitro wouldnt make a huge difference, but in my situeation I deffinatly dont have the cash to buy multiple packs, i dont have charging capabilities for them all, and i love the sound of nitro :thumbup:
And its easy to get hold of here.

[DierWolf]

Sounds good...

killing the car battery is highly unlikely unless you dont start it at all during the charges.

I have accumulated alot of 3s batteries so for me startup cost on batteries is NIL... although i will be buying (just for the hell of it) at least 1 6s battery.

I put in alot of overtime as well so buying even very expensive 140-180 dollar batteries even once per month would be nothing for me.

If nitro was readily available i would pick up a nitro as well for the field, but if i go the gas route i would much much rather a Gasser than a Nitro, longer flight times there as well over the Nitro and you dont have to lug around car batteries and starters.

I was looking at the Preditor, really nice gasser.. but would definately have to save up on that one. (and you know me i'd try to stuff my quickdraw engine into it)

[Grant_beltcp]

I dont start my car when charging as I cant see the car all the time there. And I have just left uni to go full time on mine and my brothers robot education and events company so no pay for about 8 months, and It looks like i may loose the last bit I have left this weekend due to poor ticket sales:oops:
I love the look and sound of the nitro, and its just somethign different to the electrics i've got.

[testpilot58d]

Grant and Dier,
thanks for the replies.