swash question.

[tom dubya]

Ok this might be a stupid question. Is the swash suppose to stay level moving up and down the main shaft? In idle up at 0 stick the swash tilts back about a 1mm, at half stick its level, at full stick it tilts foward 1mm. This dosen't seem right for some reason to me. Am i missing something. I feel like im having a blonde moment.

[Ber60]

Hi Tom
Yes, the swash is supposed to stay level
But if you are flying the stock tx it possible that the swash tilts ,I had the same problem with my stock tx, that is one of the reasons I switched to computer tx you have more adjustment capabillities.
Never the less it should not interfere with your flying because you will compensate the tilt automaticaly

[Ber60]

I found someting interesting (http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.php?p=720695&postcount=70) about swash leveling

[tom dubya]

Thanks ber, and your right i have the stock tx still. Very interesting read though. I just started using a pitch gauge and swash level. Thats how i came across this problem to begin with. Hmm flying seemed easier with the plastic head and just eyeing every thing. But i speak out of ignorance since i have only one half ass flight in with my new head and fancy tools.

[Ber60]

I don't think there is anyting wrong with eyeballing the swash and even Mr Fin say's we trim the whole setup out, I do believe we do need to setup our heli at least one time very correctly, after that it is all up to trimming and enjoying the flight ( or crash)
I don't know if it is worth to upgrade the tx only for this reason, I fly a c-tx with a perfect setup and I still crash :lol:

[another_finn]

That's an interesting post... and it kinda answers a question I had too. My swashplate is currently leaning so far over to the right, it's limiting my aileron to 58 on the swash mix to avoid binding. I wasn't entirely sure if this was something worth worrying about. I started with a totally level swashplate with no CCPM interaction, but that's the way it trimmed out.

I do get hands-free hovering now, so I guess I'll just try to think less and fly more :D

[Ber60]

Is that on the MD500 Mika or is it on the HDX you have the lean?
Anyway, limiting your tx to 58 ????
How far is the lean in mm on the swash ?

[Jonnyheli]

Ok, so it sounds like it is the stock TX but it could also be a damaged servo?

One time. I had a damaged servo. It worked but it went slower than all the others after a crash. When I increased the throttle the swash would move up but one servo was behind. This ment that one side of the swash was moving up slower than the other side but once it reach the max. position it would level out lol.

Funny:hug:

-Jonny

[DierWolf]

CCMP Interaction..

Its not so bad with the stock TX still flyable and all that, really not many people will see the problem as they all level their swash at mid stick, and by the time they get the stick to full throttle the birds climbing pretty high and will have some forward/backwards movement anyways.

With a computer TX you can get rid of CCMP Interaction by setting the Endpoints of each servo so that its level at both the bottom and top of the swash travel...

if your interaction is alot on the orginal TX simply level your swash at someplace like 75% collective, that way your swash is pretty much level from the time you lift off and above.

All in all, like i said the difference isnt all that great and you would only notice it unless your the type of person that lifts off and just flighs straight up and down only.

[DierWolf]

Ok, so it sounds like it is the stock TX but it could also be a damaged servo?

One time. I had a damaged servo. It worked but it went slower than all the others after a crash. When I increased the throttle the swash would move up but one servo was behind. This ment that one side of the swash was moving up slower than the other side but once it reach the max. position it would level out lol.

Funny:hug:

-Jonny

If its alot of difference then its a servo or mismatched servo's (some traveling at different rates than the other).

Also if all your links to the swash arent straight, for instance 2 are straight and the front servo link is at an angle that too will translate into shorter throw on the swash... which is why its imparative your setup is as good as possible.

Another way is if your link balls on the servo horns, they must all be the same type of servo horn and the balls on all 3 must be in the same hole location..... if one is further out than the other it will create farther throw on the swash at that servo.

[another_finn]

Is that on the MD500 Mika or is it on the HDX you have the lean?
Anyway, limiting your tx to 58 ????
How far is the lean in mm on the swash ?
This is on the HDX450. The tilt is just over 2 mm... which looks like a lot - definitely more than I have on the CopterX or T-Rex heads. Still, I started with a totally level swash and eliminated all CCPM interaction. That's just the way she likes to sit in the air. It's not like I need more cyclic than I'm getting, it's just knowing there's more than I can access, you know? ;)

[Ber60]

Still, it keeps me wondering what can cause a 2mm tilt in swash, is it possible that it is tail related ? I ask because my copterx has a lean of about 7 a 8° in hover without any trim necessary and I know that it is tail related, I just find it a ugly hover.

[sutty]

With regard to Tom’s original post, I think there is generally so much correction going on during flying, particularly if it is a little breezy, and because it is common to push forward to move away as you ascend, I don’t think it would be possible to notice. Maybe it would be more obvious if it were the other way round, where the heli had a tendency to back up towards you as you ascended, but even then I think I would just put that down to wind and apply a little more forward without even really thinking about it.

The quote by Finless, referenced by ber60, about getting all anal about your set up on a 450, and it not really being required, is all very well, but I suspect he can eyeball a near perfect set up now because of his experience. I had always had that question in the back of my mind about ‘what is the point of a perfect swash’; it is always trimmed to achieve a stable hover anyway. Every time I have set up level, I have always had to trim a little right in just to make the hover stable.

When I got my new copterx head I didn’t really measure anything. I checked for zero pitch at mid stick by putting some blades across the grips, even though I had a pitch gauge. I bet if you have good rack of th'eye, you could even do it by just looking at the grips. After this a small adjustment for tracking, and a little right trim, and everything seemed great. I subsequently checked my full pitch range with my gauge and tweaked it up a little in the swash mix, as I wanted a little more total range, but really it was fine as it was.

However without practising the whole thing many times, using the painstaking approach, learning as I went, including using finless’s video’s, I would not have got myself to the point where I can get a pretty good set up just from the way it looks.

So it is interesting that he says that, but I would still recommend that if you are new to this hobby you should probably follow the long winded "measure it all" approach anyway, so you will learn how it should all be done and look. Eventually after practice you will just know when it looks wrong, and be able to put it right before you measure it anyway.