When do I jump from the SIM to the real thing?

[sidewayz6.6]

Hey all, just recently bought myself a T-Rex 450. I had a Blade CX in the past, and always dreamed of getting a Rex, and finally have. I also got RealFlight G3.5. I downloaded the T-Rex heli, and have been practicing. I've logged 8 full successful flights, running for 12 minutes or so each flight. When I first started, staying in the air for 10 seconds was very difficult, and there was very little control. Now I can keep it where I want it for the most part, and I know where the heli is going to go, before it goes there. All of these flights have just been hovering, with some very slow, gradual movements in all directions.

My question is this: At what point should I proceed to flying the real thing? From my reading I see that real-life stick time is really important, although the SIM undoubtedly helps. I just don't want to fire it up until I'm sure I'm ready for it.

Thanks, Kyle

[Skarn]

Today! Ensure you have training gear on, and start Radd's School of Rotary Flight. Once you complete Radd's, (10 battery packs), you should be hovering with confidence.

Oh and as soon as you can hover with confidence, remove the training gear!

Good luck!
Skarn

[TheBum]

I agree with Skarn that you should at least attempt hovering with training gear almost immediately. Otherwise, you won't be mentally prepared to try the things you learned from the sim on the real thing. You need to translate as much of the real-life knee-shaking experience into your simulated flying as possible. Remember: There is no reset button in real life.

[jeffk]

...I know where the heli is going to go, before it goes there.

Eventually, you won't even need to do this. You'll be telling the heli where to go, and it will follow. Once you reach that stage, everything will open up for you. Good luck and get out there and fly! :thumbup:

[sidewayz6.6]

OK guys, thanks for the encouraging words. I was going to wait a few more flights on the SIM, but it sounds like I need to get her up in the air. First though, I have to check over the heli from nose to tail though. I bought it used, and need to make sure everything is setup right. This is my first time with a 6 channel heli, so I see it taking a couple days to set it all up and check everything. I plan on watching Finless Bob's videos, but what are some things I need to check on? What screws need Lok-Tited, etc? I have the 450S, but some parts are upgraded, so which manual do I use (it didn't come with one, so I need to download it)? Are there any differences compatability/maintenance-wise between the S/SE/SE V2?

Thanks for all of your encouragement, I'm starting to feel a little more confident as far as taking this bird up in the air.

[sidewayz6.6]

OK guys, I did it. I took her outside (no training gear), and slowly spooler her up. I put in some rudder, and she responded well, bumped it up just a TAD, and she lifted barely.

One thing, I noticed immediately. The heli wants to rotate counter-clockwise. I tried giving her some trim, but she's already got full trim. I can hear the servo trying to move it more, but it seems as though there's some physical binding issue or something, preventing it from going through the full range of motion.

[jeffk]

Try reversing your rudder servo.

[sidewayz6.6]

Try reversing your rudder servo.

How would that work, wouldn't the controls be backward then?

I took it apart, and there was some slight resistance where the brass collar rides on the steel shaft to alter the pitch. I cleaned it and put a drop of light oil, and it seems to be smoother. There's still a lot trim being used though. It has a lot of room to move in the other direction (when I move the rudder stick left), but there isn't nearly as much travel when I move the stick right. It stops moving well before I give it full right stick on the rudder (done with motor unplugged).

Edit: I also noticed a slight wobble. When the heli is getting light on the skids, it wants to hop a little, like a vibration perhaps.

[brunsflyer]

check tail blades
check gyro settings
check belt

important main rotor goes clockwise...tail rotor goes counterclockwise

go to finless 450 setup for 450 and double check

also maybe need to change gyro reversing

goodluck

[ChasHeliCop]

Oh and as soon as you can hover with confidence, remove the training gear!

Skarn

I would say as soon as you can take off and land successfully, without teetering, remove the training gear.

[GreenCello]

Whoa. If you have a decent gyro and you're set up correct you should not need trim and in fact its not recommended.
+1 on Skarn's suggestion on training gear and Radd's school unless you want some real fast lessons in heli rebuilding. Training gear can be as simple as a couple of hardwood dowels, practice golf balls and some zip ties.

[jeffk]

There are two things that control how the tail moves. One is the direction of the rudder channel. If that's ok, check the gyro correction direction (mentioned by brunsflyer). This is the direction the gyro will move the tail to correct for drift. These are independent. If the tail moves as it should with stick input (left rudder stick makes the tail swing towards the right etc), then check your gyro correction.

The easiest way to do this is to (with the heli off) orient the heli on a table facing away from you. Make sure the gyro is in heading hold mode, and manually move the tail to the left. You SHOULD see the tail pitch slider move away from the boom as the gyro attempts to correct the movement. Moving the tail to the right should cause the pitch slider to move towards the boom.

Also, you want to make sure that your tail rotor is spinning on the correct direction. As you look at the tail from the right side of the heli, the rotor should be spinning counter-clockwise. If this is not the case, you have your tail belt twisted the wrong way.

[sidewayz6.6]

Thanks for the advice everyone, especially Jeff.

The stick input on the transmitter moves the tail around as it should, and from what I could see of the tail test, it also appears to be moving the tail pitch slider in the right direction. I guess the solution would be to re-center the servo or something? The only problem is it doesn't seem like there is enough room for the tail pitch slider to slide in towards the boom as far as it needs to.

[jeffk]

Ok, which gyro and which radio are you using? Sounds like we'll need to start out from scratch on the tail setup.

[sidewayz6.6]

Ok, which gyro and which radio are you using? Sounds like we'll need to start out from scratch on the tail setup.

The Gyro is the JR G500t, and the radio is the spektrum DX6.

[jeffk]

I'm going to assume that you're not planning on flying in rate mode, but will leave yoru gyro in heading hold all the time. So with that in mind, try the following:

First, make sure that when the tail servo is centered, the horn you're using is at a 90 degree angle to the servo body.

Per the G500T's instructions, make sure that the hole you're using on the rudder servo horn is no less than 16mm from the center, and no more than 18mm.

Next, readjust the tail linkage so that when the rudder servo is centered and the horn is at 90, the pitch slider is centered on the shaft. At this point, you won't have any pitch on the tail blades. If you don't have enough adjustment in the rod, you'll have to move the servo on the tailboom (which is where I'm assuming it is, though I could be wrong).

Make sure you center your rudder trim, and readjust your gyro's travel limits as necessary per the instructions.

Now try your hover again and see if it's any better.

[schwarztrader]

Remember: There is no reset button in real life.

LOL Oh sure there is, it's located at the bottom of the wallet.

[sidewayz6.6]

I'm going to assume that you're not planning on flying in rate mode, but will leave yoru gyro in heading hold all the time. So with that in mind, try the following:

First, make sure that when the tail servo is centered, the horn you're using is at a 90 degree angle to the servo body.

Per the G500T's instructions, make sure that the hole you're using on the rudder servo horn is no less than 16mm from the center, and no more than 18mm.

Next, readjust the tail linkage so that when the rudder servo is centered and the horn is at 90, the pitch slider is centered on the shaft. At this point, you won't have any pitch on the tail blades. If you don't have enough adjustment in the rod, you'll have to move the servo on the tailboom (which is where I'm assuming it is, though I could be wrong).

Make sure you center your rudder trim, and readjust your gyro's travel limits as necessary per the instructions.

Now try your hover again and see if it's any better.

Thanks Jeff, I really do appreciate it.

I took the heli out today, on pack 2 of Radd's school of flight. I was spooling up and down, not even lifting up off the ground. All of a sudden I heard a POP sound, and both blades went flying!!!:(:(:(

Both blades are still in the holders, it looks like the feathering shaft let loose? It looks like it bent the flybar, and one of the blade tips is nicked

I just don't know what cause this, one second it's spinning up fine, and the next, the blades go flying off???!!!??? Any help, I would appreciate.

Edit:

I did a little investigating. Looks like I'll need a flybar, a main shaft, and the little aluminum collar that comes with the 450SE V2 feathering shaft. Are the flybar's all basically interchangeable? I don't see any difference in them, and I'm trying to find the parts to order. I'm looking at HeliProz.

HS1184T for the flybar, and MVHT1011 for the main shaft are the parts I have selected for my order, how do I know if these are right?

Thanks, Kyle

[Skarn]

Yep you got the right flybar. Both work, but the one you selected is the 220mm flybar....the longer one. The other is a 190mm. The longer will give you more stability and at the same time, be more responsive to cyclic input.

Oh and the reason your blades flew off is because your feathering shaft bolts came loose! That is the number one thing that you should have done when building or getting your heli....locktight your flybar bolts!

Good luck,
Skarn

[jeffk]

Wow, that truly doth suck.

I'm not aware of an aluminum collar that is related to the feathering shaft but they might have changed something since I bought my last pack of SEV2 feathering shafts. HS1251T on the feathering shafts.
HS1184T on the flybar looks right
HS1280 or HS1217 are what I'd go with for mainshafts.

As for the old one coming apart, the most common cause I've seen for that is that one of the blade grip bolts comes loose and ZING! there go your blades. You MUST loctite these and you'll need to clean the bolts and the threads inside the feathering shaft first, to remove all the oil and give the threadlocker something to hold on to.

DOH! Skarn beat me to it! :)

[darkchiild]

I think the aluminum collar he's talking about is the one you use to pre-load the dampers.

[sidewayz6.6]

I think the aluminum collar he's talking about is the one you use to pre-load the dampers.

The collar goes on the feathering shaft, on either side of the rotor head. It sits between the rotor head, and the blade grips.

[sidewayz6.6]

OK, ordered the parts over the weekend. Will repair once I get them in, hope I ordered the right stuff.

[sidewayz6.6]

Well, I got the parts in today. I repaired it, then took it for a spin. I don't know what happened, but it's not the same. Even a small rudder input, will make the whole heli spin around 360 degrees, before there was smooth input, and proportional response. Also, I was up near full throttle, and it wouldn't lift off

I don't know why it's acting so weird, any ideas would be nice. I took my time fixing it, thread locking all the necessary bolts, etc..

[TheBum]

Well, I got the parts in today. I repaired it, then took it for a spin. I don't know what happened, but it's not the same. Even a small rudder input, will make the whole heli spin around 360 degrees, before there was smooth input, and proportional response. Also, I was up near full throttle, and it wouldn't lift off

I don't know why it's acting so weird, any ideas would be nice. I took my time fixing it, thread locking all the necessary bolts, etc..
Check your pitches again and reset your ESC's throttle limits. I think I had both problems with my Diablo; now it screams like a banshee again.