Is the 12MZ better than the 14MZ or a cheaper version?

[DebianDog]

I am guessing, since it is not color... Cheaper!

Saw this from the Nurumberg Toy Show pics

[Phaedrus]

Given that we still have not seen or heard anything official about the US version your question is impossible to answer with anything other than outright speculation. :dontknow

So here goes - :D

This is what we DO know -

It has fewer channels
It has no sliders
It has a B/G screen

So, based on that I assume it is meant to be beneath the 14MZ in the line up. It appears that it is not "better" in the sense that the 14MZ is the top of the line radio, and based on what we do know it will likely be less expensive.

[DavidH]

Here is what the Robbe site states about the 12Z

This new 12-channel computer radio control system brings the outstanding PCM - 2048 G3 technology into the upper class of high-performance equipment.

The new PCM 2048 system offers twelve channels with a resolution of 2048 steps (increments), is around 40% faster than the previous top-level system - PCM 1024 - and represents virtually real-time control. The type of modulation is switchable, and is compatible with PCM 1024 and FM (PPM) 8-channel.

Visually and in terms of ergonomics the transmitter is elegant and beautifully balanced: all the controls are perfectly arranged, and contribute to the overall impression of stylish efficiency.
The large, reflective LCD screen with a resolution of 300 x 128 dots is integrated seamlessly into the high-quality case, and constitutes the essential hub of the system.
The software is operated using the 3-D hotkey in conjunction with a four-way rocker (cross-key), supported by a graphical user interface.

The transmitter is equipped with the FUTABA operating system, which controls and monitors the model functions and RF signal transmission.

Digital stick trims eliminate the need for adjusting the trims or storing trim values when you switch model memories.

A position indicator displays the trim value on the LCD screen in the form of a bar graph.

In its standard form the transmitter is fully expanded, with three analogue rotary controls and eight switches, and requires no additional accessories.

The system also incorporates the WFSS process (Wireless Frequency Setting System): a method of setting the receiver´s spot frequency from the transmitter.
If you wish to change the spot frequency for a particular model, you simply select the appropriate channel using the transmitter´s on-screen DDS Synthesizer system.
The selected spot frequency is then transmitted by radio to the receiver, where it is stored.
The receiver´s unique serial number ensures that only this receiver changes its spot frequency.

The menu system and system programming are based on the same software structure as its "big sister", the T14MZ.
The first step is always to choose a model type and wing type, and these selections automatically configure the appropriate mixer functions and the sequence of control functions. It could hardly be easier.

Internally the transmitter features fifteen model memories, and more can be stored on the Data Pack card (CF card), which is used as an expandable memory medium. Around 132 kB of memory is used for each model memory with eight flight modes, which means that a CF card with a capacity of only 32 MB can already store data for around 240 models.


Specification:
Dimensions: 180x180x60 mm
Weight: 750 g
Frequency band: 40.00
Channel spacing: 10 kHz
Spotfrequencies: 49.22
Current drain: 150/350 mA
Power Supply: 7.2 V
Transmission system: 8 Kanal FM / PCM 1024 / PCM G3 (2048)
Functions: 24/12 Servos
more Specifications:


Kit contents:
1 T12Z FM / PCM-1024 / G3 transmitter, fully expanded to 12 channels with 7.4 V / 2200 mAh Lithium battery.
1 MZ-FM PLL RF module
1 R 5014 DPS DDS dual-conversion PCM receiver
1 230 Volt automatic Li-Poly charger (1.5 A)
1 Switch harness with charge socket
1 Receiver charge lead
1 Servo extension lead, 20 cm
1 32 MB D/P card

http://at.robbe-online.net/rims_at.storefront/43e8ba4e0037bb88271c3e0dc146068c/Product/View/1&2DF8058

On the Robbe website the 12Z ($1860) is $225 less than the 14 MZ ($2084).
So if there is a US version of the 12Z I guess we will have to wait and see where the price falls. This may be only a radio that is made especially for Robbe. As there is no mention of it being available in any of the Japanese shops that I have seen. If it will be available elsewhere it will probably be shown at the Tokyo show in May in Japan.

David

[RCfan]

Cool pics DebianDog, thanks posting them.

[ClayK]

For $200 more bucks, you can have the 14z as it stands now. Hardly seems like much of a savings....

And, the 14z has PCM 2048 on 12 channels, PCM 1024 on the last two. Not sure if that makes a big difference....

[WillJames]

Hell yea Dan,!! Nice pics! Good work, thank you!!

That screen looks like the 9CHP except a lot bigger. They are pretty good screens and easy to read. I know a few 14MZ users who do all the programming withthe buttons and dial like Wayne Ellison and he can do everything fast without using the touch screen on the 14 at all.

[Phaedrus]

For $200 more bucks, you can have the 14z as it stands now. Hardly seems like much of a savings.....

I'm wondering how you derived this information? Since the thing has not even been released in the US and therefore there is NO pricing information I am curious how you can make statements like the above?

[ClayK]

For $200 more bucks, you can have the 14z as it stands now. Hardly seems like much of a savings.....

I'm wondering how you derived this information? Since the thing has not even been released in the US and therefore there is NO pricing information I am curious how you can make statements like the above?

That statement was a response to the following information.

Here is what the Robbe site states about the 12Z

This new 12-channel computer radio control system brings the outstanding PCM - 2048 G3 technology into the upper class of high-performance equipment.

The new PCM 2048 system offers twelve channels with a resolution of 2048 steps (increments), is around 40% faster than the previous top-level system - PCM 1024 - and represents virtually real-time control. The type of modulation is switchable, and is compatible with PCM 1024 and FM (PPM) 8-channel.

Visually and in terms of ergonomics the transmitter is elegant and beautifully balanced: all the controls are perfectly arranged, and contribute to the overall impression of stylish efficiency.
The large, reflective LCD screen with a resolution of 300 x 128 dots is integrated seamlessly into the high-quality case, and constitutes the essential hub of the system.
The software is operated using the 3-D hotkey in conjunction with a four-way rocker (cross-key), supported by a graphical user interface.

The transmitter is equipped with the FUTABA operating system, which controls and monitors the model functions and RF signal transmission.

Digital stick trims eliminate the need for adjusting the trims or storing trim values when you switch model memories.

A position indicator displays the trim value on the LCD screen in the form of a bar graph.

In its standard form the transmitter is fully expanded, with three analogue rotary controls and eight switches, and requires no additional accessories.

The system also incorporates the WFSS process (Wireless Frequency Setting System): a method of setting the receiver´s spot frequency from the transmitter.
If you wish to change the spot frequency for a particular model, you simply select the appropriate channel using the transmitter´s on-screen DDS Synthesizer system.
The selected spot frequency is then transmitted by radio to the receiver, where it is stored.
The receiver´s unique serial number ensures that only this receiver changes its spot frequency.

The menu system and system programming are based on the same software structure as its "big sister", the T14MZ.
The first step is always to choose a model type and wing type, and these selections automatically configure the appropriate mixer functions and the sequence of control functions. It could hardly be easier.

Internally the transmitter features fifteen model memories, and more can be stored on the Data Pack card (CF card), which is used as an expandable memory medium. Around 132 kB of memory is used for each model memory with eight flight modes, which means that a CF card with a capacity of only 32 MB can already store data for around 240 models.


Specification:
Dimensions: 180x180x60 mm
Weight: 750 g
Frequency band: 40.00
Channel spacing: 10 kHz
Spotfrequencies: 49.22
Current drain: 150/350 mA
Power Supply: 7.2 V
Transmission system: 8 Kanal FM / PCM 1024 / PCM G3 (2048)
Functions: 24/12 Servos
more Specifications:


Kit contents:
1 T12Z FM / PCM-1024 / G3 transmitter, fully expanded to 12 channels with 7.4 V / 2200 mAh Lithium battery.
1 MZ-FM PLL RF module
1 R 5014 DPS DDS dual-conversion PCM receiver
1 230 Volt automatic Li-Poly charger (1.5 A)
1 Switch harness with charge socket
1 Receiver charge lead
1 Servo extension lead, 20 cm
1 32 MB D/P card

http://at.robbe-online.net/rims_at.storefront/43e8ba4e0037bb88271c3e0dc146068c/Product/View/1&2DF8058

On the Robbe website the 12Z ($1860) is $225 less than the 14 MZ ($2084).
So if there is a US version of the 12Z I guess we will have to wait and see where the price falls. This may be only a radio that is made especially for Robbe. As there is no mention of it being available in any of the Japanese shops that I have seen. If it will be available elsewhere it will probably be shown at the Tokyo show in May in Japan.

David

That should answer your questions. thx

[DavidH]

IF the 12 Z is released in the USA. I would think the price gap between the 12Z and 14MZ will more than $225. I never would use Robbe or any other country as a price gauge what an item will sell for here in the USA. Discounting is different on all items. I just used the Robbe site to show an example of the 12Z that theyare suppose to have. If you also noticed, I stated that the 12Z could possibly be a Robbe only item. Futaba has made items exclusively for Robbe before that were not available elsewhere.
I only posted the pricing of the 12Z from Robbe because I don't think some knew how to do the conversion from Euros to USD's.

David

[Phaedrus]

IF the 12 Z is released in the USA. I would think the price gap between the 12Z and 14MZ will more than $225. I never would use Robbe or any other country as a price gauge what an item will sell for here in the USA. Discounting is different on all items. I just used the Robbe site to show an example of the 12Z that theyare suppose to have. If you also noticed, I stated that the 12Z could possibly be a Robbe only item. Futaba has made items exclusively for Robbe before that were not available elsewhere.
I only posted the pricing of the 12Z from Robbe because I don't think some knew how to do the conversion from Euros to USD's.

David

Thanks David. You re-made the point that I was making.

A - We don't know if there even WILL be a US version

And

B - If there is, we have no idea what it will cost.

So, statements about it's relative value are not really very reliable.

[ClayK]

IF the 12 Z is released in the USA. I would think the price gap between the 12Z and 14MZ will more than $225. I never would use Robbe or any other country as a price gauge what an item will sell for here in the USA. Discounting is different on all items. I just used the Robbe site to show an example of the 12Z that theyare suppose to have. If you also noticed, I stated that the 12Z could possibly be a Robbe only item. Futaba has made items exclusively for Robbe before that were not available elsewhere.
I only posted the pricing of the 12Z from Robbe because I don't think some knew how to do the conversion from Euros to USD's.

David

Thanks David. You re-made the point that I was making.

A - We don't know if there even WILL be a US version

And

B - If there is, we have no idea what it will cost.

So, statements about it's relative value are not really very reliable.

Perhaps you should read below in the bold. The point I was trying to make (earlier) was that provided the information at hand, considering the conversion rate and market share, I was making an estimation. I've seen your posts on "we dont' know what the price will be, so let's not speculate" (that was paraphrased, so as to avoid any confusion in the future) and it really doesn't float, you estimated as well. Price is relative and on a few items the cost overseas is different, but as a whole, the delta is minute.

For $200 more bucks, you can have the 14z as it stands now.

[ClayK]

IF the 12 Z is released in the USA. I would think the price gap between the 12Z and 14MZ will more than $225. I never would use Robbe or any other country as a price gauge what an item will sell for here in the USA. Discounting is different on all items. I just used the Robbe site to show an example of the 12Z that theyare suppose to have. If you also noticed, I stated that the 12Z could possibly be a Robbe only item. Futaba has made items exclusively for Robbe before that were not available elsewhere.
I only posted the pricing of the 12Z from Robbe because I don't think some knew how to do the conversion from Euros to USD's.

David

Thanks David. You re-made the point that I was making.

A - We don't know if there even WILL be a US version

And

B - If there is, we have no idea what it will cost.

So, statements about it's relative value are not really very reliable.

It doesn't matter if it's available domestically or not, it can still be imported right? Considering it wasn't a statement of fact, but a speculation. No reason to get your feathers in a bind because we are throwing around estimations/conjecture and not stating fact. Even you joined in earlier....

[DavidH]

Yes it can probably be imported into the USA. Don't know how feasible that would be since new modules and receivers would have to be purchased that can be used in the USA. The chargers would all have to replaced with chargers that operate on 110 volts instead of 230 volts. I really don't think pilots here in the US would import a radio from Germany or Europe and then want to spend a few hundred dollars to use it here in the US.
I don't have my feathers in a bind. Just trying to provide good information.
I did join in earlier. Maybe I shouldn't have.

David

[pilotError]

:hug:

Well the 9Z is discontinued, you know somethings coming...

[ClayK]

Yes it can probably be imported into the USA. Don't know how feasible that would be since new modules and receivers would have to be purchased that can be used in the USA. The chargers would all have to replaced with chargers that operate on 110 volts instead of 230 volts. I really don't think pilots here in the US would import a radio from Germany or Europe and then want to spend a few hundred dollars to use it here in the US.
I don't have my feathers in a bind. Just trying to provide good information.
I did join in earlier. Maybe I shouldn't have.

David

Sorry, the feathers comment was directed at Phaedrus' comment when he jumped on my comment not at yours David. You brought good information to the table. Bottom line is that everyone here is speculating on it being available in the US and what the cost will be. The understanding has to be that it's all speculation and not hard factual data.

[DavidH]

Bottom line is that everyone here is speculating on it being available in the US and what the cost will be.

Not everyone. :)


David

[ClayK]

Not everyone



True, true... Of course, I don't really care about the radio, I got my 14mz and I'm happy :cool:

[freddyferris]

Yeah the 12Z is better: it hasnt got all the useless bling bling and colors and leds and all the "***** extentions" the 14MZ has :P

Let's see if it's something for me, depends on when it will be released...

I'll let you know!

Fred

[RCfan]

Spoken like a true wannabe. :badair:

[svein]

However, it may hold a core of truth.

For a lot of pilots, the 12Z may be a better option than the 14mz, if they don't NEED the added functions/channels of the 14MZ.

The "old-style" monochrome LCD is easier to read in bright sunlight than a color display, and the added "bling" of an onboard mp3-player basically means more complex software, hence more chances of bugs.

The 14MZ has more features than the 12Z, and two more channels. If you don't need the added features, nor the two extra channels, the 12Z is definitely a better buy.

//Svein

[freddyferris]

If you can assign every switch as you want, the 12 is defenetly better than it's big bro!
I mean hey! only scale or jet pilots could need 14chanels!
A normal heli/3D flyer only needs 6chanels, or 7 if you fly with a Governor...
I'm sure 95% of you guy's having a 14 never tried to fly with the MP3 player on...
I Got a HD mp3 player for that in my pocket with surely a better sound quality than the one from the T14...

But i musst say it is quite cool to be able to set a model just by typping on a touch screen!

@RCfan:
I would'nt say that if i'd had "superman" as avatar....
I could afford a T14 but i prefere to invest the money in Gallons of 30% and replecment parts as they aren't as cheap here as in the US...

Ciao!

Fred

[Jerry]

According to my source that was at the show, and I was on the phone with him while he talked to the show reps...and manipulated and photographed the screens....

The target US release was March/April......

The target street US price was $1500 (with the G3 rx)

The software was identical to 14MZ, and programs would be cross compatible.

Now...thats what they 'said'

As for what happens next, we'll just have to see. None of this info comes from our official source here in the USA.

My principle area of concern with the software was the eCCPM swash detail menu. Unfortunately, certain portions of it were inaccessible because the software in the display tx's was 'demo version only' and was not 'fully functional' From what I see and played with vicariously....I can't confirm what the eCCPM software level is.

Thanks to Randy Gelman for making the trip and sending the pics and info.

Jerry

[freddyferris]

Link to your gallery?

Fred

[Jerry]

Fred, pics are posted, just refresh.

Jerry

[freddyferris]

Doesnt wanna display... any direct link to them?

Fred