Flymentor wireing and setting up useing Helibal Trex and clones

[Ivor Hill]

Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, aileron,elevator subtrims and trims to 0, end point to 100% and servo reverses to normal,exept the throttle channel leave that at it is. Set a linear pitch curve 0-25-50-75-100.
The plug with 3 wires from the FM module connects to the aileron porton the reciever, Yellow connects to elevator port, orange connects to pitch port. if you are useing the FM tail gyro the grey wire connects to the rudder port and the green connects to the gyro gain port.

If you are useing a seperate gyro leave it connected as it is and leave the grey and green wires disconnected.
The blue wire controls stabilization gain and is best left disconnected dueing set up.
If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the heli from the rear the left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3. The black negative wire on the servo leads are closest to the usb port and line up with the usb sign.
If the elevator servo is front mounted the it's left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1. Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now. If you are useing he FM tail gyro connect tail servo to port 5 on FM.

Disconnect motor, power up TX and Heli, Led on FM should be flashing green, and connect to Helibal programme.
Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctley under the Helibal mounting tab.
Tip the heli and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the heli is tipped the swash moves in the opposit direction to correct.
If you can get aileron to operate ok but not elevator the swop servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.
Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and centre the swash. First go to advance page and set balancer gain to 0 this will switch FM off and set stick midway 50%. Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the heli from the front use aileron slider to level the swash. Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.
Now fit a pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.
Set balancer gain back to + 70.

Because the blue wire is disconnected FM gain it controlled by Helibal, I recommend you test fly and adjust the gain in Helibal for your first flights before connecting the blue wire and attempting to control gain with your TX, unless you are 100% shure you know what you are doing.
With the heli in position mode ( green light ) if the heli rocks side to side and fore and aft ( dancing ) in a hover reduce the gain just enough to stop it.
If the heli is not dancing increase the gain untill it does and then reduce just enough to stop it. Just like setting the gain on a tail gyro.
You may also need to use a little TX trim to stop the heli drifting.

If you are useing the FM tail gyro you will first need to switch it to normal mode with a gain value of about 25, either with your TX if the green wire is connected or by useing the slider on the tail page in Helibal if the green wire is disconnected.
Once in normal mode the tail servo will move to centre, set he tail slider so that it is a little off centre towards the boom. Test fly and slide the servo along the boom untill the heli will hover without stick input or trim.
Set the travel so that the tail slider does not bottom out,switch back to HH and set the best gain. You may need to use a little TX trim for best performance.
Note, when you switch to HH the tail servo will drift to one end, this is normal and it will sort itself out when you lift off into a hover, help it a little with the rudder stick.
Note, If the blue wire is connected stabilization gain is controled and adjusted in the TX and adjusting it in Helibal will have no effect, if it is disconnected stabilization gain is adjusted in Helibal.
The green wire for gyro gain works in the same way. Connected,controlled by TX disconnected controlled in Helibal.

[Bug Splat]

Thanks Ivor!

I thought that might be the case for me but did not try it. I'll switch 1 and 2 tonight and see if that fixes my issue.

[Ivor Hill]

Originally Posted by Bug Splat

Thanks Ivor!

I thought that might be the case for me but did not try it. I'll switch 1 and 2 tonight and see if that fixes my issue.

I suggest you re-set Helibal to factory settings,set your Tx as instructed, disconnect the blue wire and follow the intructions.

[helican]

I encountered the same problem, once I swapped ports 1 and 2 the problem was solved.....I wish I had this great forum a few months ago. It would have saved me a few hours of troubleshooting.

[rhuber40]

I have everything working with the external programmer, when I try to hook up with Helibal, It just sits there with the "connecting" prompt . I have tried three computers running windows xp.

[TeeJayShelton]

Originally Posted by Ivor Hill

Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, aileron,elevator subtrims and trims to 0, end point to 100% and servo reverses to normal.
If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the heli from the rear the left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3.
If the elevator servo is front mounted the it's left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1. Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now.
Disconnect motor, power up TX and Heli and connect to Helibal programme.
Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctley under the Helibal mounting tab.
Tip the heli and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the heli is tipped the swash moves in the opposit direction to correct.
If you can get aileron to operate ok but not elevator the swop servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.
Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and centre the swash. Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the heli from the front use aileron slider to level the swash. Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.

Just a note here when you get "as close as possible to 90°" and you can get very close (if not dead on it... you should not worry about the swash level until to do after you get the arms all at 90 now adjust your linkages per finless bobs ccpm video where mixing arms are level and you have 0 pitch in the middle of your swashes travel range. Also after you have verified it corrects the swash the right way and the controls move with the stick the right way you need to be sure you set fm to off (solid red LED)for all of the 90° and leveling steps.
A handy tip someone told me was to set my throttle hold pitch curve to 0, 50, 50, 50, 100 so it was easy the nail mid stick and didnt encourage cheating(ie the stick at close to 9/16 or 7/16 for 0 pitch...

Originally Posted by Ivor Hill

Now fita pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.

[Ivor Hill]

Thanks TJ I have edited. The swash set up should have been set mechanically before before fitting FM and after fitting FM you are able to get it allmost back to that position useing neutral sliders. But since there are no seperate subtrims for each servo you must move the sliders a little more to level the swash. This will mean that the servo arms are not exacly 90 degrees but should be close.
You can leave the sliders at 0 and adjust the servo arms and links to get the swash closer to correct and then use the sliders to fine tune, most HC users do this but I have never found it necessary I just use the neutrals.
It is also possible to re-level the swash at min and max pitch to reduce servo interactions by useing TX end points.

[R_Lefebvre]

Yes, it should be noted that, without individual servo subtrim on the FM, you will never get the servo arms as straight and level as you normally would without using FM. I set up an extra model in my Tx, set it up with CCPM, used the subtrims to get the swash level and the arms straight. Then I switched it over to the FM model with 1S swash, and programmed the FM. When I did that, the swash was no longer level, I had to move the sliders in the FM. It's close, but it's not perfect.

[Bug Splat]

I ended up setting the trim to 90* using the TX. It was freaking impossible to get it level using FM. I got it as close as I could with FM then used the TX to get it exact. Is that ok?

[Ivor Hill]

For some reason I cannot edit the original post. I wanted to add that I use Align PU Gell and velcro strap to mount the gyro. I have found it quite good for isolating against vibrations but does not hold the gyro very well,hence the velcro strap that is supplied with the gell.
To test that FM is not being effected by vibration. Power up in position mode with gain at factory preset +70, tip heli and check that the swash is reacting correctly, moving in the opposit direction to correct the tip.
Pin the heli down so it cannot take off and run it up to speed. The blades and flybar should remain level, if they tip then you have to much vibration and flying the heli will result in a crash.
Dont forget to save your cfg file after you have set up FM.

[doideplao3000]

Originally Posted by Ivor Hill

Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, aileron,elevator subtrims and trims to 0, end point to 100% and servo reverses to normal,exept the throttle channel leave that at it is. Set a linear pitch curve 0-25-50-75-100.
The plug with 3 wires from the FM module connects to the aileron porton the reciever, Yellow connects to elevator port, orange connects to pitch port. if you are useing the FM tail gyro the grey wire connects to the rudder port and the green connects to the gyro gain port.

If you are useing a seperate gyro leave it connected as it is and leave the grey and green wires disconnected.
The blue wire controls stabilization gain and is best left disconnected dueing set up.
If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the heli from the rear the left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3. The black negative wire on the servo leads are closest to the usb port and line up with the usb sign.
If the elevator servo is front mounted the it's left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1. Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now. If you are useing he FM tail gyro connect tail servo to port 5 on FM.

Disconnect motor, power up TX and Heli, Led on FM should be flashing green, and connect to Helibal programme.
Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctley under the Helibal mounting tab.
Tip the heli and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the heli is tipped the swash moves in the opposit direction to correct.
If you can get aileron to operate ok but not elevator the swop servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.
Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and centre the swash. First go to advance page and set balancer gain to 0 this will switch FM off and set stick midway 50%. Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the heli from the front use aileron slider to level the swash. Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.
Now fit a pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.
Set balancer gain back to + 70.

Because the blue wire is disconnected FM gain it controlled by Helibal, I recommend you test fly and adjust the gain in Helibal for your first flights before connecting the blue wire and attempting to control gain with your TX, unless you are 100% shure you know what you are doing.
With the heli in position mode ( green light ) if the heli rocks side to side and fore and aft ( dancing ) in a hover reduce the gain just enough to stop it.
If the heli is not dancing increase the gain untill it does and then reduce just enough to stop it. Just like setting the gain on a tail gyro.
You may also need to use a little TX trim to stop the heli drifting.

If you are useing the FM tail gyro you will first need to switch it to normal mode with a gain value of about 25, either with your TX if the green wire is connected or by useing the slider on the tail page in Helibal if the green wire is disconnected.
Once in normal mode the tail servo will move to centre, set he tail slider so that it is a little off centre towards the boom. Test fly and slide the servo along the boom untill the heli will hover without stick input or trim.
Set the travel so that the tail slider does not bottom out,switch back to HH and set the best gain. You may need to use a little TX trim for best performance.
Note, when you switch to HH the tail servo will drift to one end, this is normal and it will sort itself out when you lift off into a hover, help it a little with the rudder stick.
Note, If the blue wire is connected stabilization gain is controled and adjusted in the TX and adjusting it in Helibal will have no effect, if it is disconnected stabilization gain is adjusted in Helibal.
The green wire for gyro gain works in the same way. Connected,controlled by TX disconnected controlled in Helibal.

hi ivor
i have a trex450 pro , dx6i Tx and 6100e Rx , i just got the 3d flymentor and did following your instruction but had no way to make it work , the software just say kdslinkline not found , can you please help me how to make it work .thank you very much .i want to you my stock tail gyro instead of the ccd , so if you tell me how to bypass would deeply appreciate .Once again thank you very much .
bao

[Ivor Hill]

Originally Posted by doideplao3000

hi ivor
i have a trex450 pro , dx6i Tx and 6100e Rx , i just got the 3d flymentor and did following your instruction but had no way to make it work , the software just say kdslinkline not found , can you please help me how to make it work .thank you very much .i want to you my stock tail gyro instead of the ccd , so if you tell me how to bypass would deeply appreciate .Once again thank you very much .
bao

Not sure what you mean by stock gyro instead of ccd but just leave your stock gyro and servo connected to your reciever as it is and leave the grey and green fm wires disconnected. It does mean that you need to find space for both gyros.
If you are useing xp connection should not be a problem,you may need to go into device manager and change the port to a low number port try 1 or 2. The software will not work with vista or windows 7.
Flymentor needs to be powered up, green led flashing, to connect. It does not take power from the usb port.

[Moosejam]

Hello everyone – Being a novice I’m still struggle to hover with confidence between minor pileups and repairs – hence my interest in Flymentor. The wisdom you guys have amassed in thousands of postings is taking time to wade through!
Your help has enabled me to integrate FM into an old Belt–CP without too much pain until it turned turtle about 6 inches after the first lift off. As Ivor often warns, I should have watched the rotor disc more closely and aborted the take off sooner. I’ve yet to distinguish between an unstable bird and my inept piloting – I saw no tendency to dance, it just gently lifted off, rolled left on its training legs and flipped over.
Having righted the damage, rechecked the control linkage geometry and ensured the Tx and FM settings agree with the ‘Sticky’, I will now do tied down bench whirling tests to seek vibration and other disturbing inputs.
A couple of points do niggle:
• Whenever I connect FM to Helibal and down load FM data, all sorts of apparently random settings appear in Helibal. To correct this I invariably have to reset FM from the config file. So, what software settings exist in FM when I next power up pre flight?
• After sending a software change to FM, the modify flag (Fig 2.2.3 on page 8 of manual) that is displayed most of the time, vanishes, then reappears within a second or so. This seems illogical since Helibal and FM settings should now be the identical or have I missed something?
• Because the Elevator servo is ahead of my rotor mast, I swapped the Pitch and Aileron servo connections to FM. Am I right in assuming this also swaps the neutral labels in Helibal servo tab?
• Among his many postings, Ivor suggested some pitch, throttle and expo curve settings to help novice flyers – would a kind sole please remind what this posting page and number is?

I intend dumping the CP far a more modern 450 size in the near future and would welcome all suggestions for a technically sound and economic solution to goal.

Part of my career involved flight–testing full size helicopters and my son has recently rekindled my enthusiasm for these machines by donating a discarded Esky Belt CP and a Raptor. Needless to say, I intend staying well clear of the latter bird until I have ‘safer hands’.

Best regards to all,
Derek

[Neppon]

Hello,

I have a Futaba 7c now and programming it for flymentor.
Green wire to 5 channel and green wire to 7 channel.
Used TX "A" key to control gyro, 40% up and 45% down (some windy time) and it´s locking tail good.
Used the "E" (tree points) key to have three values, using governator config and set: 50% (down) led red / 10% (middle) led red+green / 90% (up) led green, to have flymentor off at down, flymentor horizontal at middle and flymentor positional at up.

Make a short hover at my garage with three positions "E" switch and everything looks like ok.

Please confirm that I´m at correct way, and at this post about gains: http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=178401 was talked about use endpoints to manipulate correct gain value, it applyes to Futaba 7c too?

My channel 7 with flat 100% original endpoints at 0% it´s same of 100% horizontal mode, 50% it´s off and 100% it´s same 100% position mode, right?

Will try position mode at grass and other floors when it be possibe.

Regards,
Neppon

[sweggy94]

im new to flying and i have a kds 450s and i just bought a flymentor to install and i dont know what channels the flymentor cables plug into on my kds k-8x. any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Neppon]

Originally Posted by Neppon

Please confirm that I´m at correct way, and at this post about gains: http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=178401 was talked about use endpoints to manipulate correct gain value, it applyes to Futaba 7c too?
Neppon

Will coment about my own question:
After exchange some messagens with Ivor I figure out about to use endpoints or use percentual at governator (my personal option with futaba 7c).

The original governator (channel 7) config are: 0%, 50% and 100%
If you use endpoint to channel 7 to limit lower and upper values like Ivor say you still using default 0%, 50% and 100% for governator but will have teorically balance -42 with governator 0% and position for +62 with governator +70%.
In my case I use 100% endpoints the need lower (or up) less governator values to get same gain and have more easy control over flymentor off point (aways is 50%) but need to calculate double % to get real gain like governator 35% it´s equal -30 gain and governator 65% it´s equal to +30 gain.

Will try demonstrate...

Original:
GOVERNATOR
0% ------------------------------ 50% -----------------------------------100%
ENDPOINT
100%----------------------------------------------------------------------100%
FLYMENTOR GAIN
-100--------------------------------OFF---------------------------------+100

Ivor suggestion:
GOVERNATOR
0% ------------------------------- 50% ----------------------------------100%
ENDPOINT
42%-------------------------------------------------------------------------70%
FLYMENTOR GAIN
-16----------------------------------OFF--------------------------------+62
* aproximated values and 100% endpoint it´s not +100 because scale come from 42% to 70% limited by endpoint, it´s a fast way but not so precise

My suggestion:
GOVERNATOR
35% ------------------------------ 50% -----------------------------------65%
ENDPOINT
100%---------------------------------------------------------------------100%
FLYMENTOR GAIN
-30----------------------------------OFF---------------------------------+30



Neppon

[HELIDIPP]

apperciate all this info///

[renemay24]

Hi, i just received my kds 450sv w/flymentor i am a bigginer and i dont think the settings on the flymentor heliball or the Tx are right can someone help me with this setting. thanks

[Ivor Hill]

Sorry but you need to be more specific and tell us exactly what your problems are.

[Birdman4498]

tt