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Old 02-27-2012, 09:16 PM   #1
NikonEdge
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Default V400D02 will not lift anymore with full throttle

I am a newbie and this is my first post. I can not get through to xHeli support. The on-line tech support form does not except the “Captcha Text” even though I enter it correctly and they never responded to a previous support e-mail but I tried sending another e-mail and since I am not sure that will respond I thought I would try here. This is basically what I just sent to XHeli which describes the problem.

I have only been performing hovering with the heli and on the 6th hover practice I was hovering for ~6:08 minutes when the helicopter starting to descend like the battery was running down which I thought was strange since during the other hover sessions the battery would last for more than 7 minutes.

I switched out the battery for a fully charged battery, went through binding process and starting spinning up the blades to start hovering again. The problem is the helicopter will only get light on the skids and will not lift off the ground. Nothing changed between the first hover session and the second only a few minutes after the first one in term of the transmitter settings.

Can you please tell me what the problem could be? Everything appears normal, the binding process was the same, the blades turn but even at full throttle it will not lift off the ground any more. I have been hovering previously with the 2801-Pro and even switched to the kit 2603 which I used the first to make sure it was working and it still will not lift off the ground.

I have only been hovering the heli since I got it and it has never crashed and never hit any objects. This is the only problem I am having but this is happening only after 6 flights.

If XHeli does not fix this problem and/or respond I am not ordering from them anymore. HeliDirect is much better but XHeli had the v400D02 in stock and cheap at the time.

Thanks for any help.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:20 PM   #2
krobinson103
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Seven minutes on a battery? That seems like a very long time. The most you should be pulling out of 1100mah battery that comes with the v400 is about 5 minutes to be sure you have your 20% buffer. If you drain batteries too deeply they will be unable to maintain a charge,

If you haven't crashed and everything is working well then I'd get a new battery and see if that makes any difference. The other possible problems could be a pitch problem - check the pitch curves in the 2801 and look at the pitch on the blades themselves. Also if you are using the stock servos its possible they stripped out. Walkera servos on the v400 will break if you blow on them. Check that they all move freely and smoothly.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:36 PM   #3
inner3
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It sounds like it could be the main gear. I'd hate to say it could already be gone, but if you didn't change the pitch settings as said before, then the main gear could cause it to not lift if the teeth are not connecting due to being stripped.
Also, its pretty easy to get a good 7 minutes on that battery. I try not to go too far with it, but I also have some 1600 and 1800 batteries that I use and get about 8-9 minutes on those. The 2200mah work also!
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Old 02-28-2012, 06:40 AM   #4
NikonEdge
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I looked at the main gear there is only 1 tooth that is slightly flat. Would that cause the problem? I will not be able to check out the I assume pitch until later but during binding the blades did pitch up and down as normal from what I could tell. So you do not think it is electronics other than possible the pitch servo?

Also to disconnect the tail motor I can not tell what side of the connector disconnects. Is it the longer piece that has small tabs or the shorter piece and do I just pull?

I also I have some additional questions regarding the 2801 Pro with the V400D02. I have 2 setups, one in WK-2801 mode with SWASH set as 1SERVO, the only way I could get it to work and I can access CURVES. The second in WK-2601 mode with SWASH set as 3SERVOS but I can not access CURVES. How do I know what they are set at and how can I adjust. I also can not access DR&EXP setting.

Thanks for the help.
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Old 02-28-2012, 07:54 AM   #5
NikonEdge
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This can not be acceptable that after 5-6 flights of just hovering and no crashes or hitting any objects all I have is a $159 paper weight. This is really ridiculous, so now I am suppose to randomly spend more money on this heli when all I did was hover. Is that not what it is suppose to do!!!

I looked at the main gear there is only 1 tooth that is slightly indented, I can not believe this would be the problem but do not know. Would that cause the problem? I will not be able to check out the, I assume pitch servo until later but during binding the blades did pitch up and down as normal from what I could tell. So you do not think it is electronics other than possible the pitch servo?

Also to disconnect the tail motor I can not tell what side of the connector disconnects. Is it the longer piece that has small tabs or the shorter piece and do I just pull?

I also I have some additional questions regarding the 2801 Pro with the V400D02. I have 2 setups, one in WK-2801 mode with SWASH set as 1SERVO, the only way I could get it to work and I can access CURVES. The second in WK-2601 mode with SWASH set as 3SERVOS but I can not access CURVES. How do I know what they are set at and how can I adjust. I also can not access DR&EXP setting.

Are there settings for the 2801 Pro in WK-2801 mode that works with SWASH set as 3SERVOS?

Thanks for the help.
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Old 02-28-2012, 07:11 PM   #6
krobinson103
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Quote:
Also to disconnect the tail motor I can not tell what side of the connector disconnects. Is it the longer piece that has small tabs or the shorter piece and do I just pull?
That JST connector to the tail is a real pain. I just replaced it with a Deans. Its held in place by a sleeve over the outside and the only way to remove it is with lots of force
Its also prone to failure so replacing it is a good idea.

Quote:
This is really ridiculous, so now I am suppose to randomly spend more money on this heli when all I did was hover. Is that not what it is suppose to do!!!
"Ready to Fly" hmmm nope. Its "Ready to fix!" But, if you deal with a few issues it is a good bird. The main things you need to do to get her flying right are:

1) GET RID of the stock servos as fast as possible. They are totally worthless and hazard to public safety. They will strip with no provocation and cause a crash.

2) Replace the Jst connector on the tail wire with something better, I went as far as replacing the whole wire as it was so thin.

3) Stock up on main and tail motors as the brushed ones wear. That or just invest in the brushless kit.

4) Check every nut and bolt for tightness. I actually replaced them all with hex head bolts for a much stronger frame.

Quote:
I also I have some additional questions regarding the 2801 Pro with the V400D02. I have 2 setups, one in WK-2801 mode with SWASH set as 1SERVO, the only way I could get it to work and I can access CURVES. The second in WK-2601 mode with SWASH set as 3SERVOS but I can not access CURVES. How do I know what they are set at and how can I adjust. I also can not access DR&EXP setting.

Are there settings for the 2801 Pro in WK-2801 mode that works with SWASH set as 3SERVOS?
Run the tx in 2801, one servo mode. The gyro/receiver deals with the servos for you. In this mode all the curves are usable. This is standard with most FBL systems. Be sure to check that the idle up and normal pitch curves all have 50% settings at position 3 so when you switch you don't get any jumping. DR isn't really nessecary on the v400 as its quite a tame heli to start with, but expo is useful.

Also, when you do decide that you want to go inverted don't assume it flies like the sim! It DOES NOT have the power nessecary for a stationary flip or roll. You have to do a large loop to get her over. I trashed her because of that error....

Its not the best heli out there, but with a bit of work it flies well and is easy to repair.Good to learn on, but you'll want to move one fairly soon. You can fit a larger battery in the frame if you want, It will handle up to about 1600mah with little performance drop but any heavier and it starts to get heavy in the air.
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Old 02-28-2012, 08:04 PM   #7
NikonEdge
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Krobinson103, thanks for the great information. At this learning stage I really just wanted something to learn on and get flying time and not spend all my time upgrading but from what I have been reading on these forums it seems most of the heli’s have some kind of problem. Before the helis my son I spent 3 years racing gas and electric cars in local and regional events. Never had this problem of buying an car and it stopped working but I guess the heli’s are a bit more complicated.

If you have a suggestion on a 200 to 400 size heli that I can fly without all these modifications let me know.

Thanks for the tail motor wire suggestion as I need to unplug so I can test throttle servos and pitch without the tail blade spinning.

I could not look at servo suggestions this morning so I was thinking about the original problem of not lifting off all day and since the main gear was fine it had to be related to the pitch, the reason for the TX settings question and the need for 2801 mode. I had the pitch settings for normal mode set as follows: 50%,55%,60%,65%,70%. What I did was change the high 70% value to 80% and it started to lift and now I will have to look at all the settings again.

But as I stated in the original post I never changed these values so can someone explain what changed while flying, which is when it started losing altitude. Then all I did was change to a fully charged battery and it would not lift higher than ~1 inch until changing the high value on the pitch curve. I need a reason if any body has one.

Thanks again Inner3 and Krobinson103 for all the good suggestions.
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Old 02-29-2012, 06:25 AM   #8
krobinson103
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No problem. I had a heck of a time getting that stupid thing to fly right. Sometimes the 2801 memory will bug out (once in a 1000) and its possible that was the cause of things changing.

Quote:
ad the pitch settings for normal mode set as follows: 50%,55%,60%,65%,70%. What I did was change the high 70% value to 80% and it started to lift and now I will have to look at all the settings again.
Set your pitch to more like 25 35 50 75 100. You need the extra power to lift when the brushed motor has such limited power. Don't worry about the heli getting away from you as you will only use the range that you need. If you feel a bit more confident a good way to help is to only fly in idle up with a flat 80% throttle curve. It will smooth out hovering something serious. Just be ready to hit throttle hold when you feel you are in trouble.

Quote:
If you have a suggestion on a 200 to 400 size heli that I can fly without all these modifications let me know.
Sad to say the best thing to do is go micro or 450 plus. I struggled with RTF, spent a bundle getting it to fly right, and discovered that my Beam 450 (yes I know expensive but well worth it) is 1000% better in every way than the v400 has any chance of being.

If I were you I would think about getting a Mini CP 2801 version and using the wk-2801 receiver you got with your tx to power a decent kit. A clone would work, but I just went to as good as I could get.

Oh yes, if you are using the random binding function on the 2801... don't! If for some reason you lose contact with the heli and try and rebind you won't be able to. Set the fixed ID option in the stick menu and you get a much faster initial bind that can be re-established at any time. I know because that happened and I lost a perfectly good battery drained to uselessness
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Old 03-05-2012, 08:50 AM   #9
NikonEdge
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Krobinson103, thanks for the help and the Mini CP does look good from what I can tell from some of the videos but it does not look like there is a version that binds with the 2801 Pro and also it is even hard to find in US stores at least the ones I order from.

And regarding the V400D02 I am very disappointed and sent it back to XHeli as they stated they would refund my money but I will have to see. They will not get it until 3/6 so we will see.

As I stated in the previous post I have only been hovering and I have never crashed or hit anything. Well on the 6th and final flight I was hovering and after about 3 minutes it started vibrating and making a grinding noise and I am thinking, now what is wrong so I brought it down. Looking at he heli I noticed the motor pinion was no longer meshing with the main gear, the reason for the noise, and thinking to my self did the motor come loose, what would cause that.

Then looking closer I noticed the bracket holding the tail boom to the frame had fractured. You gotta be kidding me!!! How in the world did this pass QA. This should have never happened and is a very dangerous situation and has the potential of injuring someone. Well I am glad I never made any modifications or crashed the heli as XHeli would have definitely said a crash would be the cause and not refund my money. So there better not be any problems with the refund. And just to think the support guy asked me if I wanted a new part sent out. Really!!!

Well I am glad everyone on the forum seems to love the V400D02 and put up with the problems it seems to have, but I will have to take a long look before purchasing another Walkera product. Trying to decide now whether to cell the 2801 Pro. The only reason I purchased it was to get the CB100 BNF which has been out of stock for the last several months and now thinking they will never be in stock.

My first heli was a Blade 120 SR and I was doing good with it until I got over confident and went outside with it. BIG mistake as it should definitely not be flown with in the wind especially if you are a beginner. It got away from me, I panicked and it fell about 25 feet, not a pretty sight. Not sure why I ordered another one but I did. It did handle good why it was flyable.

Well, while waiting for the second 120 SR to arrive I purchased a Blade mSR X. Of course I am having a hard time with the left turns but it has been very durable. I have had to replace parts and the main motor but I am getting better. After the second 120 SR arrived the elevator servo went out after I think the second flight and Horizon sent another one, then right after 5-in-1 unit and spinning it up, the tail just went around and a second 5-in-1 unit was sent due to made gyro. Then it appeared to be having drifting problems not matter how many times I adjusted the swash links. At this point I just sent it back to Horizon to let them take a look and they are still working on it.

For the last week I have been spending more time on the Phoenix simulator with several CP heli’s and I think I am progressing very well. In fact I just ordered a Blade 450 3D BNF and it should be here on 3/7. Horizon has some great support and after doing more research and flying 450 3D on the simulator for the pass few days I think this was the right choice. I do like Walkera’s transmitters but I have not used it long enough to know if the would have any problems.

I know the world it not perfect things will happen but for a structural member to fracture on a helicopter that is dangerous to being with is not one of them. Walkera seems to have good electrical engineering talent but the mechanical engineering and QA not so good.

I am still waiting to see if I can get a Mini CP which at this point looks like the only Walkera I will consider or may opt for the mCP X V2 which I should have gotten in place of the second 120 SR.

Last edited by NikonEdge; 03-08-2012 at 07:44 AM..
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