Commander 130 V not giving motor and power.

[beans07]

Hi all I am running the commander 130A with BEC on a Logo600 with the vbar gov and I am not getting any power out of the heli. I have it paired with a new motor HKII- 4035 - 560kv on 10s brand new 45C batts.

I have tried setting up now quite a lot of times but it just wont give me any power at all. I have already put a post in vbar forum here but now I am thinking there is an actual issue with the ESC itself.

I have tried the ohms test on the motor and no issues there.

I have set one of the Commanders up on my E7 and it works perfectly so I can't understand why it just wont work on the logo600.

On the bench I can get the requested headspeed without blades on but when in the air I doubt it actually even makes the heads speed and the blades near stop when doing a climbout of about 50ft at about 10ft a sec. Today caused a crash as I did a little climbout of about 20ft to test after setting it up all again and when decending I had not enough power or pitch to stop the heli and very very slow reaction.

I am not happy as this caused lots of damage about $250 worth. I am really frustrated and annoyed with this ESC. Kontronik before it worked perfect for lots of flights (before buying new motor and ESC).

I have posted about it here http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=409065

Anyone got any ideas????

[RasmusDK]

Hi

Maybe you should try to fly it without the vbar gov? If its still wont work, its esc related.

[beans07]

A very good idea. I only bought because of being able to use on vbar gov.

I can't see how it can't be the ESC that is the problem.

My other commander on another heli with exactly the same radio setup, vbar setup, calibration and everything else works perfect. I actually set both up the same last night on the bench and then flew both helis today. One worked and one did not.

[Georges van Gansen]

check connection of phase sensor to V bar, i think your V bar is not geting the signal.

[beans07]

Thanks for the reply Georges. I have an opto cable that I could use from the known working combination. When I get it repaired this week I will try again.

[geekindenial]

If that fails, look at Vbar log to see if during real flights you have a lots of Governor signal errors.

I had similar issues before, on bench easily get 2200rpm, in air sub 2000 and unstable. Turns out gov signal problems and I could not get it to work with the Scorp cable. I ended up getting a Hyperion phase sensor instead for 10 bucks. It solved the problem straight away.

[alexmit]

Originally Posted by geekindenial

If that fails, look at Vbar log to see if during real flights you have a lots of Governor signal errors.

I had similar issues before, on bench easily get 2200rpm, in air sub 2000 and unstable. Turns out gov signal problems and I could not get it to work with the Scorp cable. I ended up getting a Hyperion phase sensor instead for 10 bucks. It solved the problem straight away.

+1. I too ended up with the Hyperion phase sensor for use with the vBar gov.

[beans07]

Mine could be a phase sensor issue.

I tried again today after reseting again and it didn't work. Put in a new lead from phase output of esc to vbar and again didn't work. Checked vbar log and it says "gov on" when I flick out of idle up but I am not getting close to headspeed or any power at all.

I will source a hyperion phase sensor and try again.

[beans07]

I noticed that when I am on low throttle the "full throttle" light is on the whole time. Does this indicate that the throttle endpoints aren't being calibrated properly? Or is this a sign the Phase sensor is not working?

Also on the hyperion phase sensor on full vbar do I need to take the +ve out of it? or leave it in?

[MrMel]

Originally Posted by beans07

I noticed that when I am on low throttle the "full throttle" light is on the whole time. Does this indicate that the throttle endpoints aren't being calibrated properly? Or is this a sign the Phase sensor is not working?

Also on the hyperion phase sensor on full vbar do I need to take the +ve out of it? or leave it in?

Full throttle is what Vbar output, meaning if it shows all the time (when motor is running) it's something wrong with the RPM sensor, always verify the RPM sensor by the "Current RPM", do you get a stable reading there?

Full sizevbar you plug the sensor directly into SENSOR II port, do not remove any cables.

[beans07]

Everything appears to work on the bench just not in the air. RPM outputs change on the screen in different idle ups but not when trying to fly. RPM is lower when trying to hover and then blades almost stop when putting pitch on them. That magnet like on for full throttle is on the bench and not flown nor the motor spooled up at all.

Today I tried as many things as I could (just not the hyperion phase sensor as it turned up late). I tried with normal extension (no opto cable) with the red wire removed and I get the exact same problems but also some "full throttle" and "gov contains glitches" in the log. The opto gives me none of them messages.

This ESC seems to act up. It is very hard to get it to reset. A lot of the time it goes di di do do when the throttle stick is full. Even though I used 4 cell nimh pack fully charged with the bec set at 5.4v I even tried taking out the red cable and have the same problems most of the time. I seem to be only able to reset the ESC or recallibrate endpoints about 1 out of 10 tries. That is with following the exact same procedure as your videos.

I have another that works 100% perfectly. It programs easy, it gets to RPM and is stable on RPM and doesn't lose any headspeed or any other issue at all.

Motor tests fine with the normal milliohm test but maybe it has a short I can't see. That to me would explain why things are not working at all.

I don't have a spare ESC to test.

If phase sensor doesn't work (not real confident it will) I will send it in for testing.

Thanks again to all for the answer and responding to my posts.

[beans07]

I tried using the Hyperion phase sensor and it made abolutely no difference.

Either I am not doing something wrong on the the throttle calibration, the vbar itself has an issue or the ESC is the problem.

[MrMel]

Post a copy of the event log from that last session

[beans07]

Here is the log and also my vbar file.

There is only a couple of flights and the ones with glitches are after changing to hyperion phase sensor. There is also a lot of time that it was left on the bench and the bellow 4.5v are with a nicd rx pack that was going flat.

EDIT: I notice that in the air the headspeed is the same no matter which flight mode I select. The TX has different throttle curve % in each fight mode and works on the bench wih the requested and current headspeeds. The Output Socket stays at 38% no matter which flight mode I go into also.

[MrMel]

So you get the glitches on the flight WITH hyperion sensor?

[beans07]

With the opto cable and scorpion phase output no glitches, with the hyperion phase sensor log has glitches.

Setup either way still gives exactly the same results.

I am still sure that for some reason the throttle endpoints are not being calibrated properly as my Synergy originally had the same issue but with a reset it fixed it completely. It just doesn't seem to recognize the endpoints correctly on this particular setup.

[beans07]

Just to be sure this is how I am resetting the ESC.

1. Turn on tx, plug in a buffer pack (have tried a 2s life, 4 cell nicd and now trying a 2s lipo) and wait for vbar to initialize.
2. Click on setup, disable the gov and make sure I have -100 - +100 on the ESC transmitter page.
3. Put throttle at full and then plug in flight pack (10s pack)
4. I hear 2 beeps so say it is in setup mode (doesn't always happens sometimes take a few goes before getting into setup mode).
5. wait for program mode. Wait for 10sec 1 beep and then wait for 10sec 2nd beep. Then shut shut the rx pack and unglug the ESC. If I don't shut off the rx pack the ESC still continues through it's beep cycles every 10 sec.

If I go into the software for ESC at this stage it reads airplane mode and needs the correct settings for external gov mode.

This is now where I have tried many ways and may have it wrong. Here is what I have tried at this step.

a. Plug in IR and program correctly and then enable gov and fly.
b. Plug in PC and program correctly and then enable gov and fly.
c. Do throttle calibration and then plug in IR and program correctly and then enable gov and fly.
d. Do throttle calibration and then plug in PC and program correctly and then enable gov and fly.
e. All of the above and adding in trying to reset the gov on vabr and seeing if that works.

Tried new setup on tx, tried new setup on vbar.

[beans07]

I took a video of it today with screen recorder and bluetooth. Not keeping constant RPM.

Is it possible that both phase sensor in ESC and the Hypeion one are bad?

YouTube (Short URL)

YouTube (Short URL)

[MrMel]

In that video you are at full throttle all the time (requested is too high) can you try just for test same thing but have requested at 1600, is it stable then?

[beans07]

Will try again tomorrow morning.

The actual full throttle light was on as it wasnt the first attempt as I forgot to hit Record the first time. So I landed and hit hold and then started recording again before spooling up again. I noticed at that stage it said full throttle.