OMGOMGOMG!!!

[bloftin]

Originally Posted by JasonJ

Very true. A necessary risk is when a child is being rescued from a partially submerged car by a rescue swimmer with a helicopter hovering above. Nothing we do in this hobby is necessary, so it is all unnecessary risk.

Hey, if he was doing that in the middle of a playground choc full o' childrens, that would be one thing. He's just doin' his thing, hurting no one buy possibly himself.

I'm actually more unsafe than him in a way. I fly my nitro by myself in my back 40, often times while the wife is at work. If I were to lose control and hit myself, and be seriously injured, I would lay there for hours. Do I worry about it? Nope, because I could hit a moose driving to work, someone could do a home invasion on my house while we are sleeping and get to us before I deploy the tactical shot gun. Just too many what-ifs....At some point we have to just live our lives...

Big +1
I could not agree more.

Well said Jason

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by bloftin

Big +1
I could not agree more.

Well said Jason

Ok, he can do what he wants, but when we can't fly anymore because of a fool like that, then you'll see the pitchforks and torches heading over to his house to kick his ass. Why do you think there are laws? To prevent people from hurting themselves and others and prevent chaos. You have to protect these rights you speak of. You guys just don't seem to understand...your "rights" are only valid until they infringe on mine, and when the legislators DO get involved, we both lose. Several years ago in Miami, some young swimmers were killed by jetskiers coming too close to the shore after many warnings. Now jetskis are banned in the whole of Biscayne Bay all the way down to Key Largo! Sure, you have the "RIGHT" to ride your jetski, just not around here!!!!
Now cut the crap. Go play with muriatic acid or something and leave my hobby alone.

[bloftin]

Originally Posted by JEB123

Ok, he can do what he wants, but when we can't fly anymore because of a fool like that, then you'll see the pitchforks and torches heading over to his house to kick his ass. Why do you think there are laws? To prevent people from hurting themselves and others and prevent chaos. You have to protect these rights you speak of. You guys just don't seem to understand...your "rights" are only valid until they infringe on mine, and when the legislators DO get involved, we both lose. Several years ago in Miami, some young swimmers were killed by jetskiers coming too close to the shore after many warnings. Now jetskis are banned in the whole of Biscayne Bay all the way down to Key Largo! Sure, you have the "RIGHT" to ride your jetski, just not around here!!!!
Now cut the crap. Go play with muriatic acid or something and leave my hobby alone.

Friend,

Laws don’t prevent death or chaos. I promise... you are still going to get hurt one day, you are defiantly going to die one day (that’s the only guarantee life offers), and there will always be chaos. Nature IS orchestrated chaos, nothing you write down on a piece of paper is going to change that. Only a fool would believe he has control over such things.

The ordinance, law, ban, or whatever it was that the Miami officials put into affect, did not stop people from drowning, or jet ski related deaths (people still drown and jet ski deaths still occur)… So what did it do?… What it did, was make an impression on the general public, the local legislators were working in the interest of the people’s safety... for positive media coverage after an accident. The only thing it "stopped"… was people from making their own choices!

If you want to protect "your hobby", then we need to NOT help legislators incite control over our decisions. Instead of jumping on the bandwagon and trading our freedoms for the idea of safety, we need draw the line and stand together and say “enough! I accept the risk I’m taking and it’s none of your business what danger I present to myself”... Remember?... your legislators work for you! The only reason laws or bans like this get passed (out of ignorance or concealment of facts), is because there are way too many people saying, “stop him, its dangerous”… Instead what we should say is... “BUTT OUT, It’s my choice!”

Now I’ve got to ask… who’s the one that doesn't understand????

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by bloftin

Hmm

Whoa, was that a + or - reaction? Just venting a bit, that was a long thread to read!

[PittJitsu]

Originally Posted by JEB123

Ok, he can do what he wants, but when we can't fly anymore because of a fool like that, then you'll see the pitchforks and torches heading over to his house to kick his ass. Why do you think there are laws? To prevent people from hurting themselves and others and prevent chaos. You have to protect these rights you speak of. You guys just don't seem to understand...your "rights" are only valid until they infringe on mine, and when the legislators DO get involved, we both lose. Several years ago in Miami, some young swimmers were killed by jetskiers coming too close to the shore after many warnings. Now jetskis are banned in the whole of Biscayne Bay all the way down to Key Largo! Sure, you have the "RIGHT" to ride your jetski, just not around here!!!!
Now cut the crap. Go play with muriatic acid or something and leave my hobby alone.

I'm with you on laws. I gave my own self to protect this country but the key difference in your story and this event is that as you mention, innocent unaware people where involuntary involved in thee Jetski accident. This guy is hurting himself.. Maybe his moron relative or friend who filmed it. Can we really police personal activity? I say no. If we do, we are one step closet to Big brother having an egg came mounted in our homes. Its scary enough that the Gov is buying up big business like banks and GM. And lets face it, the Laws, you speak of have been distorted and manipulated to be used as a tool and cash cow more than the quest for consistent peace and decency.

I'm not sure I understand the metaphor here.. So I go and see the local magician catch running chain saws he is juggling... Next week I give it a try while cutting down my pine tree. Who exactly is coming over to Ban the use of chain saws in the name if me being unfit to make my own decisions? Maybe I'm not fit to even buy a chain saw. Perhaps we need lawn mower licensing?

Lastly, Is there not FAR more risk involved when spectators of your flying Assume you have a reasonable degree of control of your model? I see dads holding their kids to view the pretty planes and helis all the time. Is that now FAR more dangerous? Are you not at fault for your ego or shyness for not giving that father a lesson on RC flight and educating him of the risks he faces?

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by PittJitsu

I'm with you on laws. I gave my own self to protect this country but the key difference in your story and this event is that as you mention, innocent unaware people where involuntary involved in thee Jetski accident. This guy is hurting himself.. Maybe his moron relative or friend who filmed it. Can we really police personal activity? I say no. If we do, we are one step closet to Big brother having an egg came mounted in our homes. Its scary enough that the Gov is buying up big business like banks and GM. And lets face it, the Laws, you speak of have been distorted and manipulated to be used as a tool and cash cow more than the quest for consistent peace and decency.

I'm not sure I understand the metaphor here.. So I go and see the local magician catch running chain saws he is juggling... Next week I give it a try while cutting down my pine tree. Who exactly is coming over to Ban the use of chain saws in the name if me being unfit to make my own decisions? Maybe I'm not fit to even buy a chain saw. Perhaps we need lawn mower licensing?

Lastly, Is there not FAR more risk involved when spectators of your flying Assume you have a reasonable degree of control of your model? I see dads holding their kids to view the pretty planes and helis all the time. Is that now FAR more dangerous? Are you not at fault for your ego or shyness for not giving that father a lesson on RC flight and educating him of the risks he faces?

I see your point, and you're right about big brother, we need less government, not more, but it's only getting worse. If you think about it, we already police personal activity, isn't suicide illegal? You don't have the right to end your own life? My real point is if he hurts himself, it could very well hurt the hobby and all those involved because of those lawmakers. I fly at a sanctioned field where non-AMA holding spectators must stay behind a fence a good distance behind the flight lines. That's how it should be everywhere.

[Flexis]

Ever seen this guy

[bloftin]

Originally Posted by JEB123

Whoa, was that a + or - reaction? Just venting a bit, that was a long thread to read!

Is this more along the lines of what you were expecting on post #43?

[PittJitsu]

Originally Posted by JEB123

I see your point, and you're right about big brother, we need less government, not more, but it's only getting worse. If you think about it, we already police personal activity, isn't suicide illegal? You don't have the right to end your own life? My real point is if he hurts himself, it could very well hurt the hobby and all those involved because of those lawmakers. I fly at a sanctioned field where non-AMA holding spectators must stay behind a fence a good distance behind the flight lines. That's how it should be everywhere.

Does it take anything more than $ to join the AMA? I was wondering what you get for the membership? Sounds nice to have set up fields with protection. Lord knows I need it. Learning to hover has been a liability for everyone within a 200 yard distance

[Skarn]

Do you really believe things like that hurt our hobby? Again, did Evel Kneivel hurt the hobby of motorcycles?

Do any stuntment hurt the hobby of whatever they are doing? I mean think about it, skydiving is a legal hobby and people die! Yes, not only those participating either.

Skarn

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by Skarn

Do you really believe things like that hurt our hobby? Again, did Evel Kneivel hurt the hobby of motorcycles?

Do any stuntment hurt the hobby of whatever they are doing? I mean think about it, skydiving is a legal hobby and people die! Yes, not only those participating either.

Skarn

Funny Skarn, I was going to mention sky diving earlier. Hey Bloftin, thanks for keeping it "friend"ly, it's nice to "converse" rather than argue with intelligent people. Hey, I'm man enough to admit I may be wrong. In fact, I'm a bit shaken from this thread, I'm just trying and I can't honestly say I see a right or wrong side, seems like everybody makes a valid point. Wow. Ok, going back, we're talking about rights, is it right for the jetski guys to infringe on the 3 ft. shallow water of the beach when they have the entire ocean to ride? See what I'm saying? How about the swimmer's rights? Who decides who is in the right? It's the old "I disagree with what you say, but will fight to the death to defend your right to say it" line.
BTW I believe you get 2.5 million dollars worth of liability insurance for open membership and half a million on the new park pilot program in case you hit someone with your chopper or plank as a member of AMA. I sincerely believe ya gotta have rules to prevent chaos, or at least minimize accidents. Unfortunately, too much freedom can be a bad thing, from past experience it's known you can't give people a finger, cause they'll take your whole arm. Skarn, are you the one who says "we'll agree to disagree"?
Here's the AMA info, check it out...
http://www.modelaircraft.org/parkflyer.aspx

Happy flying guys!!!

[Skarn]

Hey Jeb,

I too see both sides for sure! Do I think the guy did a smart thing? Heck no! But I guess like some said, a lot of people do stupid things...it's their "right" to lol.

It is indeed a catch-22...I guess I just don't think it's going to harm any image of our hobby....I think most people know that no matter what the hobby/sport/activity there will be idiots! And what some call stupid, others call daring. I personally would never free climb (mountain/rock climb without any rope/protection)...however it's an accepted form of the sport and is televised. I have done rock climbing with full gear....and there are people that think even that is stupid.

Oh well...but yes Jeb, I have no problem saying "we'll agree to disagree" about anything...but I think we are in agreement on this one....agree? LOL.

Skarn

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by Skarn

Hey Jeb,

I too see both sides for sure! Do I think the guy did a smart thing? Heck no! But I guess like some said, a lot of people do stupid things...it's their "right" to lol.

It is indeed a catch-22...I guess I just don't think it's going to harm any image of our hobby....I think most people know that no matter what the hobby/sport/activity there will be idiots! And what some call stupid, others call daring. I personally would never free climb (mountain/rock climb without any rope/protection)...however it's an accepted form of the sport and is televised. I have done rock climbing with full gear....and there are people that think even that is stupid.

Oh well...but yes Jeb, I have no problem saying "we'll agree to disagree" about anything...but I think we are in agreement on this one....agree? LOL.

Skarn

You betcha. It's no wonder this world is so messed up!

[major alvega]

Another video with my good friend Pedro Matos he on 2:39 to 3:45 during a indoor meeting doing one off those stunt things, in this case wiht a shock flyer. He is not a fool fella only have a lot of years of experience doing..... foolish things


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqZDG...layer_embedded


Please do not try this at home.
Go Pedro

[Luisx]

master Pedro Matos

3 Parte Indor CAS (4 min 25 sec)

[Sonny]

Too many laws as it is. Ya can't even fart without someone suing ya for air polution. People only need to be held responsible for there actions when it affects others. Even more anoying is all the shoulds and shouldn'ts people lay on each other. If the guy gets his kicks catching helicopters, then let him do it...It's a hobby....All the retoric over what might happen will only cut into your freadoms. The shoot all german babies incase they might become natzis kind of thing. After all...Ya might cut your hand off catching that thing.....

[rjbsilva]

Hi guys,

I just found this post today. And because I'm the cameraman behind this video feel free to post your questions.

Originally Posted by Jasmine2501

Well he is clearly using Helicommand or something like that... but the HK450 is actually a pretty good clone. Except for the plastic head block, it's a Trex 450 SA.

No helicommand on there. Believe me.

Originally Posted by joediamond

It's also possible that the heli is actually being flown by someone off camera and he's just holding the radio as a prop.

No, it's really that radio on the movie that is controlling the heli. And once more, i swear it's the truth.

Originally Posted by rdlohr

As crazy as he is, at least he's only putting himself (and the cameraman) in danger.

Well, i didn't felt in danger. The movie has some zoom on it. But most important, when you see Pedro flying you feel his controlling the machine. I personally have more fear from guys doing 3D. Pedro's flight its smooth and you can predict what the heli going to do. I cannot say the same for 3D. And about Pedro Matos, he have about 10 years of flying. There's a lot of experience behind that flight. But nonetheless of course there's danger in there. As i've already said to Pedro, a mecanic failure on those ocassions can be disastrous.

I leave you another video from that night

Playing around with the HK450 (1 min 20 sec)

Regards,

RS

[Jasmine2501]

Helicopter blades moving at 200 + mph do not care about how many years of experience you have. This would be an unacceptable risk for me.

[JEB123]

Originally Posted by Jasmine2501

Helicopter blades moving at 200 + mph do not care about how many years of experience you have. This would be an unacceptable risk for me.

Yep, and he says he himself told Pedro "a mechanical failure would be disastrous", apparently that fell on deaf ears. Some people are like kids, no matter how much experience you try to convey, they simply have to find out for themselves how dangerous something really is. That's why each generation of mankind has been doomed to repeat history over and over. It's that "you don't know sh*t, watch me" attitude.

[Jasmine2501]

Well the silly thing about experience is... I don't really need to have my finger chopped off to know that it's a Bad Thing.

This guy can do whatever he wants, but for me this would not be acceptable behavior.