Kontronic Jazz ESC on Mini titan

[patrickvdb]

Hello,

A newbie question:

as probably read in another post, I fried my standard ESC which came with the Titan and have now purchased a Kontronic Jazz ESC.

I programmed it into Heli Mode, that's it.

Now, the titan behaves very different then with the standard ESC.
When giving a little throttle stick, the motor starts spinning up to high speed, once the speed is up, I give little more stick and up she goes....so far so good.

But when I try to land again, I don't hear the motor go down in RPM as it did with the standard ESC.
It only goes down when my stick is really really low and then there is the danger of bringing the stick to the lowest point, because when the motor cuts, the ESC will do a soft start.

So I land with lots of RPM. Its like landing in IDLE1 instead of hoover mode. The landing is much more hard, because a very small change immediatly reflects in lots of down thrust.

I don't feel much, if any, difference between IDLE1 and HOOVER mode.
as I did with the old ESC.

Is this normal? or should I change stuff on the ESC?

In hoover mode the RPM should go down when negative pitch is issues or not?

Also, my battery is getting much hotter and the flight time has gone down to 6 minutes instead of 8+

I don't know if this is good, because it is so much different then before.

My curves are like this:

Throttle HOOVER:
0 45 65 85 100
Pitch HOOVER
40 - 75 - 95

Throttle IDLE1
65 56 66 - 100
Pitch IDLE1
40 - 75 - 95

Thanks

[patrickvdb]

Or perhaps I have a problem with the initialization of the ESC on startup.
Here is an abstract of the manual, the section in Italic/Bold confuses me.
I don't really understand what they mean.

Do I have to select the maximum RPM on initial startup? I don't get it.
I didn't move the throttle to full on start-up. I just bring it to about 30% until the motor is spun up.
I don't get it... perhaps anybody can shed a light here!


Manual abstract:

In Heli-Mode the Jazz operates with active RPM control. This means, that the motor
RPM will be kept constant and changes of the load and the falling battery voltage
will be compensated, as long as the motor and battery capacity allows this. So it’s
not necessary to use any mixer in the Tx to stabilize the RPM. This RPM control
works only if the speed controller is mounted in the helicopter. With no load its
possible that the speed controller jerks.
Just plug the receiver cable of the Jazz in a free slot of the Rx which can be
independently operated from the Tx with a slider. Program the Jazz to Heli-Mode
using this slider.

To start the motor push the slider towards full throttle. The Jazz will ramp up the
motor RPM in a few seconds in open mode. When the designated RPM is reached
the Jazz switches over to close loop speed. The more the slider position comes to
full throttle, the higher is the designated motor RPM.

With the slider back in motor-off position the motor will be switched off. Be aware
not to do so in flight, otherwise it would take some long seconds to start the motor
again.
The range of RPM selected by the slider is self adjusted by the Jazz. Its done when
the motor is started for the first time after the battery is connected.
There is a check whether the battery, the motor, the gear ratio and the helicopter
are fitting well together: with the lowest possible RPM which can be selected after
the Jazz has adjusted, it should not be possible to hover the helicopter. If its
possible, the Jazz is operating out of it’s limit and can be destroyed! Use a higher
gear ratio or a motor with less RPM and more torque.

[fixxxer]

Looking at the kontronic manual the heli mode is always running in govenor so you can't use a variable throttle curve as the governor would not function correctly. This is the most economical way of running your motor but set idle up 1 to 100% flat line. This is the cause of your overheating temp.

Leave normal as it is so you can connect your batt up safely but once your spool up begins then just flick to idle up 1 and use this for your hovering aswell.

I haven't used one personally but did set one up a while back for a friend, perhaps somebody else can tell you if I'm sending you on the right track.

Folks ?

[fixxxer]

The 4 lines of text in bold black from the extract of the manual is meaning once the ESC has been setup. So you need to let the head spool up fully before taking off.

[sun_E]

Not sure about the Jazz, but last time I set up a new ESC, I had to move the throttle stick to full and back (motor unplugged) so it could set the throttle range. Does the Jazz need this? I could imagine strange behaviour if throttle range was wrongly set.

[Gus]

sun_E
In Auto Program Mode (Mode 1), the connections sequence is:
a) Switch on the Tx and Rx
b) Set the throttle control to off
c) Connect the battery to the Jazz speed controller
d) Give 1 sec. full throttle or start with full throttle.
e) Ready to fly.

In Heli Mode (4), which I use, I set my Normal Throttle curve to (0-nn-nn-nn-nn) for spool up, where nn is the throttle setting that will give me the governed HS that I want (nn = 80 on one bird, and 85 on another). Once spooled up, I switch to Idle 1 which has a flat line at the point that I want it. i.e. 80 on one bird, and 85 on another.

Just one way to do it.


Gus...

[fixxxer]

Sounds like you can't use it with a normal linear throttle curve then if I understand correctly ?

[Gus]

fixxxer,
Sure you can, just run in APM mode instead of Heli Mode. In APM mode, you use normal throttle curves, or you can use an e-Multgov if you wish. Whatever suits your style of flying.
Gus...

[fixxxer]

Thanks Gus,

I was reading it wrong then ! not got one but it doesn't hurt to know for future reference.

[Gus]

fixxxer,

I've tried Jeti, Hacker, Castle, etc put much prefer the Kontronik. I like the Kontronik ESCs well enough that thats all I use on my Helis and Orthinopters.

Gus...

[noguy]

Originally Posted by patrickvdb

My curves are like this:

Throttle HOOVER:
0 45 65 85 100
Pitch HOOVER
40 - 75 - 95

Throttle IDLE1
65 56 66 - 100
Pitch IDLE1
40 - 75 - 95

Thanks

I would think you would want something more like this:

Throttle HOOVER:
0 75 75 75 75
Pitch HOOVER
40 - 75 - 95

Throttle IDLE1
85 85 85 85 85
Pitch IDLE1
0 - 50 - 100

I am not familiar with your esc. The exact numbers depend entirey on your setup. I would follow the manual through a full setup. Mainly just make sure the gov has proper headroom with your desired headspeed.

[LITHIUMSTATIC]

I would like to try a Jazz ESC.

[fixxxer]

Originally Posted by Gus

fixxxer,

I've tried Jeti, Hacker, Castle, etc put much prefer the Kontronik. I like the Kontronik ESCs well enough that thats all I use on my Helis and Orthinopters.

Gus...

I've had a Phoenix 35 from the start in an X400, it's now over 2 years old & in My Titan but never had a problem with it. When it does pack up tho I may consider the Jazz. The price tag just seemd a bit hefty when I was first starting out.