GT-5 Gyro Touch Flybarless System

[NitroAl]

Why can't you use the gyro gain channel? That's how I set mine up!
I don't know if you can assign a switch for different gain settings like I have in my DSX11 but you could set it up so you have say 60% in normal 85% in idle1 and 100% in idle2 just for the initial set up procedure so you can find the optimal gain!

[mrultralite]

Yes there's something about that in the manual , just not sure how yet.

[superflY851]

I thought that was strange also. The manual says that when using the satellite receivers, the 7th channel is for total gain. But you only need 6 channels for an electric heli. You could just use a normal receiver and it's a non issue or just pick up a used DX7 for cheap.

I'm using mine on a nitro with a normal receiver and my 7th channel is for my governor so i can't test it.

[Stolla]

Mine is on gyro channel and linked with id ups same as normal gyro

[seemore74]

Ok, got my GT5 the other day & have her pretty much setup, ive discovered using futaba Sbus Rx, my tail gyro is on chnl7 which forces me to use chnl7 end point adjust in my Tx to control gyro gain.
Is there any way of putting gyro gain on chnl5 in the GT5 so that I can control tail gain in my gyro menu on my Tx (Futaba 10c)?

[HeliBenj]

On the 8FG I cna re-assign any function to any channel, not sure if this is posible on the 10C? Alternatively on channel 7 can't you just assign "GYRO"? Sorry don't konw the 10C
Also be aware the gain on channel 7 is total gain, it will effect tail gain and cyclic gain proportionnally. This is meant to have different gains for different headspeeds.
Of course you can use it to find your tail gain at first and just ignore main gain, once you're happy with the gain at certain headspeed check the number of total gain on the unit. If you get say 50% on the unit where you are happy and the P gain in tail PID menu is 80% then your gain for tail is 40%. You can then out 40% as P gain and up total gain to 100% for this headspeed. Then if you use a faster headspeed just tweak total gain for that headspeed (lower total gain) and vice versa.
Hope I did not confuse you more

[seemore74]

: confused: I'll look into this further & I should get it then.
It does seem like a very promising FBL unit though.

[HeliBenj]

Also if you can't use the gyro menu you can still use end points on channel 7 to effect gain. Just check on the gt5 display that it actually moves as you move endpoints

[seemore74]

Ok, another question, if chnl7 on the GT5 is for proportional gain between tail & head (if i'm correct that is) then is chnl5 on the GT5 used for tail gain as normal?
my reason for this is that i've tried adjusting gyro gain in my Tx gyro menu (futaba 10c) & i cannot see any difference with + & - values (for rate & Hhold normally) on the GT5 display or with it's reaction (tail slider going to center in rate & staying put in Hhold)

[Stolla]

There is no tail gain only, only overall gain and it's just useful for setup as you want to run overall at 100 percent anyway

[HeliBenj]

I use it for different gains at different headspeeds too, great results

[seemore74]

Originally Posted by Stolla

There is no tail gain only, only overall gain and it's just useful for setup as you want to run overall at 100 percent anyway

So how can that be a good thing? especially with the many varying heli mechanics & tail servos out there, surely you will end up with say, the gain value on the tail great but the gain value on the head needing adjusting which if you do you'll now mess up the feel you had on the tail.Man I wish i knew this before i got this unit, oh well i'll continue tweaking to see if i can get it locked in as at the moment the tail seems not solid & crisp & it seems to slightly over shoot on the stop. The same for the cyclic, if you aileron bank it and stop it seems to not stop accurately. Any suggestions guys?

[jockstrap]

Originally Posted by Stolla

There is no tail gain only, only overall gain and it's just useful for setup as you want to run overall at 100 percent anyway

Not true.. there are separate gains for tail and cyclic and an overall gain..

Both the tail and cyclics have their own dedicated PID values you can change and then a "total gain" of 100 reflects 100% of the 2 individual "P" gains.

Changing the "total gain" by a given percentage results in a corresponding percentage change in the "P" value of both the tail and the cyclics.

eg: if P (gain) for tail is 50 and P (gain) for cyclic is 80... if you reduce the "total gain" buy 10% then tail becomes 45 and cyclic becomes 72. Likewise if you increase "total gain" by 10% then tail gain becomes 55 and cyclic gain becomes 88 - 10% change in the separate "P" values..

If you wish to change tail gain and not cyclic, you simply change the "P" value of the tail, and visa-versa - and leave "total gain" untouched.

Hope this helps clear it up... not make it more confusing..

[jockstrap]

Originally Posted by seemore74

So how can that be a good thing? especially with the many varying heli mechanics & tail servos out there, surely you will end up with say, the gain value on the tail great but the gain value on the head needing adjusting which if you do you'll now mess up the feel you had on the tail.Man I wish i knew this before i got this unit, oh well i'll continue tweaking to see if i can get it locked in as at the moment the tail seems not solid & crisp & it seems to slightly over shoot on the stop. The same for the cyclic, if you aileron bank it and stop it seems to not stop accurately. Any suggestions guys?

I've found the gains on the GT5 need to be a lot higher than you would set on normal gyros..

I would;

1) set total gain to 100%
2) set tail and cyclic "P" values to maybe somewhere in the 80's
3) set the "I" value at least 10% lower for each
4) test fly - lower the corresponding "P" if any oscillations
5) increase or decrease "total gain" 5% at a time and determine the desired effect on just tail or cyclic - but one at a time untill you are a little happier with them - record the "total gain" setting at that time. It may be different when testing tail and cyclic
6) set "total gain" back to 100% and adjust the individual "P" values by the percentage increase/decrease in "total gain" that was needed to make them happy.
7) test fly again - repeat till crisp..

as far as bounce-back and things like that - you'll need to the play with corresponding "I" and "D" values..

I'm no "fine tuning" expert but give that method a try.. can't hurt I guess..

PS: the 5% in step 5 is a guideline - when fine tuning it may be as little as "1%"

[seemore74]

"I see" said the blind man, very good explanation jock that makes things a lot clearer to me now. I guess you could say the developers basically use different terms for the various parameters than i'm used to on a FBL system. I will give the procedure you described above a try when the weather gets better & hopefully i'll get my Srimok flying sweet.
Oh, i don't know if you use a futaba radio but does that mean that adjusting tail P value cannot be controlled by my normal gyro menu in my Tx?

[HeliBenj]

Nope, afaik only total gain can be adjusted through a channel, and this channel is channel 7 for me using sbus.
Remember Your gyro menu does nothing more than adjusting a value on a given channel, normally channel 5. If you can reassign your gyro menu to work with channel 7 then your gyro menu will control total gain.

[seemore74]

Aah, once again the blind man sees the light. Correct me if i'm wrong here boys, so once i've got P gain on both cyclic & rudder to where i want them if say i upped my h speed i can now use chnl7 (total gain) to adjust both rudder & cyclic down a percentage at the same time, right? but in my case of the 10c radio i can't assign chnl7 to my gyro menu & control total gain there, i'll have to go into aux channel & assign a switch then one side of the switch will have say a high value & the other a low value that i can now switch between if i like, that is.
I am now looking into a 12FG or maybe the 8FG radio as my next purchase then.

[HeliBenj]

yep, got it right

[seemore74]

Cool, thanks for the education boys, that's what it's about, "Fun, Learning, Friendship & Mutual Resspect.
Now i can honestly say i can't wait to go tweak this thing

[Stolla]

I assumed you meant adjustment of tail gain only on tx, that you can't do, obviously the manual shows how to set the current gains on tail and swash again I assumed you knew that, so apologies for not being clear in my answer
If I can suggest you read swalkos tweak guide for some good info