Smallest available Nitro Align

[Mitch Booth]

Hi Everyone,

Newbie here for the most part. I've been flying a Blade Nano and Blade 230 now for a few months. Picked up the hobby in August after watching Dunken Boisson perform at Flite Fest.

My question is, What is the smallest available Align Nitro helicopter available? What suppliers do you recommend here in the States? I know I'm a ways off from buying a bigger bird but I'm becoming quite comfortable in hovering in all orientations and doing backward upright circles both CW and CCW. I know the the nitro stuff is much more of a pain to deal with in comparison to the electric but I do love the smoke and smell of Nitro. I do not see many people still flying the nitro's but then again I do not go to many heli fly-ins.

Thanks for any information you can provide. I just wanted to look to see what is available.

Mitch

[BrokeDad]

I'm not 100% sure but I think the smallest Align nitro was the 600N. If you want a really small nitro there is the Gaui NX4. Those show up in the for sale section occasionally.
Older flybarred nitros can be had dirt cheap. Some like the Hirobo Shuttle still have a FBL conversion kit available. I bought one of those for $225 RTF with DX6i but haven't converted it.

[Mitch Booth]

Originally Posted by BrokeDad

I'm not 100% sure but I think the smallest Align nitro was the 600N. If you want a really small nitro there is the Gaui NX4. Those show up in the for sale section occasionally.
Older flybarred nitros can be had dirt cheap. Some like the Hirobo Shuttle still have a FBL conversion kit available. I bought one of those for $225 RTF with DX6i but haven't converted it.

Is Align one of the better brands out there? Any recommendations of where to buy in the states?

Mitch

[BrokeDad]

I only own the one nitro and it's old although mine was built new. I'm sure one of the nitro guys knows what ones are currently available in kits. If you don't want to build you will need to buy used.

Take a look here:

https://www.amainhobbies.com/search?s=nitro+heli+kit

[Waxxingibbous]

Gaul nx4 is probably the best bet.

Banggood sells this cheap alternative build. Couldn't comment on the quality. It's cheap though http://www.banggood.com/Global-Eagle...p-1040940.html

[smwht]

Originally Posted by Waxxingibbous

Gaul nx4 is probably the best bet.

Banggood sells this cheap alternative build. Couldn't comment on the quality. It's cheap though http://www.banggood.com/Global-Eagle...p-1040940.html

Also available RTF here http://www.buddyrc.com/global-eagle-...elicopter.html

[lycokayaker]

nitro's are a blast. I have a bunch of them and love them. It helps to have friends or fellow pilots you fly with who have them who can teach you the ropes of tuning them and all the over goodies. I have had both the Gaui NX4 and the trex 600. I still have the trex 600 and ended up selling the gaui not because it was a bad heli but because I enjoy flying bigger heli's and have the space to fly them. The NX4s are a small compact heli and can be found like mentioned on the classifieds side. Another option is to pick up a brand new kit and build it out and source a motor new or used in the classifieds. Mine typically got a 5:30 flight time. Trex 600's are almost always available to be bought. My 600's get about 8-9 flights.

[Thestructured]

Nitro is awesome. There's a fun factor I don't get with my electrics.

Align only ever made a 600 and 700 nitro. You can find either one used for very cheap (well that's relative). Parts are plentiful and pretty cheap as well. A 600 will give you better fuel economy/more flights per gallon. If you ever go to a fun fly there are tons of nitros at them, people love to show off with them.

As long as you don't mind taking some extra time to learn how to set it up and maintain it, it's really not that difficult.

[2slow2g]

I'm working on my first nitro. A nx5. Stretched nx4 with nx5 tail parts and an OS .55.

[Mitch Booth]

Is the power difference significantly less than electric or are they relatively close?

Mitch

[ticedoff8]

Education time:
In electrics, it is easy to measure power: Amps x Volts = Watts
In IC (Internal Combustion) engines, it is (Torque x RPM) / 5,252 = Horsepower

1 Horsepower = 746 watts

A typical 6S LiPo setup on a 600 size heli will generate around 2200 watts (about 3HP). This is using an Align BL600MX 1220kV motor

A typical 12S LiPo setup on the same 600 heli will generate around 5500 watts (about 7.3HP) using an Align BL600MX 510kV motor.

An OS 55HZ-R will generate around 2HP (1500 watts)

The IC motor are not close to electrics

[2slow2g]

Nitro helis are generally much lighter than their electric counterparts so a little more math is involved to find the power to weight ratio.

[ticedoff8]

Nitro helis are generally much lighter than their electric counterparts so a little more math is involved to find the power to weight ratio.

Nope.
My T700N weighs around 12lbs ready to fly
My buddy's T700E (12S) all weigh about 12 lbs ready to fly.

The big difference is the T700E has peak power for the first 60 seconds and the power continues to drop until the end of the flight.
But the weight stays the same from begging to end.
This means you program yourself for the extreme hard core 3D within the first 2 minutes and then start managing collective a little more and go for the more graceful part of your routine.

The T700N has peak power throughout the flight from beginning to end and gets lighter as the fuel burns off.
This means you program your routine in reverse of the electric.
Fly the graceful stuff early and as fuel burns off, get nasty.

But, the reality is that the T700E with a BL850MX on 12S is running about 12HP vs the T700N running a YS120SR-X which peaks around 4HP.
Everything else is about equal.
You really don't have to factor in anything more that that.

[smwht]

That's really heavy for a nitro, mine are closer to 10.5-11lb.

[2slow2g]

Yeah I was under the impression most Nitro 700's were 2-3lbs lighter. 10lbs rtf as an example with a 4hp engine is 2.5 lbs per hp. An electric 700 at 12.5 lbs with a motor rated at 5000 watts continuous is around 1.8 lbs per hp.

[ticedoff8]

I would love to see a picture of your 10lbs "RTF" T700 Nitro with a 4HP motor and 22oz of fuel (660cc fuel tank).
It sounds cool, but I would classify this as "Fake News".

I'll show you mine:



As you may notice, there is no fuel. Add some fuel, and it is in the 12 1/2lbs to 13lbs range "RTF" as you like to say.
BTW: That is is a YS 120SR-X.
As they like to say: There is no replacement for displacement.

But, there are few helicopters where you can do an "apples to apples" comparison.
Align is one.
I don't have a picture of a T700 E with 12S packs, but I do have a T600 Nitro (cut down to 550mm) and a T600 E Pro 12S.

Nitro:

No Fuel - around 9lbs. Add 550cc of fuel, and you are in the 10lbs range.
And, this is a 550mm tailboom, so I could cut a lot of the nose weight out from when it was a 600mm tailboom.
And, it is running SAB 540 blades - but there are three.
But, it is a YS60SR - so it does weigh a little more than a garden variety OS 55.



Now, the 600E Pro with 12S - BTW: There are 3300mAh packs. The 3700mAh are heavier





I have been doing this for a while.
I am sure there are lighter 700 size nitro helicopters.
A buddy of mine has a Gaui NX7. It is listed at 9.6lbs as a bare airframe.
His flies at 11 1/2 lbs.
And that is using a YS 91SR - which is NOT a 4HP motor. A 4HP motor would be a YS 120SR-X with pipe. Which ads more weight.
But, it flies great!

Please, feel free to post pictures of you nitro helis on a scale so we can see their weights

[smwht]

Not gonna pretend my scale is as accurate as yours, but it's what I have...

Protos RTF (12s5000):


Trex700n partly fueled:


This much fuel (That's what's left from full after flying 6 minutes. If I had to guess, RTF would be another 12-ish oz):


N7 empty:


That said, I put the canopy on the N7 and tried again, and that also showed 10.4lb. Weighing myself with and without the N7 (canopy on) puts it around 10lb flat. Didn't do that with the trex because I have yet to fly it with the canopy... Both nitros have an OS105HZ-R + powerboost pipe, 2s5000 receiver pack (claimed 200g) FWIW my NX7 was noticeably heavier than the N7 or the 700N - maybe 1/2 lb?

If you have a recommendation for a better scale in the 0-20lb (ish) range, I'd appreciate it and I'd be happy to re-weigh with that. Most of the kitchen scales only go to 5kg.

Edit: apparently I didn't look very hard before, have a postal scale coming. I'll get more accurate weights when it shows up.

[ELuo]

Originally Posted by Mitch Booth

Hi Everyone,

Newbie here for the most part. I've been flying a Blade Nano and Blade 230 now for a few months. Picked up the hobby in August after watching Dunken Boisson perform at Flite Fest.

My question is, What is the smallest available Align Nitro helicopter available? What suppliers do you recommend here in the States? I know I'm a ways off from buying a bigger bird but I'm becoming quite comfortable in hovering in all orientations and doing backward upright circles both CW and CCW. I know the the nitro stuff is much more of a pain to deal with in comparison to the electric but I do love the smoke and smell of Nitro. I do not see many people still flying the nitro's but then again I do not go to many heli fly-ins.

Thanks for any information you can provide. I just wanted to look to see what is available.

Mitch

Hi Mitch, I am in a new Canadian based rc company that is working hard aiming to grow the heli coummunity by bringing easily accessible entry level "pro" style Ready to Fly model helis to the market. One of the products we are bringing is a 450L sized rtf nitro model. Aiming for spring 2017 release with local stock and service. Hopefully we will hit the time window

[smwht]

Re-weighed on the new scale. First the same as before:
Empty N7:

Empty N7 with canopy:

Partially full 700N:



Then went and filled the tanks:
Full N7:

Full 700N:


So I'd have to say 10.5-11lb is about right for mine. (N7 w/ canopy would be 11lb, 2oz, fwiw)

[ticedoff8]

What does an E7 with 690mm blades and 12S LiPo weigh ready to fly?

That is really the point.

You have proven that a N7 is lighter than a T700N.
We kind of already knew that.

I have proven that a T600E weighs about the same as a T600N

I also checked some T700E and know they weigh about the same as my T700N

The statement being made was "A nitro weighs less than an electric"

My statement is "The same helicopter weighs about the same whether nitro or electric."