CopterX 450se v2-1st build

[highrpm666]

Hi, This is my build thread for my CopterX 450se v2. This is my 4th heli but, the first non-rtf/bnf kit I've ever had. I started flying heli's this Feb and began with a Blade Msr. I quickly got tired of that and purchased a Blade Sr to learn cp. I also bought Clearview and a Dx6i shortly after. Long story short I fell in love with the 450's on Clearview and decided I needed one, I went with a v2 clone after doing much reading here and decided it was the the most cost effective route I could take. I have already built the helicopter and I plan on sharing all the little problems and tasks I went through as best I can.

Electronics:
I purchased all of the electronics after doing a lot more reading and ended up with this.

Sonix black 3500kv motor
Align 35amp esc
3 Hitec hs-65mg's
Hitec Hg5000/5083 gyro combo
Spektrum Ar110e receiver (using a Dx6i)
Hyperion 2200 35c batt

The building process:
Overall the build went very well. Before assembly I took a fine file to the edges of the carbon fiber parts as they were rough and I didn't approve. I began by installing the servo's. This is where I ran into my first issue. The servo holes in the chassis were a bit too small for the 65mg's and I had to use my file and remove some material on the ends of each servo hole till they slid into the chassis plates nicely. This also made the chassis plates look better and cleaned up the bad looking cuts of carbon fiber. Before slapping the two sides of the chassis together I removed and thread locked each screw and also installed the motor into the mount, this was done so I wouldn't have to struggle lining up the motor mount screws with the chassis together. I also replaced the main gears/hub, main shaft, feathering shaft and thrust bearings with Align parts before assembling the chassis(more on this later) and I had completely rebuilt the head and tail using thread locker and measured out the links with a digital caliper.

Here is a pic of the chassis assembled with servo's and motor:


I then installed the boom along with the supports and fins. The tail took a little while to figure out. I got the belt twisted wrong a few times and ended up tearing it back apart to get everything right. I then went on to installing the esc/receiver. I had a little trouble figuring out how do this. I ended up with the esc on the front and the receiver in the rear. The motor I used has very stiff wires that didn't want to cooperate and I wound up routing them outside the right side of the chassis. I used padding tape on the chassis where the wires touch to avoid chaffing also. I routed the two front servo wires the best I could.

This is what the motor/servo wires look like now:


I then installed the gyro and tail servo. I stuck the gyro to the bottom of the boom block with the included Hitec d/s tape. I installed the servo in the wrong holes the first time and it was in the way of the flybar, so I moved it out on the mount and rotated it out of the way.

Gyro and servo:


I then installed the receiver and somewhat finished the wiring. I put the receiver inside on the right side chassis plate to try and make the wiring look a little cleaner. I finished up with baby yellow zip ties.

Receiver placement:


I then setup the dx6i and bound it to the heli. The initial ccpm setup went fairly smoothly and I got it close to where it needed to be but, this is where I have had the most trouble and I'll get into it more later on.

Now I'm going to list every Align part I used and give a short explanation why:

I purchased the main gear/hub/owb before getting the kit because I heard that the CopterX parts weren't that great.
I replaced the servo ball-links because the included ones didn't look very nice.
I replaced the feathering shaft because one of the bolts snapped when disassembling the head
I replaced the thrust bearings because they were missing balls
I replaced the grip bearings because they were sloppy
I replaced the main shaft when tracking down vibrations
I replaced the tail shaft and pulley because it was bent.
I replaced the landing gear to match my canopy
I replaced the swash because mine was very sloppy on the main shaft
I replaced the upper links with fixed links to simplify setup, they fit much better than the CopterX links.
I replaced the blades with Align 325pro woodies cause the CopterX blades look to be very low quality

I really didn't need to replace everything I did, most of the CopterX stuff seems to be as good as the Align stuff.

CCPM setup:

This was easy at first but after many attempts I continued to end up with unequal pitch range. I am still in the process of getting all the kinks worked out. I am now using Align fixed link as mention earlier and I should have the unequal pitch issue resolved next time I tinker around. It flies perfect for now with the +10/-11 range. Radio setup was fairly easy though. I have just purchased the new Dx6i with DsmX and it had two new blade 450 profiles in it from the factory. I copied and went through it to make it work for me. Everything was almost perfect and required very little modification to get working properly.

Edit: Stayed up a little late playing with the swash height and decided to pull out my caliper and a 10mm hex wrench. my swash was 9.55mm above the bearing block. I adjusted it to 10mm and set 0 pitch at midstick and also leveled the swash perfectly with the caliper. I now have even pitch range! I put my swash mix at 72% and have +10/-10 with room for about 2 more degrees. Thanks to Gpraceman for his 10mm swash/bearing block gap tip!

Gyro and tail servo setup:

Thank you Finless! I got it setup in a very short time thanks to finless's hg5000-combo setup vids! This gyro seems to hold great and the stops are fairly crisp. The tail on this thing is night and day compared to the Blade heli's I own! The setup process for this gyro is a little lengthy but it is well worth it and is going to work great for a sport flier like me. Setting up in rate mode and moving the servo up and down the tail was tedious and I eventually fine tuned by adjusting the rod a turn. And like in Bob's video I switch over to HH and it holds great. This process did take about 5 packs and I'm sure I could do it in two now.

Maiden flight video:[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7A8QgQYcyI[/ame]

More pics, the most current ones show it with the yellow canopy/landing gear. Couldn't stand the blue anymore!











So far the heli has left the ground 10 times, 5 of which were full pack hovers. This will be a continuing journal of this heli.

edit: (16) flights on this heli as of 4/9/11

[Vuhuyhoang]

The new dx6i got different color ?

[gpraceman]

She's looking very nice.

Originally Posted by highrpm666

Edit: Stayed up a little late playing with the swash height and decided to pull out my caliper and a 10mm hex wrench. my swash was 9.55mm above the bearing block. I adjusted it to 10mm and set 0 pitch at midstick and also leveled the swash perfectly with the caliper. I now have even pitch range! I put my swash mix at 72% and have +10/-10 with room for about 2 more degrees. Thanks to Gpraceman for his 10mm swash/bearing block gap tip!

I'm glad that you got that worked out. I've got my swash mix at 80% and am getting about +11/-11.

Originally Posted by highrpm666

I used padding tape on the chassis where the wires touch to avoid chaffing also.

Where did you find that tape? I should probably put some on my frame to keep from chaffing the ESC and motor wires.

Originally Posted by highrpm666

I replaced the blades with Align 325pro woodies cause the CopterX blades look to be very low quality

I was going to cut my teeth on the CopterX woodies and then get some of the inexpensive CF blades from HobbyPartz. They have very good reviews.

Originally Posted by highrpm666

More pics, the most current ones show it with the yellow canopy/landing gear. Couldn't stand the blue anymore!

What type of paint did you use for that? I was thinking of repainting mine too, for better visibility against the sky.

[highrpm666]

I am very glad I finally figured out the unequal pitch issue and couldn't have done it without knowing about the 10mm gap trick! Thanks again!

The padded tape came with the CopterX kit I think, or I had it sitting around and somehow it made its way into the heli box. Not quite sure. It was a piece about 1 1/2" by 3" and was enough for all the area's I needed to cover.

I am too considering some true carbon fiber blades. I'm running the 12t pinion which puts me a hair above max rpm for the woodies(~3000 +/-100 or so according to readyheli's calc). I plan on doing a lot more homework on blades before choosing a set. I would like to find the highest quality carbon blades I can, being close to balanced out of the package would be nice! I really haven't looked into this yet at all though.

The paint I used was Parma r/c car & truck body paint. I already threw away the can so I couldn't tell you which yellow it was but, it sure came out nice. I masked it with blue painters tape and really didn't expect it to turn out this well.

Oh also, I have never seen an older dx6i, I wouldn't know if they changed the color

Edit: I went out and hovered a pack in my backyard this evening after the wind died down and now my tail isn't holding very well. Its holding ok in rate mode but not in HH anymore. It was drifting badly, stops were sloppy and the rudder was very touchy. I'm going to go back through gyro setup again if turning up the gain doesn't fix the issue. I'm a little sad cause it was working great before. I was planning on getting this thing out of my backyard and to the field in the next few days and I hope this doesn't put a damper on things for me.

[highrpm666]

I figured out that my tail slider was binding slightly causing my tail to be very uncontrollable. I applied some lubricant and it freed up considerably. I test flew it and the drifting has vanished.

I finally got a chance to take it to the field yesterday, wind was calm in the evening. I jumped right into forward flight and I am so impressed with the stability of this thing. I was doing fast passes and sharp banked turns within just a minute or two on the first pack. I had it in low rates for about 30 seconds before I decided it wasn't responsive enough.

I have it setup with 100%dr and 25%expo now and its ok yet I will need it to be much more responsive very soon. I have my flybar weights all the way out too, I know this effects it alot.. I have my swash mix set per finless's vids and the plastic meets the flat part of the metal ball at full tilt in all directions. It just feels a little sluggish compared to my sim and other heli's. I would not even attempt a roll or flip with it responding this slowly as it would crash to the ground before executing the maneuver.


Question..If I move the flybar weights all the way in in how much faster will my cyclic respond? And what about removing them completely? Should I leave the weights and crank up my ail/elev swash mix slightly?


Overall I am just floored with the performance of this thing in comparison to the rest of my fleet. Its totally awesome. The sound it makes when zooming by at 30+mph is just so cool. The tail is rock solid compared to anything I have ever flown. The adrenaline rush and dumb grin I get during my 5min flight is priceless!

[highrpm666]

Anybody? Can anyone please answer my fly-bar weight questions?

[gpraceman]

Originally Posted by highrpm666

Anybody? Can anyone please answer my fly-bar weight questions?

You might get better response by making a new thread with your question. I think a lot of people skip over build threads, unless they are building themselves.

[darmie]

I bought my 450 used. it did not come with any weights on the fly bar. This was my first cp heli, felt nice and stable, never looked back. I do fly with expo though!

[Ferrett]

Originally Posted by highrpm666

Anybody? Can anyone please answer my fly-bar weight questions?

Move the weights in half way before you try them all the way in. You will notice a big difference. Using expo will help control the new found snappyness in repsonce. I am using the KBDD paddles with no weights on the flybar and I think 20% expo. Very controlable and dialed in.

[Rookiepilot83]

It appears that you don't have soft start enabled on your ESC, if you like your blades spinning up to speed that quickly then hey, to each their own I guess, however when your bird is on the bench undergoing repairs and you or someone else accidentally bumps the throttle or T-hold it could end very badly for you or everyone, happened to me twice, thank God for soft start.

[highrpm666]

Thanks for the input guys. I am going to try half way in with the weights first and see how I like it.

[John A]

Originally Posted by highrpm666

I am very glad I finally figured out the unequal pitch issue and couldn't have done it without knowing about the 10mm gap trick!

What is the 10mm gap trick?

[gpraceman]

Originally Posted by John A

What is the 10mm gap trick?

It should be 10mm from the top of the upper main bearing block to the bottom of the swashplate (at mid stick). I stumbled upon that somewhere here on the forum.

[highrpm666]

Just a little update, the heli now has 20 flights on it! I have flown 2 packs with the flybar weights half way in and have to say that it made very little noticeable difference. I am going to try putting them all the way in before the next flight and see if that helps before removing them completely. These flybar weights are making the heli way to unresponsive and this thing will basically hands off hover for quite a while before needing any input to stay stationary. I also installed some fancy new KBDD tail blades in neon yellow, these blades sound a lot different than the v2 stockers and required resetting up my tail in rate mode to get it where it needed to be pitch wise.

I have been having a blast with this thing. I can't wait to start doing some flips and rolls etc.. I'm still way to nervous when flying it though and find myself dumb thumbing for no reason. I guess I'm still just not used to the big loud heli's yet. I can flip, loop, roll and hover inverted pretty well with my McpX and in Clearview and once I get the cyclic response where it needs to be I'm going to give it a go with the 450. can't wait!

Here are some pics from this afternoon, some were taken while resetting up the gyro for the new tail blades. I tried a couple different settings with my camera's(htc evo 4g) shutter speed to try and capture a good shot of the tail blades. It didn't work so well. Phone camera's just kinda suck.








Short video from today also:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZNpMdVnWuk

[gpraceman]

I'm glad that you are having fun with yours.

Mine has been a bit of a frustration. I've only had time to hover it for a few packs. That went well pretty much until the heli started spinning like crazy. Fortunately, I was only a couple of feet up and landed it successfully. Looking at the belt, it was significantly frayed. Well, if I had paid close enough attention during the build, I would have seen that the gear on the tail rotor shaft is a bit cocked on the shaft, so it wobbles when it spins. I'm sure this caused the belt to slip off and start binding. I got a new belt and some replacement tail rotor shafts (Align) in hand.

However, I started taking the tail apart today and was surprised to see that the boom clamp portion of the tail unit was cracked on the bottom. I guess that I must have come down a bit harder than I thought. Well, instead of getting a new V2 tail unit, I decided to put one for a Sport on it. The Sport tail unit looks much easier to change out a belt or tail rotor shaft. I also like that it has a pin that keeps the tail unit from rotating on the boom.

So, now I am grounded, until I get the new tail unit in the mail.

[highrpm666]

Gpraceman, I'm sorry about your bad luck. That really bites! It's a good thing you got it down in one piece, I would've had a heart attack seeing my newest heli plummet. I bet that sport tail unit does heaps better than the v2 piece and I did not know that it had a alignment pin, that's pretty cool. If it goes well for you I might make the upgrade as well.

The wind had me totally bummed out today. I really wanted to get out and burn a few packs with the new flybar weight positions but, it never happened. So in the midst of my boredom I decided to try and create my helicopter in Clearview. After a few hours of scratching my head I was able to come up with this.

I wasn't able to figure out how to change the color of the boom supports, main gear or landing gear but, I think it represents my heli pretty darn good.

[gpraceman]

Originally Posted by highrpm666

Gpraceman, I'm sorry about your bad luck. That really bites! It's a good thing you got it down in one piece, I would've had a heart attack seeing my newest heli plummet. I bet that sport tail unit does heaps better than the v2 piece and I did not know that it had a alignment pin, that's pretty cool. If it goes well for you I might make the upgrade as well.

I actually got the new tail unit in the mail today! I'm not sure why I thought it was coming in next week. I had actually decided to try the Sport tail unit before I even found the stock tail unit cracked. I am getting it put on this evening. It is much nicer than the V2 tail design! You do need to get an Align boom or drill a hole in the CopterX one for the vertical fin's mounting bracket to fit into.

I am also putting on some new KBDD tail blades (59.6mm) on. The ones that I had on it were the 61mm ones and were getting a little nicked up on the ends. I think those ones were meant for a 450 Pro.

Also while I am at it, I am re-doing the tail servo mount brackets. I flipped them around, so now the servo is horizontal instead of at an angle. This seems to give the tail control rod a straighter shot down the boom. I also found that I had the ball too far out on the servo horn. I read that it should be about 7 - 8 mm from center.

Originally Posted by highrpm666

The wind had me totally bummed out today. I really wanted to get out and burn a few packs with the new flybar weight positions but, it never happened. So in the midst of my boredom I decided to try and create my helicopter in Clearview. After a few hours of scratching my head I was able to come up with this.

I wasn't able to figure out how to change the color of the boom supports, main gear or landing gear but, I think it represents my heli pretty darn good.

Very cool. I wish there was a way to do that in Phoenix.

That wind was pretty bad at times today. I was working with a guy today that was holding a 4x8 piece of OSB and the wind caught it and knocked him right over. He scraped up his elbow and smacked his shoulder. Unfortunately, the weather report is not looking good for flying this weekend.

[Wolfpackin]

Looks like you guys are having summer down there in your part of Colorado.

I don't have any good recent heli pics but here's one of my new Jeep taken yesterday.

Snowing pretty hard now with about 4" expected.

[gpraceman]

Yeah, you guys have been getting more than your fair share of snow this year! You need to send some down to the front range (don't let me wife hear me say that - she wants Spring weather).

[Wolfpackin]

I'm sure Vail Resorts can spare some, they got over 42 feet this season.