Delandrcman or Neal the ace?

[CrashNburn420]

Sellers need to figure in the 3% fee into their price. Asking for payment as a gift is a huge red flag!

[jbaum81]

Originally Posted by hamstar78

When someone asks me to pay as a gift or the fees are on me i just walk away from the sale. The fees are the cost of doing business.

Agree, but I did go forward because he did accept the normal payment method. If I get burnt no big deal Paypal's got my back so long as I pay for "goods".

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

Sellers need to figure in the 3% fee into their price. Asking for payment as a gift is a huge red flag!

Also agree, but my whole point was that he had previously been kicked for shady stuff. and under new management HF has allowed him back in. Read the post below, he get's defensive but never provides a reasonable answer to his claims of being "hacked", and then closed the thread.

Point is pay extra close attention to who your dealing with on here now, Although you may have protection from paypal who want's to deal with that headache in the first place.


https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=701371

[Drivelayer]

You know I am following this thread for much the same reasons as people who love disaster movies, I just want to see the carnage.


But here I am jumping in where I probably don't belong, but since I cannot fly I might as well stir the sticks here.


I will start by saying I do not know if Neal the Ace is a bad guy or not.. I don't think he is but my experiences with him, and others, are certainly different than yours.


So there are systems in place to protect the buyer, the one easiest to identify is the feedback system. When I look at Neal the Ace's ratings he has 5 good ratings and one bad in the last 12 months. looking farther back even more good entries and no bad. Let's be honest most people are more likely to post a bad review than a good review. I can base my purchasing decision off that information alone, assuming we are doing our part in leaving truthful feedback.


A few points to make, just to toss out there. I have seen on several occasions where moderators would voice personal opinion and because they are a Moderator it carries more weight.. Ummm ... I don't think so.


A moderator's job is to enforce the rules of the forum, nothing more and nothing less. A moderator, working under the title of Moderator, should never voice a personal opinion in a forum. That would be like a judge in court speaking his personal opinion on a matter. Enforce the rules in place, don't legislate from the bench. Now that being said we are all human but anytime I see a Mod. post a personal comment I have to wonder .. much like when a police care turns on its lights to go through a red light just to turn them off on the other side. (yes I am sure there is a law enforcement offer on this forum that can tell me why that's ok and how I don't know their job .. I admit, it's all true, please don't pull over my baby blue Prius)


The word is if a guy asks to be paid as a gift so he doesn't have to pay the fee's he is a crook. I don't believe that is either fair nor true. It's a guy that wants to get the most money for what he is selling, and who doesn't. If YOU don't want the most buck for your item please let us know. I can make a decision to risk it or not, I'm an adult (so i'm told). I do agree, the seller should consider that fee in. But then we have the sellers that say postage is separate, are they crooks? I know its not exactly the same thing but the generally established 'norm' seems to be to price including shipping.


Now I do believe that a lot of crooks do ask that of people. But there are warning and posts all over the place advising the buyer not to do it.


And statements that if I guys says he's a standup guy then you can't believe him and he's not to be trusted.. c'mon, really? Is that an argument that is supposed to carry weight.. maybe when we were in the 5th grade. Politicians and lawyers tell us we can trust them all the time.... Ok maybe not the best point I could make .... =) (Ok again just joking, trying to keep it lite, please no law suites or "immanent domain" notices).


Lets talk about inappropriate behavior, jumping in and hijacking a guys for sale thread is not only poor taste but can be considered slanderous, I would be careful about doing that especially when the ratings on the site, or even the post highlighted in the accusation, doesn't support the statements made.


For all these comments and complaints about the guy why isn't the rating system being used? Why are we as people so ready to condemn one person because someone else said something, "I know him and don't trust him"? Why do we think we got 'lucky' in our dealings just because it went well and someone else's went poorly.. why don't we think they just got unlucky or there was something else that affected the outcome in a negative way .. .


I'll tell you.. we as a race are hostile and untrusting. And when we get into a mob, in person or a web forum, we don't want to be the outsider so we support the majority consensus.


(rain passed, sun is out, must wrap up and go fly ...)


We should strive to be better than that, we ARE better than that. HF is about people helping people.

[mattbeau]

Drive layer,
The reason that you shouldn't pay as a gift is so you have recourse if there is a problem with the transaction. If something goes wrong, PayPal will say, "well it was a gift what's the big deal. "


I'd rather pay the PayPal fee myself rather then sending payment as a gift. If the buyer wants, the most bang for his buck and it's over 5-10 dollars in fees, just pay a little over the agreed price to cover the fees.

[Drivelayer]

Matt,

I appreciate your comments. I am fully aware of why not to pay as a gift and I certainly didn't mean to imply anyone should. My comments were simply the default opinion that anyone who asks for that payment method is a crook is not warranted or accurate in all cases. I certainly would not pay as a gift, but I do not think the guy that asks me to is trying to rip me off. At the end of the day it is a negotion between two parties, give and take is expected.

[mattbeau]

Ok I understand your point but I think it should just be discouraged. And instead as an option that buyer pays PayPal fees. IMHO
As an example, there maybe a perfectly good reason that someone has tools for picking locks in their car. But in my eyes, unless they are a lock smith, they are probably a burglar and you might want to confront them about it.

[Drivelayer]

So because a person has something that 'you' feel he has no business having then he should be harassed?

I have a beer in my cooler, does that make me a drunk driver? Unless you see me pop the top and start the car what gives you the right to confront me and ask?

My only point is, and I am certainly not trying to get into a pissing match, if you want to judge a guy over a subjective comment or situation then do so, make your decisions and moce on. However you have no right to spread unfounded rumors about someone's person or intent.

Now if you have been wronged, or feel you have, and a settlement cannot be agreed on the proper response is to leave negative feedback and posts any comments or information there.

This has been fun but the suns up and my 700 is calling me..

[mattbeau]

No pissing contest necessary, I'm just trying to help. I feel our community of helifreakers are a lot safer than other places out there because of the good work everyone does here to try to keep the thieves out. Obviously some people feel differently about PayPal as a gift, who'd a thunk. At any rate, enjoy your 700 today! I'm off to fly my 180 myself
Peace

[Drivelayer]

Not to Hijack the thread but ..


Thanks Matt, I enjoyed my 700 greatly, until the clutch broke =( , but I had several flights on her, nearly 2 gallons over the weekend, so I'm not complaining. Plus I was hanging with good friends and no one ate dirt .. Yesterday was a good day.


I hope you has as much fun.

[mattbeau]

Yep, spent some time yesterday tuning my uBrain and 6 happy landings. For a total of 20 flights all weekend. I couldn't complain
Sorry if our discussion got a bit heated. I'd rather talk about the good stuff that we do with our birds and hate to see stories like the Op.

Take care

[Grimmy]

You 2 need to get a room and take it private.

[Drivelayer]

C'mon Grimmy, don't feel left out .. join us, what did you fly this weekend?


Matt I'm with you, lets talk about the good stuff .. for example we have a new guy at our field that brings a different skill set so I find myself pushing harder and learning more than I have in months.


He has a sweet Trex 600N DFC that is beautiful, has me putting a 600n back together. Well he just sent me a message, he's been admiring my old beat up 700N so he ordered one today ... I am excited for him, can't wait until he gets it in..

[mattbeau]

I'm too chicken to go to gasser. Fire is a real issue where I live and would hate to 'crash and burn'. Well at least till I get better. That's awsome you guys can go fly together. Everyone flys planes around me.

[Drivelayer]

We fly in a hay field with a runway cut out. I've had many crashes and the only fire / near fire I've ever seen was with a Lipo, never a fuel heli or airplane.






Yesterday, before my clutch blew, I was flying my 700N and a fuel line split coming out of the tank spraying the engine and exhaust pipe with fuel, while I was still flying, engine spinning about 16000 rpm.. not even a hint of flame.




It's generally safe.


For some people, like myself, the smell, sound and smoke make the whole experience ten fold better.

[mattbeau]

Well yes the that would definitely make things more exciting. Crap now you have me looking at the 600N.

[Drivelayer]

[jbaum81]

I just started out with my first nitro.. A 600N with an OS 55hz. Amazingly fun and will definitely get you thinking about why you fly electric. Soo nice to grab your tx, bird and some fuel and go fly for the day, no worries about charging packs, bringing generators etc.
Not as much power but my 55 hz running on the fat side has plenty of power if you fly right.

[mattbeau]

Gaui makes an nx4. It's probably a better price point. Is there anything wrong with going with a smaller gasser? I currently fly a gaui x3 and 180 cfx

[mattbeau]

And sorry to OP, your threads been hijacked

[jbaum81]

Originally Posted by mattbeau

Gaui makes an nx4. It's probably a better price point. Is there anything wrong with going with a smaller gasser? I currently fly a gaui x3 and 180 cfx

Not sure if your aware, but an NX4 is not technically a "gasser". it's a nitro. "gassers" run petrol AKA gasoline. Nitro's run an alcohol / nitro mix. I've never flown an NX4 but I've seen them and their definitely cool.