Is SAB Heli a new shell of Outrage

[jhunter]

The people without problems dont come to the forums. The ones that do obviously do, looking for help. I think most problems were user error as well.

[nyc863]

I was factored in all that before coming to my conclusion, having not woken up new to message boards this morning.

Plus, I know exactly what part problems I got in my first kit, and what parts they were replaced with and what problems those had.
The machining errors were unbelievable. I see same telltale signs from other people.

Anyway, good on you for being a supporter.

Just saying that it is not a heli to hold up as a role model for how the SAB heli should be built. TDR? yes. Very pleased with mine. Kasama? nope.

[jhunter]

Obviously there have been some problems or we wouldn't be talking about it. My TDR is great as well. I hope I enjoy my goblin as much as I enjoy both of them.

[fusionsx00]

its been released already?

[jhunter]

19th

[Ultraviolet]

March 2012 before you get to stroke one.

[jhunter]

But I and 75 others will have them in Dec. I was 7th on the list.
The notice for march is for the 2nd batch of them.

[rexxigpilot]

Originally Posted by nyc863

Sorry, you blew it there.
My experience with my Kasama was while some (not me) may want him in charge of design, you definitely do NOT want him in charge of production quality control.
When I want a bitter laugh I peek back in the Kasama forum, and guaranteed I see some unfortunates with the same bizarre issues.

So if SAB need to quality control tips take em from the Germans, thanks very much.

We just disagree! The only heli I ever owned that came close to my Srimok in QC (fit & finsih) was my Hirobo. One of my helis with the worst parts fit was my Logo 600. Those plastic side frames have an atrocious fit. Sure they come together once you crank down on the screws, but I would not say it is the definition of German QC.

[smsodhi]

Originally Posted by drader

I think they (SAB) will be extremely focused on quality!
They are in Emilia Romagna an italian region with strong reputation about quality, design, performance and, why not, Style of Life.
Into about 150 km there are companies like Ferrari, Lamborghini, Maserati, Pagani, Ducati and ... SAB, for sure they have everything to prove, but I think they will be succesfully because all the mentioned companies have in common the most important thing ... the passion for what they do.

The Italians are without a doubt excellent in design. Some thing that I am sorry to say the Germans are not. But, none of the cars mentioned above are reliable. They could not be used on a day to day basis. What is needed is reliability and engineering of the highest quality. Something the Germans are excellent in. Passion is great but when your machine is giving constant problems this becomes a pain.
That is why I resisted the lure of the beautiful design of the Goblin and the interesting layout, for something that I am sure will be solid. The Diablo

This is just my opinion and I do not want to upset anyone.

[Thunder Fighter]

Have you seen a MSH Protos, Italian designed heli with great reliability. I have also seen mention that some of the design team for the Goblin are from Germany but haven't seen it confirmed anywhere and it is a poor generalization to say all engineers from a certain country are the same.

I have heard people generalize that the Germans engineer and the Italians design but while I find many Italian products are great to look at, the more recent examples are also reliable. An example are my last 3 Italian motorbikes, they have been totally reliable through the last 7 years of ownership with daily use (Aprilia and Piaggio).

There will be teething troubles with the Goblin, as with every new heli, if they handle it as well as MSH have then they will build up some great brand loyalty, time will tell.

//Dennis.

[bobloblaw]

Nice sane comments Dennis.
Thankfully the Goblin isn't made in the US - I'd definitely be rethinking my pre-order if that was the case.

[Ah Clem]

I always find it interesting that people are willing to dive in and either condemn or defend to the death, a product they have never seen in person. I have seen this so many times, in many hobbies and other areas of life.

I don't really care where a machine is made, as long as it is well made, and one can purchase parts, reasonably and quickly.

When the Goblins have been in service, with regular users, over time, we will start to see reports of flight performance and longevity. Then we will all know.

I will be watching this with interest.

[drader]

Originally Posted by smsodhi

The Italians are without a doubt excellent in design. Some thing that I am sorry to say the Germans are not.
But, none of the cars mentioned above are reliable. They could not be used on a day to day basis. What is needed is reliability and engineering of the highest quality. Something the Germans are excellent in. Passion is great but when your machine is giving constant problems this becomes a pain.
That is why I resisted the lure of the beautiful design of the Goblin and the interesting layout, for something that I am sure will be solid. The Diablo

This is just my opinion and I do not want to upset anyone.

Well, unfortunately I can't judge directly the reliability of such high end supercars... for sure their mission is not to produce cars to be used on daily basis.
Concerning german engineering, as owner of german car, motorbike and, for sure , helicopter, I mostly agree with you, although they all have, like everyone else, good and bad. For example TDR is amazing piece of engineering, she flies very well and is very reliable, but only if strictly used in the spec.; try to use powerful motors and high rpm and you will have some reliability problems.

Concerning the goblin design ... you already said everything and about reliability time will tell, but for me is enough the lukas riva stops at full speed I saw live and what Tareq told me at AHSD : "I tried to break it in every way" .... clearly without success.

Concerning the Diabolo (quite strange name ) i think is very interesting heli because, although similar, overcomes some TDR weak points like the belt driven tail rotor instead of torq tube. On the other side I do prefer the Banshee/Goblin solution for a belt first stage of the transmission because of the high temperature you can have on the first stage main gear.

[Mystic3D]

Originally Posted by Ah Clem

When the Goblins have been in service, with regular users, over time, we will start to see reports of flight performance and longevity. Then we will all know.

+1 Yep generalizations/assumptions mean exactly nothing.

[Scottyb410]

Originally Posted by drader

Concerning the Diabolo (quite strange name ) i think is very interesting heli because, although similar, overcomes some TDR weak points like the belt driven tail rotor instead of torq tube. .

With due respect, and strictly from an engineering standpoint, the belt is far more efficient than the torque tube. Especially at higher RPM. I am not sure how this torque tube misnomer was derived; however, I am sure it likely originated in a marketing meeting and not an engineering one.

Cheers
Scotty

[Ah Clem]

Very well stated, Scotty!

[drader]

Originally Posted by Scottyb410

With due respect, and strictly from an engineering standpoint, the belt is far more efficient than the torque tube. Especially at higher RPM. I am not sure how this torque tube misnomer was derived; however, I am sure it likely originated in a marketing meeting and not an engineering one.

Cheers
Scotty

I'm sorry, maybe my English is very bad, but that's exactly what I meant ....
TDR -> torq tube. Diabolo -> belt
and generally speaking -> belt better than torq tube.

[Scottyb410]

Originally Posted by drader

I'm sorry, maybe my English is very bad, but that's exactly what I meant ....
TDR -> torq tube. Diabolo -> belt
and generally speaking -> belt better than torq tube.

Your English is fine! I now understand your point. My apologies.

Scotty

[DT75]

Originally Posted by drader

Concerning the Diabolo (quite strange name ) i think is very interesting heli because, although similar, overcomes some TDR weak points like the belt driven tail rotor instead of torq tube.

Originally Posted by Scottyb410

With due respect, and strictly from an engineering standpoint, the belt is far more efficient than the torque tube.

I belive this is what drader says.

The TDR has TT, Diabolo belt.





Already answered I see...

[smsodhi]

Thanks for not flaming me. I thought my comments would be controversial. I agree and understand with all the comments made and respect them.