aurora 9 pulling the trigger, questions

[speedyboy9]

Thanks,how does the tx monitor the headspeed,didnt realize it had those benefits for nitro,i may have to upgrade sooner than planned.

[maarset]

You can get a headspeed sensor that will display the headspeed on the tx. Just a magnet sensor. So maybe your existing one will work.

[speedyboy9]

hi,thanks for the info,ive been looking at a few screen shots of the A9.
the temp,head & rotor speeds only appear in the plane menu,do they apply to helis aswell.
sorry for all the questions but its a lot of doh to spend when i have a perfectly good dx7.
thanks again.

[maarset]

Sensor's are in the heli menu too. You have two temp sensors and two rpm sensors. And they will have a fuel level sensor you put on the outside of the tank. Perfect for scale.

[maarset]

Well I have given up trying to use the voltage alarm on my Knight 600E. My voltage sags too much when I fly it really hard and I get low voltage alarm throughout my flight. I would set it as low at 27.1 volts (8S lipo) and I would then come down with over discharged packs. If I set it for 3.4 to 3.5 volts per cell I would get beeps in the beginning of the flight doing hard collective moves.

The radio really needs to have a telemetry device that will read MAH usage. That would be very helpful.

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by maarset

Well I have given up trying to use the voltage alarm on my Knight 600E. My voltage sags too much when I fly it really hard and I get low voltage alarm throughout my flight. I would set it as low at 27.1 volts (8S lipo) and I would then come down with over discharged packs. If I set it for 3.4 to 3.5 volts per cell I would get beeps in the beginning of the flight doing hard collective moves.

The radio really needs to have a telemetry device that will read MAH usage. That would be very helpful.

Yes, mAH would be good. After a few more weekends with the A9 telemetry, I found that 3.4V (20.4V alert) is perfect for my T-Rex 500. I start getting some blips at the end of my flight when applying hard collective then its time to land or I can go on for maybe 15 or 30 seconds more. I come back and get ~3.5V rest voltage on my packs every time.

I found another good use for voltage telemetry is that I get blips fairly early with the older LIPO packs I have. I already knew these packs were aging but it really shows how well the A9 voltage telemetry is working. These old packs start out at 100% rest voltage on the bench just like the new packs but the load voltage really shows the age of the LIPO. If and when my newer packs develop this behavior, I'll know they are aging. Lovin' this telemetry. It is revealing dynamic load behavior of my packs versus the rest voltage I'd see on the bench.

I'm not clear on the details of your Knight 600E. But, going from what I experienced, if you are getting these blips early on, it might be time to get newer packs or reevaluate the power system of that particular heli. If these are new LIPO packs then maybe might need bigger packs or a higher voltage like 12S setup. The problem with these big voltage sags is the punchout maneuvers might momentarily push the packs well below the 3.3V dangerous level which causes damage to the LIPO cells. This might have been already happening but now with realtime telemetry, you are now just becoming aware of it.

[maarset]

Thanks for the reply. I was doing 27.2 or 3.4 per cell on my 600E as the alert and my packs were coming down between 3.5 to 3.6 volts per cell. But I kind of thought that might be bad. I try to end up with a resting voltage of 3.7. My Hyperion 35C VX's rarely beeps till the very end. So it holds it's voltage really well. My older Hyperion Litestorms 30C will beep early cause they are older and don't hold the voltage as well.

But yes I'm seriously thinking about moving up to 12S. Less amp draw with the higher voltage.

It's funny though, on my 450 Pro on 4S with Hyperion VX 35C 2200 mah packs I have the alert at 3.5 volts per cell and I never get a beep till 4:30 and I'm running 350mm blades at 3200 Head Speed.

[reckless loony]

It is actually better to time your flights and stop flying with 20% capacity remaining in the battery. You use the battery charger to see how much mah has gone back into the battery and adjust flight time accordingly. Keep in mind as batteries age the capacity of the battery diminishes. Once batteries are 20% down on capacity they should be removed from service.

Here is a Lipo data sheet discharge curve.

http://enerland.com/upload/product/PQ-5000XP.pdf

[iAdam]

Never liked the timing thing because each flight is so different. Sometimes I just like to work on inverted slow piros at a lower headseed, and other flights I smack it down. Timer does me no good.

I have gotten really used to this voltage alarm and just love it, however my older cheap 2oc packs beep on hard collective. My nano tech 6s 265s do not beep until the very end.

I think the age and quality of the packs have something to do with it.

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by reckless loony

It is actually better to time your flights and stop flying with 20% capacity remaining in the battery. You use the battery charger to see how much mah has gone back into the battery and adjust flight time accordingly. Keep in mind as batteries age the capacity of the battery diminishes. Once batteries are 20% down on capacity they should be removed from service.

Here is a Lipo data sheet discharge curve.

http://enerland.com/upload/product/PQ-5000XP.pdf

Umm, that could work if you use the same size batteries, exactly in the same condition and fly exactly the same on every flight.

I use 2650, 2500, 2350, and 3000 size packs with my T-Rex 500. On top of that, some of them old and some of them new. The old ones definitely have less performance on high collective pumps. Adjusting the timer for every battery and condition of that battery would be un-fun to say the least -- I'm not anal rentitive enough for that. It could be good if I could just scrap all my batteries and buy brand new 3000s!

Moreover, I can actually hear my alarm beep intermittently earlier with old batteries versus new batteries on collective pumps (see earlier post). So I land earlier when flying the old/smaller batteries because the battery tells me so not because of a timer I'd have to adjust for every pack. I'd disagree that a timer is better than live readings of a battery.

I also fly a powered glider that can have severely different flight conditions (wind) and I've come to love the telemetry even more! Much much stress reduction here no kidding!

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by iadamz@mac.com

Never liked the timing thing because each flight is so different. Sometimes I just like to work on inverted slow piros at a lower headseed, and other flights I smack it down. Timer does me no good.

I have gotten really used to this voltage alarm and just love it, however my older cheap 2oc packs beep on hard collective. My nano tech 6s 265s do not beep until the very end.

I think the age and quality of the packs have something to do with it.

+1 on that. Live telemetry on the battery is a total game changer. Couldn't go back ever.

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by maarset

Thanks for the reply. I was doing 27.2 or 3.4 per cell on my 600E as the alert and my packs were coming down between 3.5 to 3.6 volts per cell. But I kind of thought that might be bad. I try to end up with a resting voltage of 3.7. My Hyperion 35C VX's rarely beeps till the very end. So it holds it's voltage really well. My older Hyperion Litestorms 30C will beep early cause they are older and don't hold the voltage as well.

But yes I'm seriously thinking about moving up to 12S. Less amp draw with the higher voltage.

It's funny though, on my 450 Pro on 4S with Hyperion VX 35C 2200 mah packs I have the alert at 3.5 volts per cell and I never get a beep till 4:30 and I'm running 350mm blades at 3200 Head Speed.

Oh, one thing about the 12S setup is that the voltage will be over the voltage limit of the SPC port on the Optima receivers (which is 35 volts).

But there is a partial solution. Most people fly 12S setups with two 6S packs in series. You could hook up just one of the packs using the balance connector to the SPC port. Yes, this presumes that both packs drain the same (most of the time it will) but its better than not having the live voltage!

[maarset]

Yah I almost didn't get the radio because of the limit of voltage it can monitor. But many guys said just monitor 1 of the 6S packs in a 12S flight pack and it will be all good. It is only supplying the RX processor.

I'm going to use my timer and the Voltage alarm at 27.2 tomorrow and see how it goes.

[maarset]

Well I did three flights at lunch today with the Knight. First two flights were with the 4500mah 8S 30C Hyperion LiteStorm packs . Last fight with the Hyperion G3 VX 35C 4200mah 8S pack.

Set my voltage alarm for 27.2 Volts.

On the 1st LiteStorm pack I would get a beep doing fast backwards upright hurricanes early on in the pack or any fast cyclic move.
They don’t hold the voltage like my VX 35C pack.

For the second LiteStorm pack I added some more dual rate to the cyclic and didn’t get the alert much at all. I can tell the LiteStorm packs need a higher throttle curve compared to the G3 pack.

At about 6:00 time on the G3’s VX 4200 pack I started getting an alert on hard collective or cyclic moves after 6 min.
While the litestorm packs would beep doing flips and stuff, the G3’s would not. I might ditch the LiteStorm packs and just use the VX pack since the voltage alarm works best with this pack. Or just keep the LiteStorm packs and just use them for sport flying and warming up.

But I’m seriously considering getting a lower KV motor and going 10S or 12S.
Or maybe do a 12S 550E, or a 8S trex 500.

As much as I like the 600 size electric it still is quite intimidating. And a lot more expensive. Maybe it is the fear of tacoing 200 dollar plus flight packs.

[g-bru]

Maarset, get an X5 bud, you will love it, heaps of punch, is the equivalent size of a 550 and only 6S. A winner!

Also a flybarless head will be available next week. Gonna get this with a BeastX.

G


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by maarset

Well I did three flights at lunch today with the Knight. First two flights were with the 4500mah 8S 30C Hyperion LiteStorm packs . Last fight with the Hyperion G3 VX 35C 4200mah 8S pack.

Set my voltage alarm for 27.2 Volts.

On the 1st LiteStorm pack I would get a beep doing fast backwards upright hurricanes early on in the pack or any fast cyclic move.
They don’t hold the voltage like my VX 35C pack.

For the second LiteStorm pack I added some more dual rate to the cyclic and didn’t get the alert much at all. I can tell the LiteStorm packs need a higher throttle curve compared to the G3 pack.

At about 6:00 time on the G3’s VX 4200 pack I started getting an alert on hard collective or cyclic moves after 6 min.
While the litestorm packs would beep doing flips and stuff, the G3’s would not. I might ditch the LiteStorm packs and just use the VX pack since the voltage alarm works best with this pack. Or just keep the LiteStorm packs and just use them for sport flying and warming up.

But I’m seriously considering getting a lower KV motor and going 10S or 12S.
Or maybe do a 12S 550E, or a 8S trex 500.

As much as I like the 600 size electric it still is quite intimidating. And a lot more expensive. Maybe it is the fear of tacoing 200 dollar plus flight packs.

I think its very cool you can actually see performance aspects of batteries in flight with telemetry. This is of course what "remote measurement" is about.

I am at the point where I do use my older packs that dip as my "warm up" packs to shake the pilot jitters out. At some point in the future, even my new packs will end up dipping in voltage so they too will become my warm up packs. At that point, my current "old" packs will probably end up as test bench batteries before being tossed out.

The question we all had before was when to know a pack is deteriorating. I'll always be looking for the beeps from now on to help guide me.

[maarset]

Originally Posted by skyhigh

I think its very cool you can actually see performance aspects of batteries in flight with telemetry. This is of course what "remote measurement" is about.

Plus it is an excellent collective management tool.

[maarset]

Got two and a half flights with the Knight 600E today.
Voltage alarm at 27.2 (3.4). With the Litestorm packs doing tick tocks I would get a melody of alarms even in the beginning of the flight.
With the VX 35C pack I could do tick tocks and not get any alarms. It was flying awesome with the VX pack. Then of course my servo bus on the RX loses power and goes in very hard. I was still able to read the voltage of the main pack in the TX after the crash. Very weird.

Someone is telling me I need to stick with the smaller helicopters.

[skyhigh]

Originally Posted by maarset

Got two and a half flights with the Knight 600E today.
Voltage alarm at 27.2 (3.4). With the Litestorm packs doing tick tocks I would get a melody of alarms even in the beginning of the flight.
With the VX 35C pack I could do tick tocks and not get any alarms. It was flying awesome with the VX pack. Then of course my servo bus on the RX loses power and goes in very hard. I was still able to read the voltage of the main pack in the TX after the crash. Very weird.

Someone is telling me I need to stick with the smaller helicopters.

Sorry to hear about the crash. I don't follow on the "servo bus" coming out on the RX. Are you referring to the SPC connector?

Did your battery pack survive the crash? I've been thinking about a bigger heli than my T-Rex 500. Like yourself, I am worried about tacoing those big expensive packs. I think the T-Rex 600 is out of the running because the batteries sit right up front frame with no protection whatsoever.

I have Mikado Logo 600s at my field and very impressed with the battery positioning all within the frame. That Mikado frame is curvey and tough like an automobile. Nice engineering on that frame. I've seen them crash hard without damage to the packs too.

The Avant Aurora Electric has been designed specifically for protecting the battery packs. At least that's what they say in the brochure. They say the battery is both protected in the frame and sit higher up in the frame which makes for better aeileron tick tock action.

http://www.avantrc.com/

[maarset]

My 8S pack got a little corner damage but not much.

I power the RX processer through the PSC plug that is connected to the main flight pack. That still had power after the crash because I could see my main pack voltage in the TX.
But the servo bus in the RX was dead. I was getting no power into the RX at the Battery port. So none of my servos were working. Really strange.