Flight Time

[Keldar]

What am I missing? Admittedly, I don't know crap about RC heli's yet. But this has bugged me since I first read up on the details of the sharp looking 130X.

Does a mere 4 minutes of flight time not seem......low? Honestly, I ask this not as a veiled criticism, but as an opportunity to learn something.

[Lord Nelson]

Pretty standard for most collective pitch helis. That's why everybody buys lots of batteries. I have 10 for the mCPX which gives me 40 mins. of flying time and about one hour and a bit at the park when you are swapping them out and letting the motor cool down.

[Keldar]

So, it is a collective pitch thing?

Maybe I haven't paid attention to listed flight times of CP's because I'm not yet at that point in my skill set, especially as it pertains to shopping for more heli's.

[Lord Nelson]

Generally speaking, people fly their CP helis in idle up which is a constant high throttle - 85 to 100 percent power. They also tend to fly them harder doing 3D. To do good 3D, the battery has to maintain its power so 3D pilots tend to have shorter flights so the heli doesn't bog down. That said, the MSRX which is a flybarless fixed pitch heli only gets 3 to 4 minutes on a stock battery. It has a fairly high head speed.

You will note that on this forum, folks are always looking for a better battery that gives longer flight times, good power delivery, and longevity.

Flying for 4 minutes actually takes a lot of concentration. You are usually ready for a break by then anyway. And it allows time for the motor to cool down.

[Cullen Colapietro]

I think it was stated to expect 3 to 330 hard 3D and 5m sport..

[MeatRocket]

Originally Posted by Lord Nelson

Flying for 4 minutes actually takes a lot of concentration. You are usually ready for a break by then anyway. And it allows time for the motor to cool down.

+1 I know flying my T-Rex 550 for 10 minutes drains the hell out of me. You don't realize just how "dialed in" you are to every single movement until you land. It almost feels like I've been holding my breath for 10 minutes!

[atv223]

Yeah, when I started and ready about 3 minute flight times, I thought "that sucks". Now, 3 minutes of pushing my skill limits seems like a long time. Almost like time slows down. There is no break in concentration once the blades start spinning.

[My98stang46]

I thought the same thing when I first started. I'm sick of flying after 2 batteries and need a break lol

[Keldar]

Yep, I can definitely imagine the need for a break after some trippy flippy flying. I just had seen so many heli's brag about 8 - 10 min+ flight times, 4 minutes kind of struck me as a step back in the area of technological advances.

[MeatRocket]

Originally Posted by Keldar

Yep, I can definitely imagine the need for a break after some trippy flippy flying. I just had seen so many heli's brag about 8 - 10 min+ flight times, 4 minutes kind of struck me as a step back in the area of technological advances.

My T-Rex 550 gets 10 minutes, but that's with a 5000mAh battery 2000rpm headspeed & 550mm blades doing ONLY hovering and light circuits. If I was banging the sticks with 2200 hs, the time would drop significantly (while my stress level skyrockets).

[aloys24]

I agree with a lot of people here, by the 4-5 minute mark I'm tired and want a break.

One of the first questions I always hear is about how long the battery lasts and everyone is shocked when I say only around 4-5 minutes. they don't realize how much concentration is needed!

[WBFAir]

For the response mostly to the orignial post, in general for all of the about 5-6 years I've been flying E-helos, even for the FP or Coaxial ones, 5 min is about the standard time you see most work under.

Kinda got the feeling its a lot to do with how much battery can be built and its weight, with the fact of how much the helo weights combined with the output the battery needs to put out.

For an interesting example, for the 700's if its stock, about a 4000-4500mAh 40C pack is a good choice, if you go more C obviously you can get more power and you can get packs the are more mAh, but then your weight of the pack sometimes can cancel that out quite a bit.

IE, for all the extra money you spend on that, you maybe will get 15-30 seconds more time.

Then interestingly, for a 500 Pro I'm building, a lot of guys look for packs down in the 35C range as well as even the 30 all just to keep the weight down to get maybe like 5.5 min.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that in then end, mechanically, I think there is a best blance and oddly, it usually seems like 5 min is where that balance works out too.

Now for the mini-heli's if you go CP, and this is true for others just not Blades, it seems that 3-4 min is the standard.

Of course you can get a little more with a bigger pack but again, it falls back to all I just talked about and really, one big limit with the mini's is, how physically big the pack is as most mounting systems are usually in the belly or underneath and also have their limits.

Also to with the mini's is often the issues of having brushed motors and not have many options for this so even if you get a bigger or more C pack, kinda is pointless as its not going to matter much.

But that's one thing I'm kinda looking forward to on this helo is that one, its battery is going to be mounted on the top tray, so basically with in reason, I think we will see a lot of opportunities of packs to choose from. Plus right off the bat, its got a brushless motor. So really unless the ESC has some limits, the stock motor or maybe a reasonably price upgrade if one comes out can really exploit a higher C pack.

Of course weight will be an issue but again, with the brushless motor being able to exploit things, I have a feeling there will be some really killer packs made for this helo unless is has some major other flaw.

As far as what the other guys are talking about as far as flying, I don't know, its kinda weird. For the bigger helos I will admit 5 min is a good all around taxation on yourself time. But there have been days I wished for more. As well for sure some times I was just not feeling it and just standing there wishing the timer would go off too.

But with the little ones, I admit I think 3-4 is kinda short myself....but then two, really have never had one that's a CP that I was banging all kinds of 3D stuff with which yeah for sure, takes a lot more out of you.

Anyway, to each their own, and that's what they make extra pack for anyway.

[toys2cars2toys]

Originally Posted by WBFAir

For the response mostly to the orignial post, in general for all of the about 5-6 years I've been flying E-helos, even for the FP or Coaxial ones, 5 min is about the standard time you see most work under.........

I kind of agree that 5 mins seems to be a typical balance, I'm sure that there's a ton of people ready to say I get x mins out of my x

I'd say it's more like 3 - 6 mins out of a cp depending on set up, battery and flying style

For comparison I've got a Fixed pitch 450, based on a mix of 450 clone and funcopter parts, great for relaxed flying (a little like flying a summer plane eveing rather than sport plane). I'm disapointed if I get less than 12 mins out of it usin the same packs that I get 5 mins out on my Trex 450Sport FBL. Obviously blade design and head speed make a huge difference

Here's the inspiration behind the FP 450 - makes a great trainer, I've no managed to break it (yet) even after tip overs on a very windy day
https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=262663

and photos of it in my album https://www.helifreak.com/album.php?albumid=7308

[branflake]

my G5's can fly 8 or 9 minutes (FBL longer), but its a rare beast. I think the high voltage is responsible for most of it. but 2s for something this size seems "normal" so i would expect the normal 4 to 5. Honestly, after 5 minutes I kind of want a break anyway from the hyper-alertness of flying a CP, no matter how "hard" you are flying it.

[Keldar]

Excellent and informative responses Guys. I appreciate you all taking the time to weigh in. It really all makes sense after seeing the give and take of power vs. weight vs. mental fatigue.

[desertstalker]

Originally Posted by branflake12

but 2s for something this size seems "normal" so i would expect the normal 4 to 5.

I dont know of another 120/130 that is 2s, Walkera make 1s ones, though people often convert to 2s.

I can get 10+mins on my mini protos, (350mm blades at ~2200 RPM) but it is not suited for more than slow aerobatics (it can loop and flip but you need to do so smoothly). I cant really squeeze more than 5mins from my 200 or X2 though, as the HS needs to remain high. This is the problem with micros, thrust is proportional to headspeed (roughly) but power consumption is roughly proportional to the square of headspeed, so the high HS needed to keep the heli flying well is a problem for flight time.

FP helis have much lower headspeed, so are more efficient (can get away with it since they dont need to use a symmetric blade.

[drdrums]

A couple of buddies of mine with bigger e-helis (600 and 700 size) get around 4-5 min. average flight times, running 12S. They do smack 3D. I get 10-15 minutes with my 600, which is a nitro bird, doing sport flying (circuits and stall turns). I find myself wanting to stop about half way through a tank.

If you want long flight times, go big, and go engine. Nitro gives 7+ minutes on average for hard 3D. If you want longer than that (if you can handle it that long), go with a gasser. Flight times start at 10 min. with a small tank for a 700-size bird, and can stretch out to 30 min. or longer with a smaller engine and bird (600 size). Gassers can do 3D, but won't keep up with the nitros or electrics.

[desertstalker]

Originally Posted by drdrums

I get 10-15 minutes with my 600, which is a nitro bird, doing sport flying (circuits and stall turns). I find myself wanting to stop about half way through a tank.

10 is doable on electrics too, just drop the HS down from the OMG insane levels people seem to think they need. For the flying you mention that sort of speed is not needed.

Heck i can get ~12-14mins out of a 4S 450 (350mm mains), if i run it at 2300RPM, its not any good for more than circuits and such (it could do slow flips but my skills suck too much for that at low HS) but it still flies very well, thanks to the FBL unit.

Power requirement in hover (its fairly similar in sport flight) is a function of the square of headspeed, so a small drop can make a big difference.

[jonbailie]

You can probably squeeze out 6-7 minutes at least just hovering around. Because of the way people generally fly in the teaser and flight videos, the flight time is going to be at the lowest around 3-4 minutes of stick-banging 3D smack.

I'd say the average pilot on helifreak flying the 130x will get about 5-6 minutes, doing a combination of sport and light-moderate 3d.