Building up my fbl 700 gasser

[ekoning]

Originally Posted by Lars Linders

What do you mean by this Erik?

there was a question about the pinion and:
the pinion came with the conversion kit

[Lars Linders]

[jockstrap]

Lars - Nice work...

Have you maidened it yet?

I'm interested in your tail servo setup - where did you get that mount from?

Also - I went flying on the weekend and had an issue with my tail servo link guides... 2 of the 3 snapped from the constant vibes.. this is the 2nd time now, last time one snapped...

Do yourself a favour and get some of these - i have them on my 600 gasser no issues and will now be using them on my 700 as well..

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...d_H60150_.html

Also - be careful of the align flat screws - they "stick" to the CF and strip getting them off.. I've had to dremel a slot in mine previously to get them off... I now use M3 Cap head screws and the following washers - MUCH better..

http://www.infinity-hobby.com/main/p...oducts_id=5129

[ekoning]

Originally Posted by jockstrap

Lars - Nice work...

I'm interested in your tail servo setup - where did you get that mount from?

As the former owner of this helicopter; it's a g-force tail servo mount.
The gasser men kit has no sturdy solution for the tail servo , it has 1 small carbon and a pin but in the manual nothing on where to place the tail servo.

G-Force Tail Servo Mount for 700E Conversion. The new G-Force tail servo mount relocates the tail servo from the front to the back of the frame for direct rudder control. The servo mount weights under 10 grams and installs in minutes using the existing holes and tail control rod.

http://www.*******************/new-p...-g-force-heli/

[jockstrap]

cool - thanks for that.. will have a look at it..

[Azalin]

Originally Posted by jockstrap

Do yourself a favour and get some of these - i have them on my 600 gasser no issues and will now be using them on my 700 as well..

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...d_H60150_.html

I have some of these but never used. I found the ones below. Am using in 2 of my gassers.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Metal-Tail-C...item4ab9625c24

They have plastic (or delrin) sleeves. I think it is to eliminate possible noise issue.

[Azalin]

A little pricey but they are strong and look pretty nice.

[jockstrap]

Oh - they are nice! I like the plastic inserts for the rod too..

But just bought a bunch from Hobbyking.. Hmmm, might think about them thou - they do look nice..

Edit: Darn you Azalin - I just had to buy some didn't I.... lol

[Doug Darby]

You really should consider the Align CF tail rod with the single boom support. They are simple and easy to install and the best part is the rod guide can be put on the boom without removing the tail case. With the rigidity of the CF you only need one rod support.
Just another option.

[fastflyer20]

I like the inexpensive align metal rod and plastic supports. Then when I wad it up, I don't feel as bad

[Doug Darby]

True...
I still hope you avoid the "wad it up part"...

[jockstrap]

@Fastflyer - that's what I was currently using and last flight 2 of the 3 plastic supports broke from vibes

On a previous occasion 1 broke... so looks like the plastic once don't like the constant vibes and fatigue easily.

Hence why I'm going for the metal ones.

[fastflyer20]

Not sure why they are breaking on yours. Mine has a ton of flights so far this year and I have not broken one (except when I wad it up). I use three and attach mine by Dremeling a small groove in the top ID of the support and slide a zip tie through it. They stay tight but can be adjusted compared to gluing them. A few drops of oil on the rod at the support every so often helps for smoother action. How many do you use and how are you attaching them?

[Lars Linders]

There's one thing I need to do before I can maiden it. I have to replace two servo balls, because they brake by losening.
After that I hope to maiden it!

Please can you guys advise me for a good "normal" throttle setup?
0-15-30-45-60?

[Azalin]

Lars

0-15-30-45-60 looks fine to me. Try it. If you see an over speed then lower the first 4 but leave the last number alone. You want a HS between 1300-1500 for the first run in normal mode. Avoid high HS for the couple first flights. Keep it low then increase slowly flight after flight.

[Lars Linders]

Originally Posted by Azalin

Lars

0-15-30-45-60 looks fine to me. Try it. If you see an over speed than lower the first 4 but leave the last number alone. You want a HS between 1300-1500 for the first run in normal mode. Avoid high HS for the couple first flights. Keep it low then increase slowly flight after flight.

Oke I wil try it.
I really love flying in idle, is it also possible using low idle 1 for first flights? If yes, what do you advise?

I don't understand one thing. If I look at my idle setup, the headspeed with 0 pitch is lower then in normal mode with 0 pitch. In idle 1, mid stick (0 pitch) is setup on 27,5 in my tx. On normal mode, mid stick (0 pitch) is setup at 30 in my tx... I guess my headspeed in normal mode is higher with these adjustments. Isn't this a bit strange??

[jockstrap]

Lars,

Anything is possible, it's just how you would prefer to fly it... but there is a generally accepted "best practice"...

Generally;

Normal mode: ony a few degrees negative pitch and full positive pitch.. throttle curve for low hover RPMs

Idle1: full negative and positive pitch. Throttle either flat line (electrics) or a V shaped curve with 25% and 75% points being at least the same as the 75% point in normal mode - ( but usually 5-10% more in idle up 1)

idle 2: same as idle1 but maybe closer to full power V curve.

that's all given you don't use a governor - later you will use straight line curves for idle1/2 and set the governor for your desired RPM's - but no point using a governor in my opinion till at least 2 gal as your engine's power is still increasing and the motor still running in till then...

Do as Azalin advises - gentle throttle curve just hovering around and very gentle forward flight.. simple low level circuits for the first few tanks.. you don't want to put much load on the motor for at least the first few tanks... then each tank gradually increasing load and rpms up to 1 gal.

In fact my first 2 tanks on each engine are basically just idleing and quick low throttle bursts on the ground with no blades attached at all... this is because this is when vibes are the highest and especially for fbl best to run a few tanks on the ground, let the motor "Bed" in a little first.

Next gal you can slowly start idle up and pushing the engine more towards higher RPMs...

@Fastflyer - basically the same as you - 3 of them equally spaced.. I started putting a drop of CA on them as they would still slip with the cable ties. I put a drop of oil at the base of them where the rod goes through before each days flying and lean them also.. so have been taking very good care of them... maybe I have more vibes? but the heli doesn't seem too bad vibe wise??? Have just replaced all 3 with plastic ones whilst I wait for the new metal ones to arrive.

PS: On my new HWC600 I've been a bit naughty... I've started pushing the motor after about 7 tanks of gentle stuff and now doing tick-tocks and harder stuff with it at about 12 tanks... to my surprise it's giving me a bit back already and maintains the tick-tocks quite easily now and already proving that it's going to be a great sport/mild 3D machine... it's a stock 321puh... my TRM 270TT is being treated a lot more kindly and running it in slowly and properly as it's worth a lot more money and in my 700 which I favour more... lol

Lars - this is a vid of I think my 3rd tank on my HWC600 after 2 tanks of no blades - as you can see not much, just bedding the motor in the first handful of tanks. I like to alternate the RPM's on the motor breifly rather than let it sit constantly on the one RPM..

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQGK_FF5eqY[/ame]

[fastflyer20]

Zenoah - rings are seated in 20 minutes. The rest of the time is to burnish the piston in. Modified Zenoah's have relief in the pistons allowing them to break in quicker and prevent seizing.

There are many ways to break in an engine, but the most important is to not run it lean! I usually use normal normal for 2 tanks, then a governor in idle up in the high 11k range and slowly boost the governor every 3-4 tanks until it gets to the mid 13K range. Flying around using collective and cyclic is what varies the load on the engine. I like to use the governor because it prevents overspeeding. I will fly out the first two gallons at mid 13K, The only thing I avoid is long full collective maneuver. By 2 1/2 gallons, it is set to max RPM. For my Trex 700, it is at 15,100 and my Radikal is at 14,500. Once you learn, an engine will give you signals, check the plug often, it needs to run "slightly" richer than normal during break in due to the piston seating. You will "feel" it loosen up and it will need to be leaned slightly.

I babied my first few gas engine, but this past Winter and Spring, I broke in 6 top ends in development engines with the mufflers being pulled often and top ends coming off every so often to check for wear. I learned a lot about carb settings, fuel, oil, mufflers and engine clearances. Now that it is sorted out, I can concentrate on my flying - with two very nice running engines....

The Helicommand can be flown immediately, no need to run with blades off.

[Lars Linders]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKOdSL1Ioww[/ame]

Pitch:
Normal mode = full negative -3, full positive +10
Idle 1 = -12, +12
Idle 2 = -12, +12

Throttle:
Normal mode = 0 - 25 - 60
Idle 1 = 97,5 - 27,5 - 97,5 (U curve)
Idle 2 = 100 - 30 - 100 (U curve)

Do you think that my setup is good for starting?

[Azalin]

Curves looks OK to me but the pitch range +12 -12 may be a little high. Try it but if you see bog in the engine then you can lower it to +11 -11 or where your heli feels better.