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450 Class Electric Helicopters 450 Class Electric Helicopters manufactured by Align, Tarot, SYMA, Airhog, Chaos, HK and similar. |
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05-13-2012, 05:08 PM | #1 (permalink) |
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New guy attempting a 450 Clone build, need help.
Good day everyone, newer to the Heli seen, but not to RC. Planes, boats and cars and figured why not try helis. So far I am really liking it and currently own a 120sr and mcpx v2. Looking at building a clone kit and had a few questions.
These are the items I am currently looking at, are these suitable for a decent flying Heli looking to do mild aerobatics and inverted flying? Frame: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dproduct=23037 Motor: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...er_3550KV.html ESC: I am huge Hobbywing fan so any re-branded (turnigy, proton ect) hobbywing esc will work. 40 amp range is what I am looking at. Servo: I would like to try the Solar Servo's has anyone tried them yet? http://www.hobbypartz.com/solar.html I would like to try the digital metal gears, but no clue which ones/size will/would work for my application. FBL System: I am clueless on however just read a thread and the guy useing a CX-3X1000 is this OK for this build as well and where might I buy one at? I'm located in the US. RX: I was planning on using a HK 6ch Orange, is that OK or should I take my AR600 out of one of my planes? Batts: 3s 2200 Gens ace and Sky Lipo. Radio: DX8 Are the Items selected so far ok? I'm a huge Hitec servo fan love the mg65s and mg85s and I've used the HK HXT900s in some of my planes, but wanted to go digital servos metal gear but the Hitec digital metal gear aren't as pocket friendly as the Solar or other HK servo. This is just a build that I can learn on and keep in the air fairly cheaply and just practice on and not feel nervous about flying something more expensive. I fly my mcpx like I stole it, because it's so cheap to keep in the air and I'm learning so much off of it. Just stinks getting pushed around in the wind sometimes.
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-13-2012, 05:39 PM | #2 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
I have several of the ZYX fbl units/fbl heads on the 450's,& they work very well.Takes some getting used to on setting them up,but after a while it gets easier. The Tarot fbl heads are very nice-I have a couple of those,but the $15 HK fbl heads work well also-they have a bit more play & the grip bearings will need lock-tighted in-they are slightly loose. The Orange 6ch. 610 Spektrum Rx's work very well in either the fb or fbl version,& bind nicely with my DX6i Tx,& have outstanding range without a satelitte. I also have a bunch of the Sky 2200 40C lipos,& they are very good,& I am getting 6-7 min. flights for sport flying with the 2215 motors. Hope this helps a little |
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05-13-2012, 06:02 PM | #3 (permalink) |
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Hey thanks alot. Beaver Falls nice! I'm orignally from Elizabeth, Pa (just outside of Pittsburgh).
So go with the Belt drive will something like this work?: http://www.ebay.com/itm/USA-Shipping...item4165abea3a This correct?t: http://www.oomodel.com/tarot-zyx-zyx...d-p-61907.html + http://www.oomodel.com/tarot-zyx-3ax...7-p-62109.html Is the tarot better then the other one I listed? Also swap from the H2218 to the 2215H correct? Thanks!
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
05-13-2012, 06:20 PM | #4 (permalink) | |
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Elizabeth,PA.!! We were practically neighbors. Go Steelers P.S.: The Tarot unit seems to have more support-there are a couple very good threads on RC Groups site for the Tarot (& other low cost fbl units). They have already offered firmware updates,& even have a new "s" version ZYX unit which has satelitte support. The Copter-X CX unit is said to be the same unit internally & up til a few weeks ago had a better price,but they have raised it now,-but most of the users have seemed to say it flys well too. |
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05-13-2012, 08:35 PM | #5 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
Where and what motor gear should I use? Thanks again you've really been a great help and GO STEELERS!!! Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-14-2012, 08:15 AM | #6 (permalink) | |
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The forums are great with a lot of information & links to equipment,it is sometimes overwhelming trying to figure out what is best for you. There are so many variables, I can only recommend something that has worked for me. |
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05-14-2012, 12:16 PM | #7 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk 2
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-14-2012, 01:14 PM | #8 (permalink) |
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you can get the exi clone for a little more but shipping is in the USA
http://www.xheli.com/exi450.html its 70.00 in the belt or the tt version the sport version is 68.00 and the pro version with a se2 v2 head is 57.00 your ordering your servos from xheli so you could get the heli there as well just a thought the HK zyx gyro is a tarot zyx or thats what everyone that has gotten one has said some of the videos of it even says tarot on the gyro plain as day so its a decent cheap gyro get the usb cable for sure, and possibly the tarot program box
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05-15-2012, 01:50 PM | #9 (permalink) | |
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Thank you! They look good. I have a question though, what's the difference in the belt drive ones? Here's the $70: http://www.xheli.com/18h18-exi450pro-belt.html Here's the $68: http://www.xheli.com/18h17-exi450-sport.html Here's the $57: http://www.xheli.com/18h15-cf450-v3-kit.html I don't really now what the differences are between them and what the sport and pro mean? Can one of you fine gentleman shine some light on this??? Str8 newbie question I'm sorry , gotta ask to learn though. Please forgive my newness.
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-15-2012, 02:10 PM | #10 (permalink) | |
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EXI Differences
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The differences in the EXI kits are as follows: $68 EXI 450 Sport - Has a 2 piece frame, sport head and tail. I believe this is the same as Align SE. Better head and tail than the cf450 V3 but the frame is an older design. Tail servo is boom mounted vs frame mounted in the other 2. $57 EXI cf450 V3 - Has a 1 piece frame like the Pro but has a lower quality head and tail. This means no "Chinese Weights" on the tail grips and no solid links on the head. For the price, this seems like the best value and the kit that I bought. In hindsight, I wish it had bought the Pro kit. $70 EXI 450 Pro Belt - Has the upgraded Pro head and tail with the Pro 1 piece CF frames. Again, in hindsight, I would have bought this kit over the cf450 V3 because of the tail and simplified head. Didn't seem worth the $13 at the time but it does now! You can see the differences if you look closely at the pictures in their site. Hope this helps. |
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05-15-2012, 02:15 PM | #11 (permalink) | |
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How does the $70 frame compare to this frame?: http://www.ebay.com/itm/USA-Shipping...ht_4897wt_1110
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-15-2012, 04:19 PM | #12 (permalink) | |
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Looks Like the EXI Sport
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That ebay auction is cheap and the seller is in the US but I think I would still buy from Xheli because they will make any issues right. Another source that I used for my electronics is http://www.valuehobby.com/. They have the Tower Pro MG90 servos in stock and also carry Hobby Wing ESCs, motors and LiPos. Very reasonable and fast shipping. |
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05-15-2012, 05:37 PM | #13 (permalink) | |
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O yea I think I've dealt with value hobby a few times in the past. Forgot about them. I've been using the Hobbypartz Proton esc's a few times... Just re-branded hobbywings, I even use the hobbywing programming card on them. Man I love Hobbywing escs!
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-15-2012, 05:39 PM | #14 (permalink) | |
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-15-2012, 05:45 PM | #15 (permalink) |
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Whats the chances this is worth a darn? http://www.xheli.com/dy450brmoes9.html
Am I pushing my luck that this would work have decently? I could keep it flybar for a little to learn on then go to flybarless setup.
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
05-15-2012, 06:32 PM | #16 (permalink) |
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FelixTC68, can I ask a question about the frames? I'm in a similar situation to Diesel6401. Bought an mCP X V1 last year, love it, and am looking at building a 450. I'd like to go flybarless.
I'm leaning towards a 450 Sport-type kit (I've heard good things about the Tarots), primarily because I don't want a torque tube tail trying to strip gears every time I mess up with the tail. People say belt-drive is better when you're learning. I haven't really looked into the Pro kits, because of the tail drive. But I do know there are some belt-driven Pro clones, like the EXI being discussed, which would get around the tail-durability issue. From what I've gathered, the Pro head is a little better, and the frame is maybe a bit stiffer than the Sport. But besides the TT tail issue, I've also heard that the Pro frame is quite small, like it's tough to fit everything in it. And that it's also hard to fit the servos, or to work on them, etc. Have you found that to be the case? I've kind of skipped over the Pros for these reasons. Is that a mistake? I don't need a 5% stiffer frame for hardcore 3D purposes, or anything like that I want a solid machine that I can continue learning with. And this thread has been very helpful to me, thanks for the good info! If I can ask one more, I see there is a Hobbywing Pentium 40A ESC, and a Platinum 40A. I like the fact that the Platinum can output 6V, for better servo performance. But I've also seen people say you should use an external BEC, to reduce the risk of burning up your ESC. Should you not use the built-in BEC, at least on these cheaper units?
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Gaui X5, iKon, Edge 100, CC BEC Pro. Tarot 450 Pro FBL, Mini VBar, Ice Lite 50. BL mCP X, Nano QX, FrSky Taranis, iCharger 308Duo. |
05-15-2012, 06:40 PM | #17 (permalink) |
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http://www.xheli.com/60h-8918-erazor...n-rtf-24g.html
Just buy this and be done...! I almost went that route then decided I was more serious and went with a Tarot 450 pro v2 flybarless super combo ($280), but then didnt even fly the chinese electronics and went all out, hitec 5065mg, hitec 5084mg, castle phoenix ice 50, neu 1107h/2.5y 3.2, Tarot ZYX, DX7. The Tarot quality is the same as align for half the cost, Its the only clone I would suggest for serious use. BUT...The dynam will let you know if your really into helicopters without all the headache of building, programing, setting everything up correctly ect.. |
05-15-2012, 06:52 PM | #18 (permalink) | |
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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05-15-2012, 07:15 PM | #19 (permalink) |
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I had an mSR, then bought the mCP X V1 the day it came in at my LHS (I was eager to try CP). It's a fantastic learning tool, and a lot of fun. Even more so once I went brushless; now it can do a lot more. Which has let me also do more, though it's still capable of much more than I am
Good tip on the external UBEC. I did see someone mention that same suggestion. If you kill your ESC in the air, an external BEC may give you a chance to put it down with a quick auto, vs just plummeting from the sky. For something like a heli (for me, "even" a 450 is expensive; I can't imagine flying something like a 600), it would seem worth the money for an external BEC. I know everything can run on 4.8V. And many cyclic servos are OK with 6V. But tail servos that I've looked at don't seem to always list 6V. Do you sometimes need to supply a tail servo with 4.8V, in addition to 6V for cyclics? So maybe 4.8V from ESC (tail servo), and 6V from external BEC (cyclic, RX, and FBL)? Sorry for sticking my nose into your thread, Diesel6401.
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Gaui X5, iKon, Edge 100, CC BEC Pro. Tarot 450 Pro FBL, Mini VBar, Ice Lite 50. BL mCP X, Nano QX, FrSky Taranis, iCharger 308Duo. |
05-15-2012, 09:19 PM | #20 (permalink) | |
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I've had good luck with the Hifei esc's as well. They really run strong. The throttle sensitivity is not as good as on the hobbywing (at least the boat esc's aren't), but they run really strong. The make a air esc w/ build in data logging that I really want to try, especially since I already have the usb link. If I can get good reliability and built--in data logging without CC Ice prices that would be sweet. http://www.himodel.com/electric/HIFE...ESC-40A-K.html And no problem sticking your nose in this thread. We're here for the same thing. Have any questions feel free to ask, and I'm sure one of these fine gentleman will help you out just as they've been helping me. Thought I would share. Here's my RC Photobucket: http://s1238.photobucket.com/profile/Diesel6401 Here's my RC Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/diesel64...e=results_main
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YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/Diesel6401 Pics: http://s1238.photobucket.com/home/Diesel6401 Fleet: B450X, Trex 500ESP FBL, EXI450Pro FB, HK250GT (building), B120SR (sold), mCPx-V2(sold) |
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