Support for Hobbywing Platinum Series V4 160A ?

[enterprise7]

Wonderful. I am assuming we will need a firmware update both for the jlog 2.6 and the HW V4 ESCs?

[dl7uae]

For JLog this will be anyway a new firmware, more specifically 10 new firmwares per type of JLog, - 8 telemetry systems each, HoTT and SPEKTRUM double (HoTT: GAM/ESC, SPEKTRUM: old/new displays).

V4 ESC: HBW will provide a new firmware after finishing everything between them and me/us(R2). One will need an appropriate USB interface to be able to reflash his ESC. That is HBW's Program Box.

Btw: PWM was not included. I asked for, and now we have it also, protocol redefined.

[dl7uae]

Could just spend an hour to process last changes in protocol v1.1. Flashed another firmware to the HBW V4 60A, changed implementation in JLog.



You can see "current" straight maintaining the invention of the Arabs: zero.
No idea if there is already a current sensor in the ESC, shunt or Hall effect sensor.

Yesterday I had a longer fight with Excel to find a formula for temperature conversions. Getting the digital representation (ADC output) of a resistance value (NTC thermal resistor) from the ESC. They (HBW) have not the processor/process time for the conversion to °C, JLog's microcontroller does not have the space in ROM/RAM for the conversion lookup table the manufacturer of the NTC provides us with. So I made a formula for that. Still ROM/RAM eating but not that much as a lookup table.

So we get:
Ubat battery voltage ..... --> Ubat alarm threshold
Imot current .................. --> Imot integrated, mAh, JLog alarm threshold on it ........ currently at zero
2-pole-normalized rpm.. --> pole# applied ->RPM, ratio applied->RPMrotor
throttle .......................... 0..100% (minimum value depends on flight mode) .. (screenshot: flight mode: heli, direct)
PWM ............................ 0..100%
tFET ............................. temperature of the power FETs, JLog alarm threshold on it
tCAP ............................ temperature of the low ESR caps (in place of tBEC or... - will see)

The behavior is the same as w/ Platinum v3 and Hifei KingKong III Pro: Data output only when the motor is driven (commutation). Output stops if motor is not spinning.
Had to change the state machine of JLog already to be able to deal w/ that (warmstart, alarm and min/max handling, LogStop).

Now I turn to a special single-shot datagram sent in transition to no commutation.
Afterwards I have to integrate acquired data into JLog's data processing for alarming, logging and output to all the telemetry systems.

So... it's in progress.

[Raptorapture]

Wow! A lot of work Tom. Might consider this ESC in future due to your work

[dl7uae]

OK but please note:

I do not want to have any influence on the decision for an ESC! Also I have no basis to make recommendations, at least no more than from the perspective of data delivery.

[dl7uae]

Oops.. wrong thread.

[dl7uae]

Finished and tested it principally. For now in one firmware only: JLog 2.6, HBWv4, JETI telemetry.

Some colorful wallpaper.

"Current" is a fake: pwm/4.3

There are so called "JLog-own" sensors connected to JLog besides the V4 60A, our HV²BEC (26..76(or more )V in, 5.6...10V out, limited to 50A out (continuously, could do more ) - and our CVS16 (an intelligent voltage monitor for up to 16S LiPo packs or 16 single voltages). Interface is the "data bus" of JLog, I²C. We read Ubec, Ibec, tBEC from the HV²BEC, and cell/pin voltages, total pack voltage, several alarms etc from the CVS16. Total pack voltage replaces Ubat (from the V4) if the CVS16 saw a cell pack and reported it to JLog.

Wallpaper #1: Dummy load on HV²BEC and no cell pack on CVS16.
Wallpaper #2: HV²BEC: Same es above. CVS16: connected to a 6S cell pack, TPV (6S) replacing Ubat from the ESC (on a 25V power supply)
mAh: JLog cumulates both, from ESC/motor and HV²BEC

Although I made it already for the HBWv3 and HiFei KK3, - it was rather tricky regarding JLog's state machine because loss of ESC data protocol commonly means main battery replacement, ESC went off during that, so --> warm start.
Ubat and tFET are maintained in log and telemetry if data stream stops due to no motor spinning. All other values (5 more plus data derived from it) go to zero.
Log: With "LogStop" enabled (standard) you will notice gaps only in the course of time stamps.

Gaps: The ESC has the same behavior as the V3 and Hifei KK3: Data stream stops if motor not spinning. Don't like.. So what..

Now I'm awaiting answer on some questions I have to HBW:
- How about "current"? Do the V4 hardware have a current sensor already?
- What are the plans for the V3 hardware? Will the firmware be upgraded to the V4 protocol or stay on the protocol we currently have w/ V3?

Regardless of the answer I will now extend the configurator JLC for another ESC, HBWv4, - the HBWv3, already existing in JLC, will stay: different protocol, option to use a "foreign" current sensor (HiTec C200 Hall core).
Implementation in firmwares for other telemetry systems as well as for JLog 2.5 and 2 will happen if I got answer on my questions.

If everything will be finished from my end, - firmwares and their deployment (downloaders), JLC and online manual (English this time - as for Hifei KK3 ), - HobbyWing has the final step: deployment of the final version of their new ESC firmware(s).

Will keep you informed. I know, many of you are waiting for it.

[NC_2_VA]

Awesome work. There will be 2 HBW 160s in my future.

[Danny Dugger]

Nice

[dl7uae]

All PL xxx V4 have a current sensor (different ones) except of the 60A currently.
(Asked them about their plans of possibly adding a current sensor to PL 60A V4. If the answer will be NO (perhaps a question of space in that ESC - besides product strategy) we (R2) have to think about the same option as for V3: C200 or another external current sensor.)

There will be no change in protocol on the V3 - so we will just support both, V4 considered as a different ESC.

[enterprise7]

If the HW 60A does not have a amp sensor, how does it figure out capacity?

[dl7uae]

Consumption accumulation is anyway JLog's job based on current and time.

It can not w/o a current sensor, unless JLog offers an external one which can used for that. The V3 hardware has generally no current sensor. Here we offer the option to use a HiTec C200 Hall core to measure current. I'm just modifying the new firmware to be able to use a C200 as option, - useful w/ V4 only if it is a 60A, of course.

I had been surprised that the PL 60A V4 that I use to implement, current always returns to zero. HBW gives me now an 80A to get to see real measured current.

So current (and mAh) in my screenshots above is a fake. Imot=pwm/4.3 , just to be able to check the mAh accumulation and calibration ("Imot shunt").

[enterprise7]

Good to know there is that option. I run Jeti, and a MUI 75 is easier to setup for me. I have a 160A as well and will be taking advantage of your good work.

[Codepox]

If telemetry is only available when the motor is running, does it means that there is no way to get at least the battery voltage unless the motor starts spinning?
Is Hobbywing planning to change this in a future release?

[dl7uae]

No, will not be changed for now..

It's the same w/ V3 and also Hifei KK3 does that.

All numbers go to zero if motor stops spinning - except of: Ubat (last battery voltage) and tFET (last FET temperature) and tCAP (last temp of the low ESR caps). JLog puts them on hold. I do it that way in telemetry and log. (tCAP not offered in a telemetry)

All other date items can go to zero I think: throttle, pwm, rpm, Imot (current), - they are anyway zero already.

Live data could come from our CVS16 (cell voltages and total pack voltage replaces Ubat from ESC) and HV²BEC. From the built-in BEC is anyway no data coming.

[dl7uae]

Go a little above throttle idle, just for a fraction of a second, and you'll have your voltage. Sample & hold so to speak.

[Codepox]

Does blipping the throttle works if you are in Throttle Hold?
Or do you have to take the heli out of Throttle Hold?

[dl7uae]

It wouldn't work in throttle hold, of course.

The last voltage seen is hold by JLog, in the telemetry display.
You want to update the voltage in that load-free situation?

Well, with these ESCs (HBW v3 and v4, Hifei KK3) who do send data only during commutation - is no monitoring in between.
So that would need another sensor connected to JLog - continuously delivering data. For main voltage our CVS16 could be that alternative/add-on. CVS is more than a cell voltage sensor, it is an intelligent device monitoring the health of cell packs - or just only reading up to 16 single voltages 0..78V.

-----
If we speak about updating the voltage display (data item from ESC, sampe&hold ) before take off, motor at standstill, - yes, that would need to leave throttle hold just for the fraction of a second. The ESC needs to see a throttle pulse length forcing em to spool up, at least to start that, but we'll stop it immediately again.

[Codepox]

It is nice to know the battery voltage as soon as the battery is connected.
Taking the Heli out of throttle hold on the bench to check the battery voltage is not exactly recommended.
The all point of having the ESC send the telemetry is that we don't need sensors anymore so the wiring is a lot simpler.
Too bad they don't send the telemetry all the time.

[Raptorapture]

Seems silly.