next heli (bigger) thoughts and opinion

[apriliamille]

hi all. been cutting my teeth the past few months on a 450 and the evil twin is whispering (bigger bigger)
originally i was thinking trex 500 all the way but then i decided to think out side the box and kool aid and starting looking at the protos and outrage 550 and possibly the hc500. eliminated the gaui and the vibe. here are my thoughts and please add to or correct them so i can work on an informed decision on payday. i did a crash cost analysis and the 3 are plus minus 10 bucks not counting blades. batts not an issue i can series my plane batts for either size

trex 500
+ parts parts parts. did i mention i can get parts anywhere
+ upgradeability
- EVERYBODY has one or so it seams. what can i say, im a punk flying airtronics in a sea of red jr shirts at the field

Protos
+ man it is just plain cool points
+ differant platform (in my opinion im learning and doing align gears motor mounts servo placement etc etc. why not see something differant. hope that makes sense)
- watched build videos. to me, im not sure how to explain it. as peices were being assembled it just seamed light fragile and well "plasticy" durability?
+- parts ??? availability

outrage 550
+- havent seen a bunch about it but it sure sparks my curiousity
+ when i watched the build videos it seamed to have more metal/durability (see my protos comment) it also appealed to me for some un explainable reason
+ between 500-600 class
+- parts?? availabiity

any feed back and thoughts would be appreciated

[Chanq]

It depends on your style of flying. The T500 is a very good machine, very good power/weight ratio, not very expensive and it simply flies great. Problems: No big one's. Same for the Protos except the fact that it is even faster so you have to be an intermediate pilot to be able to use all that extra power.

The Outrage is a different story. It is bigger and therefore better (generally). It flies bigger, is more stable but also more expensive. It also has a lot of power with a 6S power train. The problem I read about it were indeed parts availability.

If you can afford it I would go for the Outrage. I just love the bigger birds and how they fly. I have had a T500 too and it was a great machine but I like my T600 more.

[wolfdown]

Building my O550 now ... everythings been smooth mostly, except mistakes I made. The sales people have even sent me a few replacement parts (upgraded tail pully,screws,washer) that I either lost or messed up FREE of charge.
I don't have anything else to compare it too, but all the parts look top quality. There are a few steps in the directions that you definitely want to watch a video before hand, or just double, triple check everything before adding loctite.

I only have had three build excursions:

I had to file out the hole on the frames for the frame saver tab mounts. not sure why this was undersized. Lot of people are mentioning this, so you need a round file.

The guide pins in my rotor center hub were not straight, and I had to bend a couple times to get the wash out base to fit without binding. Maybe it was just back luck on my end, cause i haven't seen anyone else mention it.

Other point are that one of factory assembled bell crank arm's bearings were loose and had some slop, and I had to CA them back in place. (I tried green loctite but the press fit wasn't tight enough)

I think these are pretty minor (or just one-offs). Seems like everyone else will tell you this thing is FUN to fly. You can check helidirect.com, rremodels.com, and rchover.com for part availability.

[apriliamille]

thanks for the thoughts. my order of merit list just got jumbled. didnt realize the cermark promo ended heh, atleast when i decide to do things i project it for payday x to give me time to think and simmer and ask around about it. now the price is back to normalcy the outrage looks like its going to creep up the list for me
bigger is better eh?

[superjoe83]

Originally Posted by apriliamille

bigger is better eh?

depends on how much you crash, if you can keep the spinny side out of the dirt, then yes, bigger is better

[Andy01]

Consider the Atom 500 - not as good parts availability as Align, but no upgrades required and a better quality heli than most. Very durable, and if you buy the parts from the right place, they are cheaper than either Trex 500 or Protos. There may be a few cheap kits floating around after the recent US discounting otherwise buy from Alien-RC with free post (at least the last time I looked it was).

Colin

[iAdam]

Many folks around here selling off their Align 500's for a Protos, Cheap and available parts and just gobs of power. Lightweight and quiet. Not sure what else folks would want.

[Jermo]

Ask a few questions then look around.
1. Can you fly nitro? more flight time is always better in my humble opinion.
2. Are you comparing purchase costs or repair costs? I'd suggest repair costs to be more important than purchase cost because this is what will add to the TOTAL cost of ownership over the life of the model.
3. Do you want a disposable model or something that will last as long as you maintain it?

If you're a hot 3D pilot you might want a hot setup with CF frames..etc, otherwise you may want to consider something with polymer frames that will stand up to the typical bumps and bruises beginners have.

Two good candidates in my opinion are the Thunder Tiger Titan 50 and the Audacity Pantera 50.

Both can be had used in good condition at different times. Are durable and have been proven at the field.

If you can't go nitro I'd at least look at a model with the same general characteristics. I fly the align trex 450. At $100 for HALF frames I don't want to crash. Pantera frame set is only $30 (just to give you an idea).

Thunder Tiger Raptor Titan info with overview
http://www.tiger.com.tw/product/4853-K.html

Audacity Pantera 50 info with overview and comparisons
http://www.genesishobby.com/Products...1/Default.aspx

[Doug Darby]

I started with a 450 and then went to a 600 and although I have a 500 too, I just love and gravitate back to the 600 all the time. But that is just me...

[Slyster]

Originally Posted by Jermo

Ask a few questions then look around.
1. Can you fly nitro? more flight time is always better in my humble opinion.

I don't get this one. When I go to the field I often bring all 18 lipos. That's a lot of stick time.. more than I could usually ever get in. Compare today's lipo prices at 25 to 50 cents per flight to the 3$ to 6$ per fligh for nitro! WOW! Save all the hundreds and hundreds for spare parts.

[Jermo]

The biggest difference comparing electric to nitro is paying up front vs paying as you go for fuel. I've also not seen an electric yet that will give 20minutes min for sport flying

To be clear flight time stops when your skids touch the ground.

[Slyster]

Originally Posted by Jermo

The biggest difference comparing electric to nitro is paying up front vs paying as you go for fuel.

Yes nitro is great, but 10X more expensive.. nearly.

Considering one $43.00 lipo gives my 6s 500ESP 100 flights that's $.43 per flight.. and a comparable nitro would be like $4.30... well maybe not that much I dunno.

[Jermo]

consider your 18 packs at $43 cost $774 up front (yeah..I know you don't have to get that many) AND if you taco a pack you're done. With Nitro prices are all over the place.

I guess I'm basing this on my experience as a new pilot with <4 years recently going to Nitro. I went through the same questions and process.

At the end of the day pay as you go 15-20min+ flight time won out. So initial lower cost with longer flight times compared to higher up front costs and shorter flight times.

[eightythree]

100 cycles on lipos?? HA!

Nitro is a pay as you go thing.. no need to be afraid of it. just fuel and fly

[Slyster]

100 cycles on lipos?? HA!

What does that mean? I get more than that.. that's a minimum. Sure the RPM's fade slowly.. but not that much by 100 cycles.

[apriliamille]

yikes turning into an electric vs nitro thread
i turned away from nitro just about a year ago after i got my first 2.4 tx and i accidentally flooded a tt46 in my plane and spewed glow fuel all over my tx which i stupidly had sitting right next to the exhaust. after 2 or so hours of alcholo and q tips i immediately dumped my glow inventory and went electric. still have my gassers though. i love my big planes way too much. ive also got a decent investment into lipo and a123 charging abilities. would sadden me as well to go to the glow after the charger and deep cell and psu investments

jermo. i calculated repair costs based off some items having two componants
not including frames and blades i came up with main gear feather shafts main shafts a main gear and tail boom landing gear
outrage 46.67 trex 500 48.51 protos 47.67

initial costs that i figured (considering i have 4x 821(outrage cyclic) servos and 2 5085mg needing one more for protos trex sup pkg has servos)
ladamz made a comment that had me thinking (hmm maybe others are onto something)

i was really looking towards the protos. but my very first copter was a dumb venture with a hobby city one as i kept snapping stupid plastic parts on it while assembling and tuning the swash. so i see the plastic parts on the protos and i haunt myself from past. but note i only seen the protos video builds so i really cant judge i guess the quality of the parts. no one really flies helis here so i dont have much to look at and compare to.

i appreciate the input it is helping me

[Jermo]

I could be wrong but I'm not sure those are the same class of helicoptor but figure in the cost of main and tail blades.

Most of my repairs when learning were blades shafts and landing gear. I think I only ever needed 1 main gear and 3 tailbooms.

I had alot of crashes that were just mainblades and feathering shafts, however, I changed frames at least 4 times. At $100 a HALF on the 450 it got expensive fast. That was with me using CA and old frame parts to glue cracks. Now I don't crash often so it's blades and shafts.

As far as Nitro vs Electric I'm just starting in Nitro. After doing the math the number one thing I need to progress as a pilot is stick time. I chose to go nitro because if i take a year off it has less impact than with electric battery storage and potential loss or weakening of the packs. nitro you can just use fogging oil in /on the motor and all metal parts, hang it in the shed and forget about it until you need it.

*shrug*... I don't believe there's ONE right answer for anyone. Just different strenghts of each.

[Jermo]

And a comment about "stupid plastic parts"

Not all plastic is created equal so don't be quick to dismiss something just because it's plastic. I had the same opinion when I started (eflite blade cx..what a toy ). Now I know better.

[Jaguar_5]

If you're looking for a 500 size heli, personally the only two on the market I would consider are the Atom 500 and Protos. I ended up with the Atom, you'll love either.

If you can afford a 600, do it.

Just my .02

[theturd]

May be I am dreaming, but it should be critical that the mfg consider other power systems such as gasoline... People criticize that the power is not there, but it is important to remember we said that about the electrics early on. There is a learning curve with any product and any system.

Currently, we are seeing fuel consumption rate is about 1/2 between a glow and a gas (with comparable "PLANK" result). When glow drinks 1 gallon, the gas power system will have only drank 1/2 gallon of gas to provide similar power. However the gasoline engine is heavier. Comparison is between a 110 2C vs 28cc gas. This translates to $20 of gas => $300 of glow fuel savings!

Now, knowing this will surely help the heli mfg push for higher goals and threasholds.